Author Topic: C205 - Pizza wagon  (Read 1263 times)

Offline AAIbyteu

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C205 - Pizza wagon
« on: May 08, 2010, 08:33:11 AM »
I have been flying for about 2 years now and have not had any instruction except from squad members.  After flying about every plane in the game, I have turned my attention to the C205.  Do any of you have any tips on flying this plane to get the most out of it?  Some planes I am just dog meat in, some just fit my style of flying.  This is one that I enjoy flying but want to get better in.  Thanks for any help. :salute

Offline Ghosth

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Re: C205 - Pizza wagon
« Reply #1 on: May 08, 2010, 09:32:45 AM »
A bit like a hawk, it likes to swoop down on slower, lower bogeys from above.

Skirt the edges of the furball, fly smart, pick your fights.

Offline Krusty

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Re: C205 - Pizza wagon
« Reply #2 on: May 08, 2010, 08:14:32 PM »
If you mean to use it as a picker plane only, .......  LIES!!!!!!  :neener:

It's an excellent dogfighter. Not a picking bird. You get in on a target, manuver for the kill, and kill the bastage in front of you!

The exception is of course when you're targetting a plane far more manuverable than yourself, such as a spitfire, zero, the 109s, etc.

The C205 is quite manuverable, but it suffers in turn radius. Somewhat like a 190, however, you can scrub off your surplus E in a turn to gain angles at the expense of position.

What I mean is the spitty might out turn you, but if you've got some speed or some alt to nose down, you can beat him on the break turn, or get your nose leading his enough to shoot him in his turn. Then break off, break high, reposition, and reattack. Don't play their game. This thing climbs like a 109f4/109g2.

Use the ammo load to set up lead shots. You can take the shots without fear of running out of ammo so fast. Also, get used to the views so that you know where an enemy is under your nose and so you can adjust your lead to better kill the targets.

Many planes are of comparable or worse turning radius than the C2. With these I never fear they will ever beat me, because I usually have better ability to regain or retain E (nice powerful engine on this puppy!). Against a P-51 or P-47 I have never really felt fear of losing a fight. Against 190s and other planes the risk is more "he'll just run away rather than fight."

I take these babies into fights all the time, and I love the guns, the overall flight capabilities the plane has. The major weakness is the lack of real range. You MUST cruise to and from the fight if you want a decent-length sortie. If it's a short hop such as base defense, or furballing less than 1 sector away, you can firewall the throttle or take 75% or less gas (if right over your field), but on any normal sortie I would say always take 100%. If we had DTs on this baby I'd fly it everywhere.

Fire all guns at once. You'll have a bit of surplus MG ammo once your cannons are gone, so you can use them for rangefinding as well as scaring other craft. They are, however, almost comparable to 50cal guns, and if you have to you can kill targets with just them (just get in under 300 yards -- under 200 is better).

It's not a GREAT plane. It's just good in a number of areas. Just barely fast enough to threaten most planes, climbs good but still can be outclimbed/zoomed by others, manuverability is good but still compresses horribly at higher speeds, so you can see it's not really a spit or la7 or 190d or anything.

Like the F6F, it is simply a good plane. I think you'll enjoy it.

Offline AAIbyteu

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Re: C205 - Pizza wagon
« Reply #3 on: May 09, 2010, 10:22:50 AM »
Thanks for the advice!  All the things you said is very true.  Guns good, lots of ammo for a heavy finger like mine, good climb and fast.  Dive can be pulled out of like a 38 by kicking off the combat trim and using up trim.    Is it me, or does this plane not lose E very well?  I can kill power, and do a barrel roll with someone on my tail and don’t lose hardly any speed? 
BTW, Krusty, as a former Denver-ite myself, GO Broncos!!  :rock

Offline grizz441

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Re: C205 - Pizza wagon
« Reply #4 on: May 09, 2010, 03:51:16 PM »
The biggest key to the C205 and to keep it competitive in most fights is forcing the fight into a spiral climb/vertical scissoring scenario.  It has a ton of engine and can win fights this way.  It can hang on the prop with nose up like a Ki84.  It also has a very stable gun platform for when you do get that crossing shot.  Very underrated aircraft capable of a lot of kills.

Offline Sonicblu

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Re: C205 - Pizza wagon
« Reply #5 on: May 09, 2010, 08:43:05 PM »
I agree havent flown it in awhile but . keep it in the vert if you can. it climbs with the best of them. It accelerates better than most with nose slightly down. It is a great way to build e on a revearsal then put it in the vert. If you use snap rolls you can get it to roll quite well.

PM firedrgn he used to fly it all the time before he got stuck in the yak.

Offline FireDrgn

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Re: C205 - Pizza wagon
« Reply #6 on: May 09, 2010, 10:44:38 PM »
lol  i cant even find the wep button in the yak... ill probably just get you killed.

pretty much what sonic said.   if you ever see me online give me a shout ill wing up with u .



"When the student is ready the teacher will appear."   I am not a teacher.

Offline Krusty

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Re: C205 - Pizza wagon
« Reply #7 on: May 10, 2010, 02:40:59 AM »
The comments about spiraling I would tend to disagree with. It's good in the vertical, but has a very unpleasant stall. Spiralling like that usually involves riding the stall and that's bad in this plane. You want to have a good 20mph buffer above stall speed at all times if you can help it.

Stalling this puppy can and will get you killed.

Offline grizz441

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Re: C205 - Pizza wagon
« Reply #8 on: May 10, 2010, 12:40:40 PM »
The comments about spiraling I would tend to disagree with. It's good in the vertical, but has a very unpleasant stall. Spiralling like that usually involves riding the stall and that's bad in this plane. You want to have a good 20mph buffer above stall speed at all times if you can help it.

Stalling this puppy can and will get you killed.

If you can't ride the edge and do what I described, then you aren't going to be able to compete in that plane, simple as that really.

Offline Krusty

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Re: C205 - Pizza wagon
« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2010, 02:14:46 PM »
LOL... It's not that simple.

You ride the edge too closely and you snap-stall, same as any other plane. Only problem is the snap-stall in this plane will get you killed, takes a lot of time and effort to correct (it can put you into accelerated stall) and is at a higher speed than most planes. You fly at stall speed and other planes will out-stall you any day. It's a good climber, but not that great. If you flounder it out you're toast.

Spiral climbing is best left to planes with docile stall characteristics. Not the C2. Spiral dive is another issue, since usually does not involve stall speeds.

Offline grizz441

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Re: C205 - Pizza wagon
« Reply #10 on: May 10, 2010, 03:46:25 PM »
LOL... It's not that simple.

You ride the edge too closely and you snap-stall, same as any other plane. Only problem is the snap-stall in this plane will get you killed, takes a lot of time and effort to correct (it can put you into accelerated stall) and is at a higher speed than most planes. You fly at stall speed and other planes will out-stall you any day. It's a good climber, but not that great. If you flounder it out you're toast.

Spiral climbing is best left to planes with docile stall characteristics. Not the C2. Spiral dive is another issue, since usually does not involve stall speeds.

I know this is an argument I can't win but it is one of the top 5 non perked climbers in the game, so I would classify that as great.  I have a lot of experience in this ride and the best way to win a fight is to get the nose up into a spiral, just like the D9 or A5.  If things get sticky, you can always nose down for speed where it flourishes and bank back in with a low yo yo reverse and bring it back into another spiral for another chance at it.

Offline Bosco123

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Re: C205 - Pizza wagon
« Reply #11 on: May 10, 2010, 07:31:52 PM »
202 Is most excellent for fights, and 205 is a little heavy. Yes I do use the 205 for fights, but I find it doesn't have much strengths in any catagory of fighting other than maybe the tourque, and even that is mathced by the 109 tourque. It's a mediocre plane to say the most about it, but the guns are good and it's not the worst plane in the game.

But good luck with it! I've been trying to fly it more often myself lol

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Offline Krusty

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Re: C205 - Pizza wagon
« Reply #12 on: May 10, 2010, 09:53:31 PM »
I know this is an argument I can't win

After reading 2 of your comments there, I have to agree.

First comment: Top 5 unperked climbers is not accurate.
Planes that outclimb the C205:

f4u4/spit14 (but these are perks, rest are unperked
spit9 (above 8k)
spit8
spit16
109g2
109g6
109g14
109k4
190d9 (from 0k-5k and again from 10k-20k, very close at other points)
la5 and la7 (below 8k)
ki84 (below 6k)

Just for nitpicking's sake, I'd also say your second comment about flying 190s in spiral climbs is a bad idea. Historically they were not good at this, and in-game they are also not good at this. Other, better stalling aircraft will be able to spiral tighter and either cut you off in a chase and shoot you, or evade you by turning too tight for you to follow. There was even an after-action report of a P-38 pilot that out-spiral climbed some 190s. They couldn't do more than put a couple of hits in his wingtip, could never get lead on him.

Spiral climbing as a tactic really only works in a plane that has excellent low-speed handling, because you are pushing the nose ever higher and higher, angling ever tighter and tighter. None of the 190s, and neither of the C2s, handles well at low speeds. They all have nasty stalls and against anything halfway-manuverable the spiral is a bad choice. That said, there are many other moves that will win the fight for them, they can still manuver in the vertical, loops, yo-yos, any number of 3D moves that are not spirals. Spirals are just inefficient use of these planes IMO.

No disrespect intended. All in good debate.

Offline grizz441

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Re: C205 - Pizza wagon
« Reply #13 on: May 10, 2010, 10:03:34 PM »
Well I stand correct.  I was getting my information from the official C205 AH wikipedia page which states "Climb rate is outstanding, a little understood aspect of the C205, beginning at over 4,000ft/minute at sea-level and slowly decreasing to 3,500ft/minute at 15K. That is in the top 5 of non-perked fighters and gives a solid band at low or medium altitudes where your climb rate should be quite effective."

As for spiral climbing, that's just the way I do it and have had lots of success against very good pilots in the DA in better rides using this tactic.  If you want, I can show you sometime.   :cool:

Offline Krusty

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Re: C205 - Pizza wagon
« Reply #14 on: May 10, 2010, 10:08:18 PM »
Yeah.... that's why I didn't like Soda's evaluation page. A lot of the info is very subjective and out of date (for example when that was written we didn't have spit8, spit16, 109g14, and our K4 was named the G10, but the spit5 we had could probably outclimb the C205 easy as it was up-boosted), and his info was used to fill out the AH wiki.


P.S If I'm ever in the DA and see you I'll ask for a fight or two :) I love the C2 m'self, as well!