Messerschmitt Me 410A-1/U4

[Krusty]

Doesn't work that way frank. If you're CLOSE enough and can actually hit with the 40mms of a hurr2 they'll do damage, but that's still 200d range, whereas the 50mm gun was like 1.5k range. No comparison.

And he means the Ju88. You (a bomber person) of all people should know the Ju88s are fast as hell in AH

[Krusty]

Originally posted by lasersailor184
Not only that, but the dual 40mm's on the Hurricane are AP rounds.  Basically, really really big bullets.  They do not explode on contact.  Nor are they insta kill shots on Buffs.

You are incorrect here. They were NOT really big bullets. Bullets are solid-core rounds that do damage from kinetic energy. They hit stuff, that stuff gets holes in it. The 40mms on Hurr2Ds are cannon rounds. They are shaped and designed to penetrate armor BEFORE exploding, but explode they do, and that is where their energy comes from (chemical energy as opposed to kinetic).

I believe you are right that they did not necessarily explode on contact, and would not be instant kills on bombers.

In AH however they still do massive damage. Land one near the fuselage and an f4u will instantly explode, that much I've seen while playing around with them.

[EagleDNY]

Originally posted by lasersailor184
Thank god you're not a sniper, because you're way off mark.

The Hurricane definately had more then 300 built, I'll dig up the numbers again, but 1500 sticks out in my mind.

Not only that, but the dual 40mm's on the Hurricane are AP rounds.  Basically, really really big bullets.  They do not explode on contact.  Nor are they insta kill shots on Buffs.  They don't even kill 100% of the time against fighters.

The Hurricane can catch all the buffs easily with the exception of the Ju87.  The 87 actuall moves pretty fast.


But of course you are speaking from experience, right?  That's how you can come out and make all these statements, right?

Here's a couple of links to some hurricane production figures - of the 8,600 or so Hurricanes built in Britain during the war, only 296 are listed as type IID's.  I wasn't saying that there were only 300 or so hurricanes built, I was saying the 40mm vickers armed variant was only a relatively rare model.  

One of the arguments against the 410/50mm variant was that it was only used in a small number of aircraft, so I was trying to compare the "relatively rare" 40mm cannon armed hurricane to total production and show another AH aircraft type that was available although rare during the war.  

Links:
http://www.k5083.mistral.co.uk/APS.HTM
http://www.jaapteeuwen.com/ww2aircraft/html%20pages/hawker%20hurricane.htm

EagleDNY
PS: try reading the whole post

[republic]

The 410 would be awesome...especially with the U4 package with the 50 mm BK5 cannon  

....but the U2 two 20mm MG 151/20 cannon package would work too.

[Krusty]

Ugh, Republic dude, you need to leave dead thread as they were -- dead.

You've been resurrecting dead threads from years ago, and quite frequently. At this stage of their lives, they are meant for information. They are meant for linking to. However it might be better to post a new thread and reference the old one rather than just reply to the old one.


Hope that helps.

[zorstorer]

Originally posted by Krusty
Ugh, Republic dude, you need to leave dead thread as they were -- dead.

You've been resurrecting dead threads from years ago, and quite frequently. At this stage of their lives, they are meant for information. They are meant for linking to. However it might be better to post a new thread and reference the old one rather than just reply to the old one.


Hope that helps.

Look at it this way...at least he searched for it

[republic]

Originally posted by Krusty

Sometimes you just can't win...  You start a new post, you get griped at, you dig up an old post you get griped at...

[Krusty]

Well sometimes folks are upset that something has been requested a billion times.

I hope my reply in this thread wasn't too harsh. I think in this situation (a plane that's been requested very frequently) it would be best to start a new thread and give links to the older threads (if they're greater than 3 months old) and sort of say "See, it's been requested this many times, we should have it".

[republic]

no problem Krusty, each forum seems to have it's own etiquette about old posts, I'm still fairly new to posting here. (Long time lurker)

I had just rewatched something I recorded from long ago about the 410 and didn't see any recent posts about it.  With the attention to detail AH gives to each plane, the idea of a 110 replacement or really....anything new...makes me drool  

[Scherf]

Actually, I'm glad the thread was resurrected, as I now have to retract my earlier statements, since the fellow who runs this site:

http://www.gyges.dk/

recently found an original German document listing KG 51 and its Me 410s in a Wilde Sau Order of Battle.

Details are here:

http://www.gyges.dk/Wilde%20Sau%20Frankrig.htm

So, night-fighters (as opposed to Intruders) after all, though still without radar.

[Treize69]

Still like to see a 210/410, but after watching this, I don't think I'd fly it unless I had no choice.

Much like the real pilots...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xk4Aiscs3jM&mode=related&search=

[Krusty]

FYI: All those instability problems were with the 210. They gloss it over, but the 410 was a total redesign of the wing and other areas. A totally new airframe. Like the 109F over the 109E.

[Treize69]

Quiet you, I just wanted it added so I have something else to feed to my P-51.

[wstpt10]

Originally posted by *NDM*JohnnyX
Then why all the versions of Spitfires and 109s?

Because they actually had an impact on the war?

Don't get me wrong, the 410 would be a lot of fun. But questioning why we have so many Spitfires and 109s is lunacy.