F3 view and the il2

[Vinkman]

I really don't think it provides any advantage in a fair fight, and negligible advantage in the pray and spray.  It can help for SA in a view impaired aircraft however.  Imo though, F3 whines are just a scapegoat for suckage.

Baiting.

Il-2 are extremely tough planes. It takes a fairly long burst to kill an IL-2. The flopping-NEO-bullet-dodging afforded by F3 mode makes it extremely difficult to get a long burst on an IL-2if you are closing at higher rate of speed. Killing one is easy if you can slow down and stay behind him for a long enough burst, but that requires a sacrifice of all Speed and Alt. This is not an option in a furball situation at a base. Top cover helped Ghi get all his kills because attackers who slow down to defeat the "F3 mode Flop" get picked before they can kill him. The Il-2 will absorbed the scattered pings that a fast attacker can land, and survive to pull up and kill him on the over shoot. The pings are only scattered because the of the SA afforded by F3 mode and resulting bullet dodging that can take place.

No one missed Ghi when he was alone in his IL-2. A situation he avoided. Top cover always kept the attackers fast. F3 mode made them miss, and made them dead.  I don't think that qualifies as suckage on the part of attackers.  

[321BAR]

I say we just leave the system as it is and all of you fighter pilots learn how to fight instead of whining when you get owned by a bomber in a dogfight. 

i loved pulling the IL2 out to kill enemy A/C. I said they should make it F1 only

[grizz441]

Baiting.

Il-2 are extremely tough planes. It takes a fairly long burst to kill an IL-2. The flopping-NEO-bullet-dodging afforded by F3 mode makes it extremely difficult to get a long burst on an IL-2if you are closing at higher rate of speed. Killing one is easy if you can slow down and stay behind him for a long enough burst, but that requires a sacrifice of all Speed and Alt. This is not an option in a furball situation at a base. Top cover helped Ghi get all his kills because attackers who slow down to defeat the "F3 mode Flop" get picked before they can kill him. The Il-2 will absorbed the scattered pings that a fast attacker can land, and survive to pull up and kill him on the over shoot. The pings are only scattered because the of the SA afforded by F3 mode and resulting bullet dodging that can take place.

No one missed Ghi when he was alone in his IL-2. A situation he avoided. Top cover always kept the attackers fast. F3 mode made them miss, and made them dead.  I don't think that qualifies as suckage on the part of attackers.  

So basically, the IL2 defending his base against a horde of late eny monsters was unfairly killing them?  If you are trying to tickle my sympathy you are not doing a good job.   

[Vinkman]

So basically, the IL2 defending his base against a horde of late eny monsters was unfairly killing them?  If you are trying to tickle my sympathy you are not doing a good job.  

Ah you didn't read carefully. It's a furball. many friendlies to help him. If he was defending by himself, he'd be toast.

[grizz441]

Ah you didn't read carefully. It's furball. many friendlies to help him. If he was defending by himself, he'd be toast.

I never saw ghi doing too much furballing in his IL2, mostly just base defense, most times with just a couple others, or by himself.  He was usually toast, but not before he killed a guy and weaseled a ditch out of it.  Again, I have no sympathy for a B&Z'r fighting with advantage getting killed in this fashion.  I got killed plenty of times by him and I never out cried at ghi for it, it was my own fault.

[grizz441]

I think you will also be surprised to know that ghi's tactics are still quite viable in an IL2, even without F3.  But the fact that they are now disabled as bombers makes them less valuable.

[ghi]

WoW! what a long whinie, .
I didn't read it all, but i understand the F3 was removed because of me?! Ok , i own an apology for all those who used f3 mode in Il2 and can't use it anymore. I never used Il2 for kills and score, cuz i don't care about score,i've seen my stats for first time in 6-7 years in this threat. If you got nailed by my il2, you were vulching or picking at the end of the runway, i used it 100% for base defence, always 25% fuel and below 5k.  I agree with HTC decision to remove f3 mode,was an unfair advantage especially after the 37mm was introduced. Don't worry you vulchers and pickers,i'll find some other toys to fight you, if not i'll climb on top of the tower and trow rocks in your windshields, but won't give up bases easy.

[JUGgler]

GHI was not the only one who used il2 for base defence, I certainly used it also as many others! The issue for me was not the the overshoots at the cherryfest as I don't frequent these silly events for me it is merely a part of the game that just doesn't fit well, kind of like a puzzle where for some reason you have a few pieces form a completely different puzzle that just don't fit!

Having changed the il2 has made vulching and cherryfesting easier for the tards IMO, and that is sucky. But that has more to do with lame style of play by the (cherry vulchers) than anything else.

GHI I'm sure would lose 20+ planes for every one he nailed so in the end the vulching is less fun for the vulchers also. I also miss the 200 rant of "that's BS" always good for a laugh.


Now lets find a way to curtail the vulch/cherryfesting for some quality interaction and have a good wholesome time!   



JUGgler

[waystin2]

Now lets find a way to curtail the vulch/cherryfesting for some quality interaction and have a good wholesome time!   



JUGgler

Solved!  Do not up at a capped field.

[Shuffler]

Now lets find a way to curtail the vulch/cherryfesting for some quality interaction and have a good wholesome time!   

JUGgler

The vulchers have to fly a ways to get to your base. Up at the capped base with several others and start knocking them off. Get enough of the cons into transit between bases and you'll start getting a better handle on the cons still at your base. It all ebbs and flows.

[Vinkman]

WoW! what a long whinie, .
I didn't read it all, but i understand the F3 was removed because of me?! Ok , i own an apology for all those who used f3 mode in Il2 and can't use it anymore. I never used Il2 for kills and score, cuz i don't care about score,i've seen my stats for first time in 6-7 years in this threat. If you got nailed by my il2, you were vulching or picking at the end of the runway, i used it 100% for base defence, always 25% fuel and below 5k.  I agree with HTC decision to remove f3 mode,was an unfair advantage especially after the 37mm was introduced. Don't worry you vulchers and pickers,i'll find some other toys to fight you, if not i'll climb on top of the tower and trow rocks in your windshields, but won't give up bases easy.

  

[JUGgler]

Solved!  Do not up at a capped field.

Hmm, this same argument? so up from another field?

You and everyone else knows this no longer works, by the time you get there from another base it is more than likely captured. Also trying to organize something with others from another base also is futile. So a peep ends up coming from another base maybe with 1 or 2 others IF they're lucky, as soon as they dive in they are swarmed by locusts ( like a Bath and Body works Grand opening with 90% discounts). The idea of coming from another base for defence is ludicrous and a thing of the past. The base taking horde has become to efficient and anything other than easy cherry/vulches they avoid like the plague.

 I don't care if you take the base, hell it doesn't even bother me when you guys are hording it. I would just like some sort of motivator (for the defenders) to keep upping or maybe even up for the 1st time to defend and some sort of risk for the attackers.

Either have some sort of "mission generator" than can respond (even if imperfectly) to a base take horde in a reasonable time frame, or levy some risk to the horde so they truely have to commit with a risk and a reward  

I watched 2 bases change hands last night in under 3 minutes each. How "exactly" do you up from another base and have any impact on that?

There is obviously a large group of folks who enjoy taking bases in this manner, and far fewer willing to defend against it. So lets find a risk for the takers and a reward AND a motivator for more defenders!

More planes that are lower and easier for you to kill = more fun for you, a little more time and speed to respond maybe even "wheels up" lol  good luck with that = more fun for folks like me, you see it's a win win  



JUGgler

[waystin2]

JUGgler

Whilst you and I have the same love of fighting hordes, I think you need to realize a few things:

-You gotta fight them with every tool at your disposal.  Planes, vehicles, field guns, ords porking, CV's, your sidearm(yes the .45), hunting them ahead of their attacks, counter-attacking, etc.  Not just an airplane. 

-A large percentage of the time the attackers are just gonna flat pound the base and overwhelm it with little chance of anyone stopping them.  Simply put, the large hordes will get their bases.

-If the taking of the base is of no consequence to you, then go on the attack against them and provoke a response to get the opportunity to fight them.  This works.  The Pigs do this on a regular basis.  You would be surprised at how they respond when you kick the antpile with a few bombs.

-Finally I do not see HTC favoring the limitation of vulching.  It is the sport of Kings after all.  Unfortunately peasants get to participate as well at times. 

 

Way

[Babalonian]

Hmm, this same argument? so up from another field?

You and everyone else knows this no longer works, by the time you get there from another base it is more than likely captured. Also trying to organize something with others from another base also is futile. So a peep ends up coming from another base maybe with 1 or 2 others IF they're lucky, as soon as they dive in they are swarmed by locusts ( like a Bath and Body works Grand opening with 90% discounts). The idea of coming from another base for defence is ludicrous and a thing of the past. The base taking horde has become to efficient and anything other than easy cherry/vulches they avoid like the plague.

 I don't care if you take the base, hell it doesn't even bother me when you guys are hording it. I would just like some sort of motivator (for the defenders) to keep upping or maybe even up for the 1st time to defend and some sort of risk for the attackers.

Either have some sort of "mission generator" than can respond (even if imperfectly) to a base take horde in a reasonable time frame, or levy some risk to the horde so they truely have to commit with a risk and a reward 

I watched 2 bases change hands last night in under 3 minutes each. How "exactly" do you up from another base and have any impact on that?

There is obviously a large group of folks who enjoy taking bases in this manner, and far fewer willing to defend against it. So lets find a risk for the takers and a reward AND a motivator for more defenders!

More planes that are lower and easier for you to kill = more fun for you, a little more time and speed to respond maybe even "wheels up" lol  good luck with that = more fun for folks like me, you see it's a win win 



JUGgler

So then the problem is maps that are too large or that have bases spread too far apart to be able to support one from the nearest friendly one? 

I thought you anti-furballing types are the ones that pushed for the rediculously oversized, spread out and rarely rotated more-than-a-week maps we all have been playing in the MAs so extensively lately.

[JUGgler]

So then the problem is maps that are too large or that have bases spread too far apart to be able to support one from the nearest friendly one? 

I thought you anti-furballing types are the ones that pushed for the rediculously oversized, spread out and rarely rotated more-than-a-week maps we all have been playing in the MAs so extensively lately.

Well if your definition of "furball type" is perchin the edge of a field and slobberin all over the 1 or 2 folks who up before they get 200' or 200 mph, then you are correct I would fall under your definition of "anti furballer" 

The maps have very little to do with how folks choose to play "lame or not"

I see the "unspoken " respect of the "old school" furball is lost on most, this is the reason we have disagreement. Also the reason the gameplay will continue towards its xbox oblivion 



 



JUGgler