A hypothetical question for the crowd regarding kills landed messages...

[mtnman]

Obviously it's not up to me, but I wish somehow the scoring system promoted the fight more then it promoted timidness.

What could be done differently to reduce timidness, but not promote recklessness in the process?  IMO, a bunch of reckless opponents is just as unsatisfying as a bunch of timid opponents.

[Guppy35]

What could be done differently to reduce timidness, but not promote recklessness in the process?  IMO, a bunch of reckless opponents is just as unsatisfying as a bunch of timid opponents.

Define "reckless"

[Lusche]

Caring about K/D - or not caring about "dying" can both be taken to extremes and produce some horrible gameplay.

One extreme is hovering at 25k gor hours, extending for 5 sectors before coming back to pick - The opposite end are Lancstucas, bomb'n'bailers, suicide porkers & landgrab hordes that don't care about K/D or about score at all. Where, on both scales, "unhealthy" gameplay starts is unfortunately not clearly to define. 100 players, 100 opinions.

Reagrding to "it's all the fault of having a score system" - the K/D factor withing score system is often vastly  overrated, mostly by players not flying for score

 

[FALCONWING]

I do not wish to speak for Hitech nor do i pretend that i do...

BUT if I was the developer I would look at a thread like this and the others that criticize other aspects of the game and go nuts. 

I would consider banning the guys who have tons of problems with the game for a few months and see how grateful they were when they came back....I don't think the community at large would miss them a bit..the bbs might....

This is a great game as it exists...tons of folks enjoy it....let it go guys....

The truth is 90% of the folks who fly/pay for the game never visit these forums because they like it...

First the problem was spits...then la-7s...then 51's...then spit16's....then any LW plane...then megasquads....then hordes....then missions....then maps...then arena size....now its landed successfully messages???????

Holy crap....when will it end?  Seriously.......getting pathetic....

What if....the problem isn't the game or game design but it's you...seriously in other aspects of my life when i find myself up against the popular opinion (church council, business boards, Sport teams), I have to sit  back and ask myself maybe its me and not them...why do the majority disagree with me or at least not seem to have enough of a problem to raise a fuss???

[grizz441]

I do not wish to speak for Hitech nor do i pretend that i do...

BUT if I was the developer I would look at a thread like this and the others that criticize other aspects of the game and go nuts. 

I would consider banning the guys who have tons of problems with the game for a few months and see how grateful they were when they came back....

You would make a great tyrant.

[FALCONWING]

You would make a great tyrant.

You would make a great serf

[Guppy35]

I do not wish to speak for Hitech nor do i pretend that i do...

BUT if I was the developer I would look at a thread like this and the others that criticize other aspects of the game and go nuts. 

I would consider banning the guys who have tons of problems with the game for a few months and see how grateful they were when they came back....I don't think the community at large would miss them a bit..the bbs might....

This is a great game as it exists...tons of folks enjoy it....let it go guys....

The truth is 90% of the folks who fly/pay for the game never visit these forums because they like it...

First the problem was spits...then la-7s...then 51's...then spit16's....then any LW plane...then megasquads....then hordes....then missions....then maps...then arena size....now its landed successfully messages???????

Holy crap....when will it end?  Seriously.......getting pathetic....

What if....the problem isn't the game or game design but it's you...seriously in other aspects of my life when i find myself up against the popular opinion (church council, business boards, Sport teams), I have to sit  back and ask myself maybe its me and not them...why do the majority disagree with me or at least not seem to have enough of a problem to raise a fuss???

Not sure if this is aimed at me Falc, but I didn't leave the game for a couple months because of the game.  You'll note there was no "I'm leaving cause it sucked" post from me.  It had all to do with a little guy who needed his Dad focused in on him and I realized I didn't have the time or the energy to put into AH.  Now that he's on a decent sleep schedule and some of the other stuff around him has slowed down, dad has time to play again.  Not as much, but enough to have fun

And I'd hardly consider asking the question a rant or complaint.  I just got thinking about it, and figured I'd ask.

So your answer would be?

[FALCONWING]

Not sure if this is aimed at me Falc, but I didn't leave the game for a couple months because of the game.  You'll note there was no "I'm leaving cause it sucked" post from me.  It had all to do with a little guy who needed his Dad focused in on him and I realized I didn't have the time or the energy to put into AH.  Now that he's on a decent sleep schedule and some of the other stuff around him has slowed down, dad has time to play again.  Not as much, but enough to have fun

And I'd hardly consider asking the question a rant or complaint.  I just got thinking about it, and figured I'd ask.

So your answer would be?

Dan

you know i respect you and the reasons you took a break from the game were conveyed to me and it made me respect you all the more.  The reason i didn't post in this thread for 12 pages was partly out of respect for you...

so "no" this post was by no means aimed at you but at the bbs hordelings who can't find any happiness in the game...i personally do not count you among them.  You are among the few who "walk the walk after they talk the talk"

I am thrilled that you are back!

Hope that clears that up

your virtual friend
mike

[Wingnutt]

In the end I believe that too often the desire to see the name in lights creates a timidness in folks who see that as the sign of success, not the success of having flown a good flight and fought a good fight. 

I see folks mention that they like it when they land em as a squad.  How often is that also a sign of nothing more then a mob that crowded over a base and vulched or picked the guys taking off until they rtb out of bullets to land their 'kills'?

Obviously it's not up to me, but I wish somehow the scoring system promoted the fight more then it promoted timidness.

what is a fight?  a guy runs from you because you have alt and are over your own base..  hes a coward for running? or are you the coward for only fighting with extreme stacked odds?

is it timid to seek a fair fight, and avoid being mobbed?   

is it cowardice to run for home when you lose an elevator? have a PW? oil hit?    is it cowardice to leave a situation that you feel is unwinnable?   



cant really answer such questions, too many variables, too many possibilities, too many "what ifs" 

if a person sets off on a mission to shoot down the enemy and return home safely.. thats ok..  as long as they do it the way YOU want them to?   Only if they, in your eyes "earn it"   if they attack a base and kill those foolish enough to try and take off from it.. they are losers? right?  the losers arnt the people trying to roll from a decked, capped base over and over.. oh no.. they are the "brave defenders" right

someone who picks their fights intelligently, knows when to hit and how not to get hit..  what a piece.. what a jerkoff,  the REAL.. SKILLED.. players are the ones who dive headlong into a sea of red and die guns blazing.. right?


If I am tooling along in my jug and come across a LA7 and a hurri2C  i should DIVE AND!! YES!! KILL THEM!!!  I shouldn't run.. knowing only LA will give chase, forcing a 1V1 where I have a good chance at victory, then allowing me to run down the hurricane at my leisure...  HELL NO.. thats DUMB  I should try and turn fight the LA... while the hurry turn inside me and kills me.. no wait, ill  BnZ the HURRI while the LA runs me down and kills me..    that way I accomplish absolutely NOTHING but at least I didn't run like a coward 

this thread

sucks.

[Cajunn]

Removing kill messages wouldn't change this aspect for me one iota either.  I'm one of those who won't purposely help take a base.  

I don't care what it does for or against my score.  I'm simply not willing to waste ammo on landscape features, or on planes that haven't left the ground yet.  Kill ack?  No way- it just ruins the fight and turns it into a vulch-fest.  I'd rather have the enemy fighters have the protection of their ack.

The only time I care who owns a field is when I'm ready to land.

I don't hold that against anyone, but what we have is 3 or more separate class of players in the game, we have the players that play to work as a group to take basses, we have the players like you (mtnman) that play the game to put his skills up against another players skill and then we have the players who don't care about either they would just as soon spend all there time in massive furballs. None are wrong but one usually takes away from the other in AH and that was the point I was trying to make.

[Hornet]

The ability to opt out would be appreciated. I would turn it off. Why provide the additional piece of SA to opponents? I would opt out of score if possible as well.

I also disagree with the argument that you need recognition from peers for a job well done. If you play this game long enough you _know_ when you are flying well and when you are not.

I much prefer quietly practicing the craft and in today's AH anonymity is a blessing. However I fail to see how any of this diminishes my desire to compete at the merge.

[Guppy35]

what is a fight?  a guy runs from you because you have alt and are over your own base..  hes a coward for running? or are you the coward for only fighting with extreme stacked odds?

is it timid to seek a fair fight, and avoid being mobbed?   

is it cowardice to run for home when you lose an elevator? have a PW? oil hit?    is it cowardice to leave a situation that you feel is unwinnable?   

The notion of 'cowardice' in a cartoon airplane game is to me just silly, otherwise my answer to your question would be a resounding 'yes'.

I spend most of my 38G time trolling below folks trying to get them to come down.  I don't get that much time to play and climbing to 15 or 20K just takes time, which I don't always have.

Upping into a mob trying to take a base is a challenge.  I might get clobbered, but I might take a few with me. 

I have absolutely nothing to lose if I fight, regardless of the situation, except the fight itself.  And since I get a new cartoon pilot and new cartoon airplane every time, why wouldn't I fight?  This is the MA we're talking about, not a scenario, FSO, Snapshot or event where one life matters.  How do you test how far your cartoon piloting skills have come, if you only fight in situations where you know you can't lose or the odds are stacked on your side? 

I'd think that getting out of your comfort zone would be the only way to get better.

Obviously it's your dime however, so fly as you will

[Steve]

what is a fight?  a guy runs from you because you have alt and are over your own base..  hes a coward for running? or are you the coward for only fighting with extreme stacked odds?

is it timid to seek a fair fight, and avoid being mobbed?   

is it cowardice to run for home when you lose an elevator? have a PW? oil hit?    is it cowardice to leave a situation that you feel is unwinnable?   

Well for me it is. Many times when  I fight with my plane my style and don't allow the other guys to shoot me down, I'm called a runner. I'm a coward for not dying. It's ironic though, somehow these noble scrappers that say I can't fight and that I'm a runner somehow average about one half to one third as many kills per hour as I do. I'll never figure out how this happens since these O so noble pile-its fight til they die, they rarely spend any time RTB'ing.  One day, I hope to be as brave and skilled as these fellows and get half as many kills per hour, or less,  as I do now so I can be as gifted as them.

[Guppy35]

Well for me it is. Many times when  I fight with my plane my style and don't allow the other guys to shoot me down, I'm called a runner. I'm a coward for not dying. It's ironic though, somehow these noble scrappers that say I can't fight and that I'm a runner somehow average about one half to one third as many kills per hour as I do. I'll never figure out how this happens since these O so noble pile-its fight til they die, they rarely spend any time RTB'ing.  One day, I hope to be as brave and skilled as these fellows and get half as many kills per hour, or less,  as I do now so I can be as gifted as them.

You gotta make up your mind Steve as to what kind of pile-it you are

My first night back after a couple months I had created an account but no CorkyJr so I was up with another ID.  I went up in a B Pony and got into a great brawl, outnumbered, on the deck, turning and trying to survive.  Some guy in a 51D named Steve was down there with me, and shot two guys off me while we were working to avoid a growing red mob that was coming in above us.  This guy Steve kept going on the deck and fighting AND turning in that 51D while I was doing the same in a 51B.  Eventually the numbers were just too many and this guy Steve and I both got chopped, but not until he and I had taken quite a few with us. I don't know that we ever got above 2K.  I know I was laughing at the time as 2 51Ds came down at light speed and couldn't pull out in time while trying to shoot my 51B and I got proxies.  It was that fight that reminded me of what I was missing

Thanked you twice on local text twice for clearing me too.  I coulda swore it was you.

[mtnman]

I don't hold that against anyone, but what we have is 3 or more separate class of players in the game, we have the players that play to work as a group to take basses, we have the players like you (mtnman) that play the game to put his skills up against another players skill and then we have the players who don't care about either they would just as soon spend all there time in massive furballs. None are wrong but one usually takes away from the other in AH and that was the point I was trying to make.

I understand your point, and have no issues with others playing pretty much any way they want.  I'm just saying that the kills landed message has no bearing on how/why I play...