Author Topic: CH Product review (with pics, long read) (Read 1897 times)

Murdr · « **Reply #15 on:** November 15, 2006, 12:15:04 AM »

I cant fly with both hands up that high...not very ergonomic...

LTDMonte · « **Reply #16 on:** November 15, 2006, 01:36:26 AM »

thanx for the review....i am ordering a trakir in about 3 days as i feel views are a major prob for me....i am thinking of a yoke style flight stick anyone with experience or thoughts on these......the reason i am thinking of a yoke style stick is i am a heavy handed person and it transfers to my flying

airspro · « **Reply #17 on:** November 15, 2006, 02:35:16 AM »

Where are your elbow rests at ???? Also how do you keep your pedals in one spot all the time ???? I think of shooting like you would do at a rife match in the prone postion , as locked down as you can get it .

Look close I have a hand rest on my combat stick to make it easier to reach the top 8 way .

Question : Does the fighter sticks have "two" 8 way hats ? I sure would like to use that bottom left one as that one is in a perfect spot , but on my stick it's only a 4 way

Auger · « **Reply #18 on:** November 15, 2006, 12:25:34 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Clutz
Auger, the 8-way view key on the throttle works great, but it sure seems stressful on my thumb. Has this happened to you, or anybody else???? It started off as a blister, then turned into a callus. This doesn't bother me, but it seems now that after only 4 or 5 months using it, the joint in my thumb is starting to become stressed. It's trying to grab the oblique views that is so hard to do without having to apply a lot of force. It is somewhat better now that the switch is broken in some, but it took using up the joint in my thumb to get it that way.

I have been wanting to ask you guys about this for a while now. I guess I am wondering if this is the typical case with the CH throttle, then what throttle would be more user friendly.TY Clutz.

I haven't had any problems with my left thumb. It's been about 9 months now, and I fly for at least 2 hours a night on average. How firmly are you gripping the throttle? I usually just rest my hand on it so that my finger tips can reach the front buttons (which are mapped for vox and WEP). My thumb tends to rest on the mini-stick, or between there and the hat.

It sounds like you are using way too much pressure on the hat. Try using just enough pressure to hold the hat in position. Also, I tend to use the sides and tip of my thumb to push the hat from the side instead of pressing on it and dragging it.

Hap · « **Reply #19 on:** November 15, 2006, 03:30:54 PM »

Nomak, just been using CH. Bought a yoke. It's cool and wonderful for buff runs. I love the CH Throttle and pedals too though I've not adjusted yet to rudder pedals fully.

Regards,

hap

Nomak · « **Reply #20 on:** November 15, 2006, 06:24:37 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by hitech
Nomak: Fix for your short thumb. I use your exact setup.

Map the views to the lower left hat button. Is in a much better place to reach.

HiTech

My issue there is that its a 4 way switch. I need 8 for how I use/set up views.

Dave

Nomak · « **Reply #21 on:** November 15, 2006, 06:27:58 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Balsy
Or better yet Get Track IR, and never thumb a hat switch again for a view.

Nomak.. your starting over anyhow... grab the TIR 4 with vector.

I use my hatswitches for auto level, zooming in and out, trim, engine start, gear up/down, flaps

everything BUT my views.

Highly recommend the combo of CH gear and TIR.

Balsy

I have trackir3 pro with vector. I use it when I fly Falcon and Lock On. I did try it with AH and I just dont care for it. The AH view system is IMO so good that its just not necessairy.

Thx for the thought

Dave

Nomak · « **Reply #22 on:** November 15, 2006, 06:31:37 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Murdr
I cant fly with both hands up that high...not very ergonomic...

The chair I use sits very high. You may notice that my pedals are "Shimmed" up by my Klipsch Sub. My elbows rest on the chairs arm rests. I have no probs with the position <---Shrug>.

Your set up on the other hand looks a bit "Custom"

Dave

GunnerCAF · « **Reply #23 on:** November 15, 2006, 08:01:00 PM »

Nomak,

Nice review! Grimm has a CH setup. He did an easy mod on the 4-ways to turn them into 8-ways. He used my dremel to take the corners off a plastic disk under the hat that allows restricts the movement of the hat.

I have a Cougar, and the handles are about the same size. I also use the lower hat for views.

Many things I buy, I will opt for the inexpensive products, and just replace them when they get old. Like I buy $20 keyboards, then replace them when they get dirty

But in joysticks, I think the higher quality sicks like the CH are well worth it, and adds to the flight sim experiance.

Gunner

Balsy · « **Reply #24 on:** November 16, 2006, 06:52:14 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Nomak
I have trackir3 pro with vector. I use it when I fly Falcon and Lock On. I did try it with AH and I just dont care for it. The AH view system is IMO so good that its just not necessairy.

Thx for the thought

Dave

Nomak,

Im interested to hear what it is in AH you find that is lacking with TIR? I can get every view you can save in the AH viewing system (around the seat etc).

So what is it you feel is missing?

Balsy

HomeBoy · « **Reply #25 on:** November 16, 2006, 07:42:58 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Balsy
Im interested to hear what it is in AH you find that is lacking with TIR?

I switched to TIR about six months ago after 10+ years of using POV in AH. It was an adjustment for sure. For me, the biggest issue is getting all the sensitivity curves adjusted right. The defaults are way too tame (for me) and it left me with a little of a negative impression at first. Once I got everything set right though, to me, flying without TIR would be like using a mouse instead of HOTAS.

I do know several guys who have TIR and do not use it. One of the guys gets sick because of the movement. Another guy claims that TIR distorts the view so that it messes up his gunnery and won't use it because of that. I just don't believe that! He's convinced though and won't use it. I know of another guy who won't use TIR because he says its too slow and he loses SA because he can't view around as fast with TIR as he can with POV. That is a valid point I guess but I personally think because the movement with TIR is fluid, that helps my SA more than snapping to the vairous views. Once you start down that road however, it becomes just a matter of taste I think.

So, this is not a cut and dried issue. There are guys who will line up on both sides of this fence. Some of the issues are valid and some (IMO) are questionable.

bsdaddict · « **Reply #26 on:** November 16, 2006, 08:34:57 AM »

I just got a full CH setup (FS,PT,PP) about 3 weeks ago. Still getting used to it. The FS is smooth as butter. 8-way hat on FS is a bit of a stretch, so I use the 8-way on the PT for views. As I get used to "looking around" with my left hand I'm liking it better than using my right, it's easy to keep my view locked on someone regardless of how I'm throwing the stick around. Biggest adjustment is to the pedals. Still have to think "right foot forward..." That'll come with time. All in all I'm very satisfied with my purchase ($280ish from provantage).

edit - I don't use the CH software. should I and why? also haven't found a good use for the mini-stick on the PT. who uses that and for what?

stantond · « **Reply #27 on:** November 16, 2006, 11:23:28 AM »

I used the CH software for a while. When I read you can turn on the gun camera by pressing the fire button, I thought... Cool!! So, off I went and learned to program the stick. Turns out, its not that useful and the 5 seconds before you fire is much more valuable than the 10 seconds after firing. Setting up a 'trim' button was another one of those ideas that really sounded good on paper. Yet another good idea on paper was having WEP come on in the last 10% of throttle travel. Some real life ideas just don't translate well to a virtual environment, of course YMMV. I found the stick configuration software in AH to be all that's needed, plus there's no extra software to load! Maybe for a game other than AH the CH software would be really useful.

One idea I haven't implemented is having the pilot head position move after a POV button has been held down for more than a few seconds. I suspect that wouldn't be very useful either, certainly not in a dogfight. I guess I'm on the fence about Track IR. If there were a demo to fiddle with at CompUSA (BestBuy, etc) I'd me more certain, one way or the other.

Regards,

Malta

Krusty · « **Reply #28 on:** November 16, 2006, 12:06:16 PM »

I opened my MS Sidewinder up last night, trying to splice old CH analog pedals into the pots.

Guess what I found?

NO POTS!

THAT is why these things are great. Pots break down, give bad signals, etc etc. They also move, which helps break things down faster.

The stick is on a spring, in the top half of the base. At the bottom of the stick are 2 lights/LEDs/sensors. They hover over a light sensor on the silicon board directly underneath them. They are space about 3mm apart. So by twisting, pushing, and pulling the stick, these lights move in different ways that the sensor picks up and it knows "ahhh.. you're pushing left!" (and so forth). The throttle is the same, 2 more LEDs that swing up and down to the side of the light sensor. I'm guessing it notices them on top of the other two (different colors, maybe?).

Smashingly brilliant idea for a design. Unfortunately I couldn't splice the rudder pedals into it!!!

Oh, P.S. there's about 20-30 signatures molded on the inside of the bottom plate. No idea who they are (chief designers?) but kinda cool

airspro · « **Reply #29 on:** November 16, 2006, 02:58:15 PM »

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I know of another guy who won't use TIR because he says its too slow and he loses SA because he can't view around as fast with TIR as he can with POV.

That's why I sent mine back . I found that I could get the very best rear view with my thumb alot faster than with track ir , I had the 4 model . I also didn't much care to were a hat , even if open toped

.

I did like it in Flight Sim 2004 etc .

For me it was ok but after 6 years , I think of my right thumb and left index finger as my vitural neck

Balsy

Quote

So what is it you feel is missing?

It's not as fast to get the best view . Not knocking it , it's a nice peice of hardware . I did have the victor4 model . I hope you understand what I mean , yes it's fast but to get the last little bit of view took alot more time for me than just moving the hat switch to the bottom postion and I had that maped . Now for say Il2 that Track IR would be better as it doesn't save your views . It's still good , really was fun to fly with , but not to fight with for me at least .

Nomak

Quote

I have trackir3 pro with vector. I use it when I fly Falcon and Lock On

I been on the fence to get it to use any other sim but NOT AH as you state it's really not needed here imo . 3 plus vector is the cheapest option , do u feel u miss out not having 4 model ?

Krusty

I told you the only way your gonna get those pedals to work in Winxp is to by a another "pot" joystick , get a reall CHEAP one CH or Thrustmaster one and then just put that joystick under you desk to gather dust .