Gun control laws do they work ?

[TonyJoey]

Chilli, I agree 100% with your post.

[danny76]

I like the fact that in this country the incidence of gun crime is negligable. It has however increased substantially since the draconian private ownership laws were enacted after Micheal Ryan in Hungerford, and especially Thomas Hamilton at Dunblane.
If, however, the government sees fit to allow private firearm ownership for home defence, at any time in the future I guarantee you I will be in the front of the line, and make sure my loved ones know how to acces and use it. If homeowners are expected by criminals to be in possesion of firearms, they are more likely to take the risk of carrying a weapon themselves.
At the moment it's not necessary, and whatever the firearms laws or reasonable force guidelines, you break into my house and threaten my loved ones I promise it will be your last burglary. Britain has recently dealt with a couple of deaths of burgling little turds whilst they were invading peoples homes. Thet aquitted the homeowners who protected themselves.
The problem I foresee is that if government strongly advocates use of force in home defence, it will serve to make criminals arm themselves more effectively.
It is a viscious circle

[ToeTag]

Good guys VS bad guys.  Gun laws only give the bad guys the advantage.  Soooo NO they don't work.  When they come to disarm me I feel badly for them and my family.

[mtnman]

Surprised nobody had quoted, 'those who hammer their swords into plowshares will plow for those that don't'

Actually...

Check my sig.  Technically, the quote was used several pages back...

[VonMessa]

sorry but your rollseye made me laugh....obviously you don't want your freedom and would rather be a sheep than a man....let me guess the first sign of trouble you call 911....oh come save me....help me....I need help......

take the responsibility of YOUR life into YOU'RE hands...don't expect someone else to came save you.

but then again I guess this world needs all kinds....so never mind continue being a sheep.



that quote is one of the best there is.

Not everyone lives where you do.  I, however, have been up to your place.

I'm thinking 911 response time to be 30-45 minutes MINIMUM, in good weather.

Then again, from having the opportunity to meet a bunch of folks while in your area and witnessing the breed of people up there, my bet is that most conflicts would be "resolved" before help could arrive and that a 911 call up there is more like a call for a clean-up crew. 

[VonMessa]

....and shoot guns  

Plenty of places to off-road.   

Any word on someone finding my winch control cable?  

[Shuffler]

we can only wonder if those people in new york if they had been carrying a gun and shot back what would have happened. more victims?  I mean if they police who is supposed to be highly trained can open fire and shoot 9 bystanders, what would have happened in Colorado if some of those in the theater would have had guns themselves.  how many more would have gotten shot?

semp

Most police are not highly trained. Many leagal gun owners are far better trained than the police.

The 2 officers in NY made many mistakes.

[Jayhawk]

Not that it is much direct relevance to the thread topic, but interesting enough in regards to the New York shooting.  IIRC, the NYPD require all the officer sidearms to have a 12 pound trigger, even making the Sig 226 a DAO firearm with a 12 pound trigger.  Without a doubt, poor training played a role, but the 12 pound trigger did not make things any easier.

[VonMessa]

Most police are not highly trained. Many leagal gun owners are far better trained than the police.

The 2 officers in NY made many mistakes.

I hold the training regimen, frequency and qualification standards for failing the NYPD.

I hold the officers responsible for not taking it upon themselves to recognize that the NYPD standards and their own fire discipline was lacking and correcting this on their own time.

If you are going to do a job that requires you to possibly have to fire upon a suspect in a metropolis as crowded as New York City, you had better make sure that you are able to hit your mark, regardless of the situation.  When all is said and done, the responsibility lies solely on the individual pulling the trigger.

[guncrasher]

Most police are not highly trained. Many leagal gun owners are far better trained than the police.

The 2 officers in NY made many mistakes.

Yes and some civilians with no military training can snipe from further out than your regular military sniper.  but the truth is police officers are far better trained than your average gun owner.



semp

[Jayhawk]

Yes and some civilians with no military training can snipe from further out than your regular military sniper.  but the truth is police officers are far better trained than your average gun owner.



semp

I feel like it's hard to make a blanket statement in either direction.  Does that include gun owners who just own hunting rifles or shotguns?  Gun owners who just shoot .22s recreational?  Or is it referring to gun owners who carry for self-defense?  Also, training varies greatly by different police departments.  The TRUTH is, it's impossible to say either way who, on average, is better without real unbiased evidence.

[Shuffler]

Yes and some civilians with no military training can snipe from further out than your regular military sniper.  but the truth is police officers are far better trained than your average gun owner.



semp

Possible but doubtful when speaking of CHL holders.

[VonMessa]

Possible but doubtful when speaking of CHL holders.

Especially since the officers of the NYPD in this most recent incidence were veterans and this is the first time that they ever had to fire their weapon in the line of duty.

I have fired my everyday carry so many times that the checkering on the (wooden) handle is starting to smooth over.

[guncrasher]

I feel like it's hard to make a blanket statement in either direction.  Does that include gun owners who just own hunting rifles or shotguns?  Gun owners who just shoot .22s recreational?  Or is it referring to gun owners who carry for self-defense?  Also, training varies greatly by different police departments.  The TRUTH is, it's impossible to say either way who, on average, is better without real unbiased evidence.

well,  based on the fact that your average gun owner doesnt do as much training with arms as your average police officer, then most likely that is the proof that your average police officer is better trained than your average gun owner.  

you are dreaming if you think your average gun owner is equally or better trained than the police.



semp

[Ardy123]

Possible but doubtful when speaking of CHL holders.

Out of the ~35000 deaths due to guns, ~12000 were homicides, the rest were accidents and suicides. Statistically speaking, one has greater chance at killing themselves than being killed by someone else.