Author Topic: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38  (Read 4443 times)

Offline BluBerry

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Re: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38
« Reply #30 on: July 26, 2013, 07:11:21 PM »
I always thought it was simple..

Easy

 




Hard







 :P

 :lol

Offline 10thmd

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Re: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38
« Reply #31 on: July 26, 2013, 07:12:01 PM »
I landed 8 in a Stuka-g2 2 of which where aircraft. I had to land and rearm it, but I did so missing the tail wheel.
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Offline Perrine

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Re: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38
« Reply #32 on: July 26, 2013, 07:45:56 PM »
I always thought it was simple..

Easy

 
(Image removed from quote.)



Hard




(Image removed from quote.)


 :P



190 is one of those planes that's easy to fly (all x/y/z controls feels "harmonized" and all "in sync") but dang suicidal to do slow, edge-of-envelope 1-on-1 dogfights in due to narrow window of speed (400+ = you can turn ; below 300 = brick!) when it comes to "turning" ("turning" as in relying too much on elevator instead of complimenting it with aileron+rudder)

I think i've heard an axiom somewhere when it comes to fighter aircraft (forgot the exact quote) but it basically comes down to this:

1.  stable plane/platform =  less 'manuverable' (in a 'TnB' sense)
2.  plane that's inherently unstable = manuverable (in a 'TnB' sense)
Reply
« Last Edit: July 26, 2013, 07:58:23 PM by Perrine »

Offline Shifty

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Re: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38
« Reply #33 on: July 26, 2013, 07:50:30 PM »


190D is one of those planes that's easy to fly (all x/y/z controls feels "harmonized" and all "in sync") but dang impossible (and suicidal) to do slow edge-of-envelope 1-on-1 dogfights in.

I think i've heard an axiom somewhere when it comes to fighter aircraft (forgot the exact quote) but it basically comes down to this:

1.  stable plane/platform =  less 'manuverable' (in a 'TnB' sense)
2.  plane that's inherently unstable = manuverable (in a 'TnB' sense)
Reply

That's all fine and dandy but the silhouette I posted was an A8.

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Offline dedalos

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Re: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38
« Reply #34 on: July 26, 2013, 07:51:01 PM »
You don't need to know any of what you typed about the Spit 5 or any of the easy mode planes to fly them into survivability.  You DO need to know those things if you are to fly them at your skill level.  See the difference?  A noob can and does survive in, and even excel quickly in those planes without needing to know what you know, hence, easy mode.  

I disagree.  If a 38 plays the E game a spit5 can turn all it wants but it may just delay death if the pilot is good.  I still don;t see what you mean by easy.  Are you considering it easy because it can turn good?  A D9 for example would just BnZ it for ever with no danger to its pilot at all.  Just don't turn with it.  Are we talking about easy to stay alive by running?  Then I would say easy is 51, 190, LA etc.

I also disagree with the skill level comment.  If you try to follow any one up in a spit5 and you get too slow, or if you loop and get too slow at the top you are in for a nasty surprise.  There is nothing I can do to take advantage of that nasty float like a feather stall so skill levels are not into play.  The plane can turn good but that is it.  Not to mention its ammo load sucks so a new guy is not going to get a lot of kills with that either.

Quote
How many  good Spit pilots have you seen only to find they suck in K4, 152, mossier, 110s F6Fs etc.  

Non really.  All the good (and I mean good not people who say they are good) pilots give me the same amount of trouble.  If we are equal it comes down to plane knowledge but I never had anyone good suck just because they did not fly the plane every day.

Quote
You gave examples f advanced knowledge of planes to which makes you excellent in those.  My examples are to show a lesser degree of skill can achieve a decent result because the plane itself requires less.

Thats because I am not talking about a new guy on his first day.  A new guy after a few months that has flown the 38 a few times.  Actually, BnZ is the first thing most new guys try so you will see a new guy in a 38 do that before he tries to burn.  To be honest, a new guy will not survive the encounter no matter what plane he is in.  In my experience, I will kill him faster if he is in a spit because he will try to turn.  In a 38 he has the option of taking a few shots and go away.  So, again, does that make the 38 easy?

What exactly does a 38 require that any other plane does not?  What is it that a spit does not require?  Are we talking about trimming the plane?  I have never ever trimmed a plane since day one (ok the P39 a couple of times in the DA to see if it made a difference).  I still think you guys make this game sound over complicated.  The rules are simple and very similar  for every plane:  Manage your speed at the merge, throttle control, solve the puzzle of getting an angle on your opponent, do not take your eyes off of him.  They all apply to the spit also.

In any case, I think I could come up with a list of things that a 38 will do better than a spit5 or any other plane and they do not require a player to be genius to figure them out.  Will that make it easy?  No.  They are all easy.  They take off by them selves, they land with the gear up, engine management is not required, some can ping you from 1K out, no G forces are felt, your head can turn in any direction while you are pulling Gs, flaps retract automatically,  they only deploy if speed allows, pilot wounds are not really wounds allowing you to take any risk, etc etc.  It is an easy mode game no matter what plane you are in.  You think dive flaps and trimming require some skill?

Quote
Edit:  flight data I meant speed, alt etc....not the performance work ups.  Also, in those planes, they turn so well, the max turn speeds aren't that much different performance-wise than not.  They turn better than the other categories regardless of speed.

Same argument again.  A spit can turn all it wants.  If the 38 plays the E game there is nothing the spit can do
Quote from: 2bighorn on December 15, 2010 at 03:46:18 PM
Dedalos pretty much ruined DA.

Offline Karnak

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Re: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38
« Reply #35 on: July 26, 2013, 07:55:20 PM »
I always thought it was simple..

Easy

 
(Image removed from quote.)



Hard




(Image removed from quote.)


 :P
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Offline dedalos

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Re: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38
« Reply #36 on: July 26, 2013, 07:55:49 PM »


190D is one of those planes that's easy to fly (all x/y/z controls feels "harmonized" and all "in sync") but dang impossible (and suicidal) to do slow edge-of-envelope 1-on-1 dogfights in.

I think i've heard an axiom somewhere when it comes to fighter aircraft (forgot the exact quote) but it basically comes down to this:

1.  stable plane/platform =  less 'manuverable' (in a 'TnB' sense)
2.  plane that's inherently unstable = manuverable (in a 'TnB' sense)
Reply

190D9 is what I call an interceptor.  It is not meant to dog fight.  It is for hunting bombers and BnZ.  So, comparing it to a dog fighter and claiming the dog fighter is easy to fight in is kind of silly.  At list that is my opinion about the 190 in real life.
Quote from: 2bighorn on December 15, 2010 at 03:46:18 PM
Dedalos pretty much ruined DA.

Offline Perrine

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Re: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38
« Reply #37 on: July 26, 2013, 07:59:07 PM »
190D9 is what I call an interceptor.  It is not meant to dog fight.  It is for hunting bombers and BnZ.  So, comparing it to a dog fighter and claiming the dog fighter is easy to fight in is kind of silly.  At list that is my opinion about the 190 in real life.

That's all fine and dandy but the silhouette I posted was an A8.

I  meant to say 190s in general,  not just the D (see edit)

Offline Guppy35

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Re: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38
« Reply #38 on: July 26, 2013, 08:32:54 PM »
I m confused.  What do we mean by easy or hard?  It depends on how you use it and against what plane and player. What does easy mean?  The only time I have trouble against a 38 is when there are 2 other 38s around. Does that make it a hard plane or is mine easier to fly?

I seem to recall in the not too distant past having some good brawls with some guy named dedalos in a Ki-84 while I was in a 38G.  No help and no alt on em too.  Won some, lost some.  So lets not get too carried away :)
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Offline dedalos

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Re: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38
« Reply #39 on: July 26, 2013, 10:06:27 PM »
I seem to recall in the not too distant past having some good brawls with some guy named dedalos in a Ki-84 while I was in a 38G.  No help and no alt on em too.  Won some, lost some.  So lets not get too carried away :)

Ok ok  :lol  But it took a dedicated 38 bus driver.  I really don't have any problems against a 38 in the MA.  It does not mean they don't kill me.  It just means that the plane had nothing to do with my death.  I probably screwed up bad or the other guy was just better.  But the majority of them will loop loop run rinse and repeat, but that says more about the pilot and not the plane.
 
Did you really win a few? Was I caring bombs or something?  :headscratch: :rofl
Quote from: 2bighorn on December 15, 2010 at 03:46:18 PM
Dedalos pretty much ruined DA.

Offline Guppy35

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Re: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38
« Reply #40 on: July 26, 2013, 10:17:44 PM »
Ok ok  :lol  But it took a dedicated 38 bus driver.  I really don't have any problems against a 38 in the MA.  It does not mean they don't kill me.  It just means that the plane had nothing to do with my death.  I probably screwed up bad or the other guy was just better.  But the majority of them will loop loop run rinse and repeat, but that says more about the pilot and not the plane.
 
Did you really win a few? Was I caring bombs or something?  :headscratch: :rofl

You said you had too much fuel if I remember right :)

Was good fun too as I recall :aok
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Offline HL117

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Re: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38
« Reply #41 on: July 26, 2013, 10:24:38 PM »
I say neither to the OPs question, fair, average, does all things with an average bent, one thing it excels at is attraction but think that was already established in this thread, makes for a big target, would be curious to see some numbers on the size of the hit bubble compared to say a yak or LA7 ingame.
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Offline dedalos

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Re: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38
« Reply #42 on: July 26, 2013, 11:27:59 PM »
You said you had too much fuel if I remember right :)

Was good fun too as I recall :aok

Bah, easy mode 38.   :furious
Quote from: 2bighorn on December 15, 2010 at 03:46:18 PM
Dedalos pretty much ruined DA.

Offline StokesAk

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Re: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38
« Reply #43 on: July 26, 2013, 11:48:49 PM »
Because the P-38 is a "Jack of all trades" it will 8 times out of 10 be able to beat another plane in a specific fighting style either it be slow turning or a veticle fight.
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Offline olds442

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Re: "Easy" or "hard"? Starring the AH P-38
« Reply #44 on: July 27, 2013, 08:02:26 AM »

Hey big guy, its a joke calm down :P
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