Author Topic: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...  (Read 7237 times)

Offline MarineUS

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Re: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...
« Reply #150 on: December 22, 2012, 05:26:18 PM »
For my home I take my shotgun over anything else . Most of your shoots are going to be close range anyway so a shotgun is the way to go . With a rifle after you shoot a few rounds through it , it's going  to get hot and start shooting off anyway .
:huh :huh :huh :huh :huh
Uh....what?

My God! This man has been brainwashed by the internet! Sure, a shotgun is nice.....but if you're firing pellets (which would be the case of owning a shotgun according to you since it has that spread for close range [a slug might as well be a .50 round]) you're going to spray matter all over the house and destroy a ton of crap in the process as well as highly increase the possibility of those pellets striking an innocent person in the household.

And that bolded statement...I'm staying away from that. I'll get into trouble.

Just know that we put over 200 rounds through our fully automatic weapons (not rifles, these are mean machines actually putting out heat)...if you need 200 rounds....and can fire them THAT fast....you're dead anyway.

When I was a young kid I was at an uncle's house with my dad to help him remodel.  Inside a wall we found a loaded / chambered fully automatic M-14 with taped clips.
Lucky!
Like, ya know, when that thing that makes you move, it has pistons and things, When your thingamajigy is providing power, you do not hear other peoples thingamajig when they are providing power.

HiTech

Offline Tank-Ace

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Re: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...
« Reply #151 on: December 22, 2012, 05:38:51 PM »
When I was a young kid I was at an uncle's house with my dad to help him remodel.  Inside a wall we found a loaded / chambered fully automatic M-14 with taped clips.

The hell  :eek:?
You started this thread and it was obviously about your want and desire in spite of your use of 'we' and Google.

"Once more unto the breach"

Offline rabbidrabbit

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Re: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...
« Reply #152 on: December 22, 2012, 06:28:55 PM »
:huh :huh :huh :huh :huh
Uh....what?

My God! This man has been brainwashed by the internet! Sure, a shotgun is nice.....but if you're firing pellets (which would be the case of owning a shotgun according to you since it has that spread for close range [a slug might as well be a .50 round]) you're going to spray matter all over the house and destroy a ton of crap in the process as well as highly increase the possibility of those pellets striking an innocent person in the household.

The close range < 30 ft spread on any shot gun is negligible.  For that matter, small shot is recommended for cqb due to it's limited ability to carry through walls yet remain lethal against unarmored opponents. 

Offline SmokinLoon

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Re: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...
« Reply #153 on: December 22, 2012, 07:13:36 PM »
Really enjoy shooting the M-500... its a great gun.  Its really the last think I want in my collection.  Besides a Garand or an M-14   ;)

I have an M1 Garand and it is the cornerstone of my WWII collection.  It is a joy to shoot as well.  I have a theory that if and when there are new laws put in to place restricting magazine capacity and detachable mags, the value of M1 Garands and SKS's wil skyrocket.  So, now would be the time to buy an M1 Garand.  Or, if you dont have that "evil" fun gun that you've always wanted and a lot of people are buying in a panic then buy that first.  But otherwise, I say the Garands and SKS's wil spike after any new laws are put in to play.

I do not have an M1A (civilian M14), but I dont blame you for wanting one, they are fine rifles as well.   :aok
Proud grandson of the late Lt. Col. Darrell M. "Bud" Gray, USAF (ret.), B24D pilot, 5th BG/72nd BS. 28 combat missions within the "slot", PTO.

Offline Shifty

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Re: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...
« Reply #154 on: December 22, 2012, 08:05:45 PM »
My God! This man has been brainwashed by the internet! Sure, a shotgun is nice.....but if you're firing pellets (which would be the case of owning a shotgun according to you since it has that spread for close range [a slug might as well be a .50 round]) you're going to spray matter all over the house and destroy a ton of crap in the process as well as highly increase the possibility of those pellets striking an innocent person in the household.

I'll still take my 12 ga shotgun, over a rifle for home defense. The pellets are not going to penetrate multiple walls and end up hitting one of my next door neighbors in their beds. I live in a suburban neighborhood where the houses are 50 feet apart. I have an M1 Garand I would only consider firing if my shotgun is empty and my wife's shotgun is empty. I would hate to send 30.06 rounds towards any of my neighbors homes.

JG-11"Black Hearts"...nur die Stolzen, nur die Starken

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Offline Guppy35

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Re: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...
« Reply #155 on: December 22, 2012, 08:35:01 PM »
:bhead :bhead His point was and you know it, is that schools are gun free zones. Perfect for the cowards who do mass shootings. He is saying that we need to value our children above the wrong headed politics of gun control and do something about it. In Israel the terrorist originally targeted schools. Israel rightly decided not to ban guns in schools, Israel armed their teachers. they aren't the easy targets they once were.

Everywhere that guns are banned is a potential shooting gallery for the sicko's and terrorists. The Aurora movie wack-job chose the 1 in 5 theater that banned CCWs in that area. Why wouldn't he? Going to one that allowed CCW would be like walking into a police station and opening fire. go chew on that.



So based on your logic then the best solution is to give everyone an AR-15 and require they carry it loaded all the time.  That way everyone will see everyone else with a loaded gun.  You go the bank and there's the teller with the barrel of her AR-15 pointed at you.  No way you are going to rob that bank.  My daughter the grade school teacher can just have hers loaded on the desk pointed at the kids.  No behavior problems then.

Even better.  We'll increase graduation rates.   you can only get your AR-15 at graduation with a 3.0 grade point average or better.   This way we'll know who the underachievers out there.  Maybe we should only allow those gainfully employed to have them.  That way we can identify the unemployed and the drop outs. 

Think about it. only the best and the brightest able to wander freely with long guns so that everyone knows the lead will fly if they try and start something.  No more behavior problems from teenagers as how would they dare act up knowing the teachers or the parents might open fire.   No one would consider smacking their spouse as they'd be gunned down instead.  The kid brings your daughter home late from that first date?  There you are, loaded for bear.  Bet he's on time.

If you drive drunk you lose your license and your gun.  Talk about ashamed.  No one would dare go postal for rear of the firefight that would follow.

You've solved it!  We've solved it!

I appreciate your inspirational post in response to mine.  I was inspired to come up with a practical solution :aok
Dan/CorkyJr
8th FS "Headhunters

Offline Guppy35

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Re: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...
« Reply #156 on: December 22, 2012, 09:03:32 PM »
So its fine if kids are sensatized to violence to a certian extent, just as long as we take away weapons because a few people abuse them.

I don't blame xbox, or video games, or guns. I don't think theres nessecarilly anything to blame. Yeah, I guess you could blame the kid, but its a tad late for that to do much.

You could blame guns I guess, but thats the same stupid, bass-ackward logic that lead to prohibition.


Fact is that if someone wants to go kill people, they're gonna do it. Hell, the materials to make chlorine gas aren't too terribly hard to get. Would it have been better if the guy had gassed those people instead of shooting them? Or would people be freaking out and demanding we ban bleach?

The point being, the head of the NRA stood up and said don't you dare step on the 2nd Amendment and then proceeded to blame the 1st Amendment for the problem.  Hypocritical don't ya think?


Go ahead and argue that based on the 2nd Amendment you have a right to own a AR-15 with a 100 round mag if that's your belief, but don't turn right around and then blame X-Boxs or movies for the problem.

Not many headlines where you see "20 year old breaks into school and kills 26 with an X-Box."

Be real clear on this.  I exposed my kids to guns.  My son had an AR-15 I purchased for him and he had a number of AKs that he bought as he got real interested in the different versions.  I still have 2 of his AKs along with my AR.   Also understand I played shoot em up video games with my kids. My son was a big time Counterstrike fan.  Day of Defeat was good fun, Quake, Rogue Spear..   I just saw somewhere that the shooter loved Counterstrike.  Oh no! My son had AKs and played Counterstrike!    Seems to me my daughter and her husband consider "Scarface' one of their favorite movies along with "The Godfather".  She's a 4th grade teacher.  She still comes home to play "Army of Two' and Halo with me on occasion.   How dare she teach children!  She and her peers want nothing to do with guns in their school.  She teaches at an inner city school where there have been two officer involved shootings within a block of them. 

I'm not suggesting banning guns.  Nor do I think putting armed guards in school is the way to go.

Is it not possible to have a discussion on all the possible contributors to the tragedy without the gun owners panicking?  I don't feel threatened by folks looking at how access to guns played into this anymore then I do them looking at how to get address dealing with mental health issues, or looking at how movies and media might contribute as well.  None should be untouchable.  And in the end I don't think anything will change.  At best we'll quit cutting resources for mental health and social services so that parents don't have to deal with those issues on their own. 

And all the guys who blew their bank rolls on panic buying will be stuck with over priced guns just as they were when the last totally ineffectual "Ban' ended.

Dan/CorkyJr
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Offline Widewing

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Re: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...
« Reply #157 on: December 22, 2012, 11:34:50 PM »
The point being, the head of the NRA stood up and said don't you dare step on the 2nd Amendment and then proceeded to blame the 1st Amendment for the problem.  Hypocritical don't ya think?


Go ahead and argue that based on the 2nd Amendment you have a right to own a AR-15 with a 100 round mag if that's your belief, but don't turn right around and then blame X-Boxs or movies for the problem.

Not many headlines where you see "20 year old breaks into school and kills 26 with an X-Box."

Be real clear on this.  I exposed my kids to guns.  My son had an AR-15 I purchased for him and he had a number of AKs that he bought as he got real interested in the different versions.  I still have 2 of his AKs along with my AR.   Also understand I played shoot em up video games with my kids. My son was a big time Counterstrike fan.  Day of Defeat was good fun, Quake, Rogue Spear..   I just saw somewhere that the shooter loved Counterstrike.  Oh no! My son had AKs and played Counterstrike!    Seems to me my daughter and her husband consider "Scarface' one of their favorite movies along with "The Godfather".  She's a 4th grade teacher.  She still comes home to play "Army of Two' and Halo with me on occasion.   How dare she teach children!  She and her peers want nothing to do with guns in their school.  She teaches at an inner city school where there have been two officer involved shootings within a block of them.  

I'm not suggesting banning guns.  Nor do I think putting armed guards in school is the way to go.

Is it not possible to have a discussion on all the possible contributors to the tragedy without the gun owners panicking?  I don't feel threatened by folks looking at how access to guns played into this anymore then I do them looking at how to get address dealing with mental health issues, or looking at how movies and media might contribute as well.  None should be untouchable.  And in the end I don't think anything will change.  At best we'll quit cutting resources for mental health and social services so that parents don't have to deal with those issues on their own.  

And all the guys who blew their bank rolls on panic buying will be stuck with over priced guns just as they were when the last totally ineffectual "Ban' ended.



Rights carry with them, responsibilities. Not all speech is protected. Specifically, speech that can cause serious harm or speech that threatens or is used to frighten. The entertainment industry certainly contributes to our broken culture. When criticized for the extreme violence they push for profit, they refuse to accept any responsibility, but point to guns. This industry needs to be accountable.

I think that kids with reality issues can be adversely affected by the non-stop violence in film, TV and video games. Clearly, desensitizing kids towards violence isn't anything good.

When I grew up, violence on TV was minimal. Violence on film was tame in comparison to what we see today. We did not have video games. We did not have the now common mass killings. Kids played with toy guns, but didn't shoot people with real ones. There was a clearly defined line between reality and fantasy. That line is now anything but clear in the minds of some young people. The number of fistfights at the high school I graduated from in 1971 has risen from less than a dozen in 1971 to over 80 in 2011. Why?

Today, violence dominates current pop culture. Endless, excessive violence fills most films directed at young adults. TV is nearly as bad, and the level of violence in video games is pretty stark. This nation is growing a generation of desensitized and confused young people. Add some mental illness or metal disorder and you have mayhem. Mental heath care in this country is a mess.

I know a woman whose 26 year-old son is mentally ill. He frequently gets extremely angry and abuses his mother, threatening her, pushing her and sometimes even striking her. She calls the police, and the son is taken to and admitted into a hospital for few days of observation. They adjust his medications (which he often refuses to take at home) and release him to abuse his mom again. Over and over it's happened. Sooner or later, he'll do her serious harm or simply kill the woman. This screwball spends much of his waking hours playing video games. His mom attempted to stop this, but his reaction was so violent that she backed off, badly frightened. She's hired a lawyer to begin the process of getting him probated. This is how our nation deals with this situation in the 21st century... It's nothing less than idiocy.

These mass shootings are a recent phenomena. They are perpetrated by young, college age men, and sometimes high school age too. There's a pattern to be seen, and it is part and parcel of the prevailing culture, as well as the lack of a real mental health policy and not the result of firearm ownership.
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Offline RedBull1

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Re: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...
« Reply #158 on: December 22, 2012, 11:45:57 PM »
Err, perhaps I should just keep my mouth shut on the subject, sorry

 :salute
« Last Edit: December 22, 2012, 11:49:09 PM by RedBull1 »
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Offline Widewing

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Re: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...
« Reply #159 on: December 22, 2012, 11:50:15 PM »
The close range < 30 ft spread on any shot gun is negligible.  For that matter, small shot is recommended for cqb due to it's limited ability to carry through walls yet remain lethal against unarmored opponents. 

I wouldn't use smaller than #4 shot. In my HD shotgun, I load six 00 buckshot, with 6 more on a butt stock mounted carrier. Bird shot is useless as it will not reliably penetrate to vital organs. Low brass bird shot will not cycle the action of many semi-auto shotguns. My thoughts are simple. My goal is to stop the bad guy. The most sure way to stop him is to make him dead. If he/they retreat, let 'em go.... Otherwise.. Weapons free.
My regards,

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Offline MarineUS

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Re: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...
« Reply #160 on: December 23, 2012, 12:11:58 AM »
I'll still take my 12 ga shotgun, over a rifle for home defense. The pellets are not going to penetrate multiple walls and end up hitting one of my next door neighbors in their beds. I live in a suburban neighborhood where the houses are 50 feet apart. I have an M1 Garand I would only consider firing if my shotgun is empty and my wife's shotgun is empty. I would hate to send 30.06 rounds towards any of my neighbors homes.
If you hit your target with the rifle, you're good to go. The body should slow it enough that (if your house was built and not "thrown together") it should stop the rifle round. :P

My preference is a pistol for home defense though. When I pick up a shotgun I just want to go shoot some "clays".
Like, ya know, when that thing that makes you move, it has pistons and things, When your thingamajigy is providing power, you do not hear other peoples thingamajig when they are providing power.

HiTech

Offline rabbidrabbit

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Re: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...
« Reply #161 on: December 23, 2012, 06:44:33 AM »
I wouldn't use smaller than #4 shot. In my HD shotgun, I load six 00 buckshot, with 6 more on a butt stock mounted carrier. Bird shot is useless as it will not reliably penetrate to vital organs. Low brass bird shot will not cycle the action of many semi-auto shotguns. My thoughts are simple. My goal is to stop the bad guy. The most sure way to stop him is to make him dead. If he/they retreat, let 'em go.... Otherwise.. Weapons free.
[/quote


I think we agree.  The write ups I went through recommended heavier bird or light buck shot in the home defense situation.  More rounds with enough energy to do severe damage at under 30ft.  There was very little spread at that close of a range so the net mass of the smaller shots acted as if they where a large mass which transferred all of it's energy within the first eight inches.   Overall, I'd prefer a .40 or above pistol but the 12 guage is very effective if you're defensive.

Offline Infidelz

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Re: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...
« Reply #162 on: December 23, 2012, 07:01:39 AM »
So based on your logic then the best solution is to give everyone an AR-15 and require they carry it loaded all the time.  That way everyone will see everyone else with a loaded gun.  You go the bank and there's the teller with the barrel of her AR-15 pointed at you.  No way you are going to rob that bank.  My daughter the grade school teacher can just have hers loaded on the desk pointed at the kids.  No behavior problems then.

Even better.  We'll increase graduation rates.   you can only get your AR-15 at graduation with a 3.0 grade point average or better.   This way we'll know who the underachievers out there.  Maybe we should only allow those gainfully employed to have them.  That way we can identify the unemployed and the drop outs. 

Think about it. only the best and the brightest able to wander freely with long guns so that everyone knows the lead will fly if they try and start something.  No more behavior problems from teenagers as how would they dare act up knowing the teachers or the parents might open fire.   No one would consider smacking their spouse as they'd be gunned down instead.  The kid brings your daughter home late from that first date?  There you are, loaded for bear.  Bet he's on time.

If you drive drunk you lose your license and your gun.  Talk about ashamed.  No one would dare go postal for rear of the firefight that would follow.

You've solved it!  We've solved it!

I appreciate your inspirational post in response to mine.  I was inspired to come up with a practical solution :aok

 :huh Sorry Guppo, your writings are not based on my logic or what I suggested. I see it as another attempt to degrade our second amendment rights. Further, your imaginings seem strange and desperate to me. For that i feel sorry that you weren't instilled with the proper values and experiences when growing up.  :ahand

Not everyone wants long guns (but they have a right to them) and not everyone should have them (only those permitted by law). So far it seems the progressives and Chinese Government are in violent agreement. Need to get rid of the guns. It will make it easier when they foreclose on us.
http://rendezvous.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/12/15/china-calls-for-no-delay-on-gun-controls-in-u-s/

Infidelz

Offline Infidelz

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Re: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...
« Reply #163 on: December 23, 2012, 07:23:40 AM »
going to buy a PA-63 right now :aok

The CZ-82 is also a good choice in that caliber. Holds 50% more rounds and very handy and reliable. Classic Firearms carries both (a polish P-64) and offers second magazines for 20 bucks.

Offline TwinBoom

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Re: Gun sales today...pretty amazing...
« Reply #164 on: December 23, 2012, 09:06:36 AM »
The CZ-82 is also a good choice in that caliber. Holds 50% more rounds and very handy and reliable. Classic Firearms carries both (a polish P-64) and offers second magazines for 20 bucks.

Yeah looked at them but liked the look and feel of the PA-63 better
TBs Sounds 
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