30-06

[Maverick]

Flench, believe it or not, but quite a few folks clean their gun more often than every third hunting season. Don't blame the equipment if the problem is really operator negligence.

[eagl]

I can assure you I know  how to sight in a rifle lol.  I'm also s decent shot.I'm using remington core  lock 180 gr. Shells. There is  no reason behind the patern. Its just plain all over.

Try different ammo.  Try different weights and loads.  Some guns just randomly throw one type of ammo but are solid with a different bullet, load, weight, or manufacturer.  At what, $20 per box, it's an expensive way to figure out if you need to take the gun back to whoever sold it to you, but it may be the only real solution.

[Flench]

Flench, believe it or not, but quite a few folks clean their gun more often than every third hunting season. Don't blame the equipment if the problem is really operator negligence.

REALLY ? I just dip mine in a mud hole and it's good to go .

[saggs]

Like others have mentioned, the 770 is not generally regarded as a very accurate rifle, but hey, for the price you can't complain.  If you want better accuracy in a Remington you'll have to shell out twice the $$$ for a 700.

[eagl]

I second the idea about getting a Browning.  I like my stainless A-bolt in 7mm rem mag.  It has the BOSS dingus on the barrel which reduces the recoil (a welcome feature with 7mm ammo) and lets me tune the barrel to each individual type of ammo, but it also adds about half a pound and 3 inches of barrel length.  If I was to do it again, I would probably skip the BOSS even though the anti-recoil function is greatly appreciated.

Still, the gun shoots great, no question about it.  I used the factory recommended BOSS setting for another similar type of ammo (same bullet weight) and right out of the box it was shooting 1 inch 5-shot groups at 200 yards, hand-held braced on a sandbag benchrest.  I have had some good shooting instructors which helped a lot, but it is nice to have a gun that is at least as accurate as I am.

One thing I did learn - you never use the first shot or two after cleaning to sight in the weapon, and when hunting the gun should be "dirty", with a couple of shots fired through it before going to the field.  That way every shot you take on any given day of hunting will go to the same spot, the "dirty" gun aimpoint.  This is especially important if hunting game that is usually shot at great distances.  The difference between the first clean bore shot and the next 5 or so shots can be several inches at even 200 or 300 yards, depending on the gun and type of ammo.

Regarding guns that throw rounds...  My .223 mini-14 shoots a randomly dispersed 5 inch group at 100 yards unless I shoot heavy grain bullets generally intended for SWAT teams.  The gun hates lightweight bullets, and group size drops to a more reasonable 3 inches at 100 yards if I use the heaviest bullets I can find.  So trying different ammo can be important if you really want to make a quirky gun perform better.

[saggs]

I'll third the Browning A-bolt as well, shot one in .300 RUM quite a bit and love it.  But just like a Remington 700 it's going to cost about twice what the 770 cost.

It's true you get what you pay for, especially in firearms.

[Flench]

I have always shot a auto but my hunting Buddy shoots the A-bolt and has for year's fine gun .
The BOSS system is very nice . I have one on mine . You can Dial your lead right in . The only thing I do not like about the BOSS is the blow back . make sure you got ear plug's in when you shoot it . I hunt allot and don't where them and after the 3rd shot you don't want to shoot again ear's be ringing so bad . I have had it to break a mirror on my truck and peal the paint off it from shooting off and in it .

EDIT: I'm going to add to this . What is bad is when the scope cost more than the gun but let me tell you after hunting with a army of men I have seen it all and road tryed so to speak and a good scope make a big differnce .

[eagl]

I switched mid day to rem cor loc after running outta my hand loads.  they were shooting high and left...about a foot from my hand loads.  three shots of hand loads all touching in center.....three remi's touching high left.  The only difference was my loads were 168 grain and the remi's were 165 grain. I can understand high from the factory ammo but to the left about eight inches?  Made me scratch my head.

If you are putting pressure or tension on the rifle while holding it, you are probably getting a harmonic vibration as the bullet travels down the barrel and (for example) if you use a sling looped around your left forearm which snugs the forestock down and left into your hand, then there will be both vertical and horizontal vibration.  If you hold the gun exactly the same but the bullet weight, powder load or burn rate, or any number of other factors change even a bit, then the gun's natural harmonic vibrations will place the end of the barrel at a different spot for the different types of rounds.

In other words, the barrel could still be vibrating left when one type of bullet leaves the barrel, while the barrel is vibrating right when the other type of round leaves the barrel.  That is the big deal with the browning BOSS tuning system, that you can not only tune the barrel harmonics to your round, but the muzzle is consistently at the peak or trough of the vibration wave where for an instant, the barrel tip is motionless before it cycles the other way in the vibration cycle.  That can dramatically improve accuracy and it's why careful hand-loading matched with a floated or perfectly bedded barrel and consistent grip pattern can make all the difference in competition shooting.  You want the bullet to leave the muzzle in the instant when the barrel is paused between cyclical vibration movements.  The BOSS makes it easy, because it is really just a weighted tip that you adjust to make the barrel a tiny bit longer or shorter to adjust the vibration period to match the instant when the bullet leaves the muzzle.  Each type of round has a setting (or more than one setting) that is perfect for just that round, but which may cause other rounds to throw quite far in any direction.

Back to your situation, if you are holding the gun in such a way as to have ANY lateral pressure or tension on the gun or the barrel is improperly mounted so the stock touches only one side of it at any point along the length of the stock, it could easily cause a horizontal vibration component that will throw shots left or right when changing rounds.  Gunsmiths who tune guns for competition shooters spend hours or even days glassing and bedding each barrel to its own stock, to either leave a consistent gap (fully floating barrel) or bed it down so the stock exerts an even pressure on the barrel along the entire length of the stock.  That symmetry is important in managing vibration harmonics not just of the barrel but of the whole gun.

Most shooters won't notice or care, but if you're one of those people who hate shooting guns that are less accurate than you are personally, then those little details can really make a huge difference.  After a year on the USAFA pistol team and 22 years shooting USAF weapons, I have a pretty good idea how accurate I "should" be in any particular situation and it bugs me when the gun doesn't throw the bullets where I am pointing them.  I expect the vast majority of dispersion to be from my technique, so when it's the gun that is tossing the shots then I get irritated pretty quickly.

[mtnman]

I have no experience with the 770 (I have Rem 700's, and Winchester 70's), but what eagl wrote about matters a WHOLE LOT.  If you don't/can't use and experiment with reloads, it could easily pay big dividends to go out and buy several different loads/brands to test.  I've seen that take a horrendously ugly group and fix it immediately.

Another point worth mentioning (because I see it almost every year with people sighting rifles before deer season) is your rest set-up.  You can take a perfect rifle, perfect scope, and perfectly matched rounds and make them shoot bad by having an ineffective rest, or in particular a poor rest material.  In my case, I took a beautifully-grouping rifle and caused myself all sorts of headaches by padding the front and rear rests with a bit of 1" foam (it seemed like a good idea at the time).  My groups went bad immediately, but i didn't realize the rest was the cause until around 50 rounds later (and a lot of time spent investigating my scope mounts, scope, cleaning (I thought maybe I had fouling of some sort causing problems).  I even made up several new reload combinations...  No luck...  Then I took the foam off, and bingo, good groups again.

I've seen the same effect when people yank the foam out of a case to use as a rest at the range, or rolled up towels, or a soft case folded in half, etc...

I brace both the fore stock and toe of my rifles when sighting them in, because I don't want any movement at all. 

You may have a good rest already (I find good ol' sand bags to be best/easiest), but if not, I'd look into that first, since it's such an easy and overlooked component.  It may not be a problem for you though, because you mention using a vice to hold the rifle.  Depending on the vise, using it may have already eliminated the scope and mounts from the equation.  If' that's so, I'd go back to what eagl mentions.

[rogwar]

Here is some work with the Browning X-Bolt in 7mm-08 at 100 yds.

[Rich52]

The man already said he's an experienced rifle shooter. First thing I'd do is get some dent glass and good mounts. If the rifle still shoots bad I'd return it. Without being able to see your groups I couldnt tell you whats wrong but even if it is the rifle you can then buy a better one and already have the decent glass to put on it.

I may go thru life wearing old jeans and khaki but my rifle glass is always first rate, as are my rifles, "just like a redneck". And like a redneck I'll skimp on eating before I'll skimp on my rifle/glass.

[Flench]

I went through 6 different scope's before I found one that would hold up to way I hunt  .
I was having trouble with the scope's getting off throeing the rifle around on the fore wheeler in and out of the truck and so on . I went with the Leupold Red Dot Scope and have had it on there for the last 6 year's and have not had to mess with it at all just change the battery and your good to go .
Here is a good site for  Leupold scopes you can check out and give you an idea of price then you mite find one at a pawn shop cheeper .
http://www.opticsplanet.com/leupold-rifle-scopes.html

[MrRiplEy[H]]

If you are putting pressure or tension on the rifle while holding it, you are probably getting a harmonic vibration as the bullet travels down the barrel and (for example) if you use a sling looped around your left forearm which snugs the forestock down and left into your hand, then there will be both vertical and horizontal vibration.  If you hold the gun exactly the same but the bullet weight, powder load or burn rate, or any number of other factors change even a bit, then the gun's natural harmonic vibrations will place the end of the barrel at a different spot for the different types of rounds.

In other words, the barrel could still be vibrating left when one type of bullet leaves the barrel, while the barrel is vibrating right when the other type of round leaves the barrel.  That is the big deal with the browning BOSS tuning system, that you can not only tune the barrel harmonics to your round, but the muzzle is consistently at the peak or trough of the vibration wave where for an instant, the barrel tip is motionless before it cycles the other way in the vibration cycle.  That can dramatically improve accuracy and it's why careful hand-loading matched with a floated or perfectly bedded barrel and consistent grip pattern can make all the difference in competition shooting.  You want the bullet to leave the muzzle in the instant when the barrel is paused between cyclical vibration movements.  The BOSS makes it easy, because it is really just a weighted tip that you adjust to make the barrel a tiny bit longer or shorter to adjust the vibration period to match the instant when the bullet leaves the muzzle.  Each type of round has a setting (or more than one setting) that is perfect for just that round, but which may cause other rounds to throw quite far in any direction.

Back to your situation, if you are holding the gun in such a way as to have ANY lateral pressure or tension on the gun or the barrel is improperly mounted so the stock touches only one side of it at any point along the length of the stock, it could easily cause a horizontal vibration component that will throw shots left or right when changing rounds.  Gunsmiths who tune guns for competition shooters spend hours or even days glassing and bedding each barrel to its own stock, to either leave a consistent gap (fully floating barrel) or bed it down so the stock exerts an even pressure on the barrel along the entire length of the stock.  That symmetry is important in managing vibration harmonics not just of the barrel but of the whole gun.

Most shooters won't notice or care, but if you're one of those people who hate shooting guns that are less accurate than you are personally, then those little details can really make a huge difference.  After a year on the USAFA pistol team and 22 years shooting USAF weapons, I have a pretty good idea how accurate I "should" be in any particular situation and it bugs me when the gun doesn't throw the bullets where I am pointing them.  I expect the vast majority of dispersion to be from my technique, so when it's the gun that is tossing the shots then I get irritated pretty quickly.

You're just a wussy. Real men handle recoil - just like this guy here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RkgfrS9FanU

[nrshida]

I was just wondering, if it's not a derailing of the topic, what is the history of the term 30-06 or 30-aught six as I sometimes hear. I don't see the significance of the additional zero and I understood the bullet diameter was 0.308 of an inch 

[rogwar]

I was just wondering, if it's not a derailing of the topic, what is the history of the term 30-06 or 30-aught six as I sometimes hear. I don't see the significance of the additional zero and I understood the bullet diameter was 0.308 of an inch 

Here ya go!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.30-06_Springfield