Author Topic: An Intruder last night….  (Read 3741 times)

Offline jimson

  • AvA Staff Member
  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 7202
      • The Axis vs Allies Arena
Re: An Intruder last night….
« Reply #75 on: January 25, 2014, 10:44:45 PM »


except........ most people who are "burglars" are just petty thief's.....they are not there to physically hurt you....most often crack heads looking for goods to sell....

that a b$tch slap....or 2...... will more then work on....


It's an individual thing, but not everyone is physically imposing enough to know that they can prevail in a fist fight with any intruder and there are some cases that if you assume someone is merely a crack head who means you no harm, your assumption will lead to your lifeless body being the only thing standing between an intruder and your family.

In a choice between possible harm to my family and the life of an intruder, my family is precious.

Offline Widewing

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8800
Re: An Intruder last night….
« Reply #76 on: January 25, 2014, 10:58:08 PM »
If possible, I would never approach a building from the perpetrator's only course of exit.

If there is a window, peek first and locate the perp and see if he is unarmed.

If he's unarmed, shine the light in a window opposite from the door......if there is a window.

When he runs out, break out the wrist rocket with some round salt pellets.........this will make him run faster when applied to the middle of the back.

Corporal punishment for the win.

Fire a few shots from a gun that go safely wide while yelling "I will slit your throat and drink your blood".

Start up vehicle and careen around as if hunting him down......he will surely hear it.

He will never return.

Remember, you are in alaska where gunshots are largely ignored.

This is all rather silly and utterly unrealistic.

You shoot when you have to. You can't hesitate, or you very well may die. You don't bluff or bluster. No warning shots. You don't shoot to wound. You don't play games. Defending one's life is as serious as it gets. When seconds count, the cops are at least minutes away. Oh, and Colmbo, if you ever have to use a firearm to challenge a criminal again, safety off before your encounter them. Fine motor skills go to hell when the adrenalin is flowing. The only functions you want to have remaining to do is develop your sight picture and pull the trigger. And when you shoot, you continue to shoot until the bad guy is down and not moving.

I've had a few encounters where a firearm was needed to end trouble. Only once, when I was 12 (1965), did I have to discharge a weapon in the process of self defense. Now, nearly 50 years later, I still feel bad that circumstances forced me to do what I did. In that case, I was dealing with three older teenagers (the ring leader was 17) wanting to take my Crosman Model 99 .22 cal pellet rifle from me, on our own property. I refused to hand it over. My 8 year-old brother was with me, and he was very frightened. The oldest one threatened to take it and kick my butt. I figured I was going to get a beating if I didn't hand it over, and a sure fire whoopin' by dad if I did.. Choices... I aimed it at him and told him to leave. He laughed and asked, "Whadda ya goin' to do, shoot me?"

I made my choice.... I shot him in the thigh. Low power (450 fps). It hurt, a lot. He fell onto his backside and stared at his leg, the pellet no doubt having broken the skin. He looked at me. I cycled the lever and pulled the hammer back to max power (700 fps). I aimed at his face. "You better leave now", I told him. His friends pulled him to his feet, and they left. Out of sight, they yelled some insults. I fully expected a visit from the police. Didn't get one, though. I told my father what happened. He didn't get angry... "I guess you did what you had to do", he said. He told me not to venture away from the vicinity of the house with the Crosman. I didn't. Thereafter, I did my shooting behind the garage and not in our woods.

Not long after, walking home from school, I ran into Warren again, this time with just one friend. He ran his mouth. "You ain't got no gun now, do you?" "No", I replied, "but you know I'll go home and get it. Leave me alone, Warren." I turned and walked away. He ran his mouth some more as I left, but I ignored him and continued on my way.

The next year, my dad bought me a Marlin model 10, single shot bolt action .22 rifle. That, we shot in the garage or old barn on the corner of the property. Earned some money using it to shoot crows for the local farmer's bounty. I would sling it across my back, shove a box of 50 cartridges in my pocket and ride up the road to the farms, right past the school. No one looked at me twice. These days, there would be a SWAT team dispatched and helicopters circling.... How times have changed. Today, society is completely paranoid.

About a year and a half after this incident, Warren was drafted. He ended up in Vietnam. He returned with an severe alcohol habit, and literally drank himself into oblivion. In the late 1980s, at a backyard party, drunk to a near stupor, he dived into the shallow end of an in-ground pool and broke his neck. Paralyzed from the neck down, he died a couple of years later. A tragic figure, Warren was an example of how to do just about everything wrong.

In short, shooting someone is traumatic, for the shooter and the other guy. It's something you want to avoid if at all possible. You may be fully justified, but that will not change the fact of what happened. You hurt or killed someone, and that will follow you in your dreams forever. You learn to live with it, but you'll never be comfortable with it.
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline RotBaron

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3451
Re: An Intruder last night….
« Reply #77 on: January 26, 2014, 12:18:27 AM »
In Arizona, the criteria is if the reasonable person would be in fear for his life or great bodily harm. You would not need to establish that an intruder had the means to kill you. Unless the intruder was an 8 year old boy, the fact that they broke into your house would generally be enough to escape charges.

That is true and not exactly true. A reasonable person needs to establish whether or not the perp intends to inflict great bodily harm, rape, etc. or use lethal force. It's subjective and a judgement call too. If said perp is has behaved in a way that would lead a reasonable person to fear for their life, etc., then it must be established why the person feared for their life. Usually that is, as I said, easily met if the perp has a weapon. If the perp did not possess the means, i.e. great size/strength advantage, the victim is elderly, injured, etc., making the claim you feared for your life is going to be met with, why/what made you fear for your life.

The reason I say in such indefinite terms is because this will (possibly) not be explained/discussed between the victim and an officer, and/or DA/CA. These explanations/terms are ones that are explained to a jury. The County attorney is not going to be asking you if you met all the criteria to fear for your life, they will determine that on their own. Nobody wants to be in the position where their defense attorney is arguing these points in court.

Attorneys live in the gray, law is not supposed to be gray, but inevitably it is as it depends on other people to interpret.
They're casting their bait over there, see?

Offline ink

  • Persona Non Grata
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 11274
Re: An Intruder last night….
« Reply #78 on: January 26, 2014, 02:49:01 AM »
It's an individual thing, but not everyone is physically imposing enough to know that they can prevail in a fist fight with any intruder and there are some cases that if you assume someone is merely a crack head who means you no harm, your assumption will lead to your lifeless body being the only thing standing between an intruder and your family.

In a choice between possible harm to my family and the life of an intruder, my family is precious.

I absolutely agree :salute

I would kill without hesitation to protect my family.
This is all rather silly and utterly unrealistic.

You shoot when you have to. You can't hesitate, or you very well may die. You don't bluff or bluster. No warning shots. You don't shoot to wound. You don't play games. Defending one's life is as serious as it gets. When seconds count, the cops are at least minutes away. Oh, and Colmbo, if you ever have to use a firearm to challenge a criminal again, safety off before your encounter them. Fine motor skills go to hell when the adrenalin is flowing. The only functions you want to have remaining to do is develop your sight picture and pull the trigger. And when you shoot, you continue to shoot until the bad guy is down and not moving.

I've had a few encounters where a firearm was needed to end trouble. Only once, when I was 12 (1965), did I have to discharge a weapon in the process of self defense. Now, nearly 50 years later, I still feel bad that circumstances forced me to do what I did. In that case, I was dealing with three older teenagers (the ring leader was 17) wanting to take my Crosman Model 99 .22 cal pellet rifle from me, on our own property. I refused to hand it over. My 8 year-old brother was with me, and he was very frightened. The oldest one threatened to take it and kick my butt. I figured I was going to get a beating if I didn't hand it over, and a sure fire whoopin' by dad if I did.. Choices... I aimed it at him and told him to leave. He laughed and asked, "Whadda ya goin' to do, shoot me?"

I made my choice.... I shot him in the thigh. Low power (450 fps). It hurt, a lot. He fell onto his backside and stared at his leg, the pellet no doubt having broken the skin. He looked at me. I cycled the lever and pulled the hammer back to max power (700 fps). I aimed at his face. "You better leave now", I told him. His friends pulled him to his feet, and they left. Out of sight, they yelled some insults. I fully expected a visit from the police. Didn't get one, though. I told my father what happened. He didn't get angry... "I guess you did what you had to do", he said. He told me not to venture away from the vicinity of the house with the Crosman. I didn't. Thereafter, I did my shooting behind the garage and not in our woods.

Not long after, walking home from school, I ran into Warren again, this time with just one friend. He ran his mouth. "You ain't got no gun now, do you?" "No", I replied, "but you know I'll go home and get it. Leave me alone, Warren." I turned and walked away. He ran his mouth some more as I left, but I ignored him and continued on my way.

The next year, my dad bought me a Marlin model 10, single shot bolt action .22 rifle. That, we shot in the garage or old barn on the corner of the property. Earned some money using it to shoot crows for the local farmer's bounty. I would sling it across my back, shove a box of 50 cartridges in my pocket and ride up the road to the farms, right past the school. No one looked at me twice. These days, there would be a SWAT team dispatched and helicopters circling.... How times have changed. Today, society is completely paranoid.

About a year and a half after this incident, Warren was drafted. He ended up in Vietnam. He returned with an severe alcohol habit, and literally drank himself into oblivion. In the late 1980s, at a backyard party, drunk to a near stupor, he dived into the shallow end of an in-ground pool and broke his neck. Paralyzed from the neck down, he died a couple of years later. A tragic figure, Warren was an example of how to do just about everything wrong.

In short, shooting someone is traumatic, for the shooter and the other guy. It's something you want to avoid if at all possible. You may be fully justified, but that will not change the fact of what happened. You hurt or killed someone, and that will follow you in your dreams forever. You learn to live with it, but you'll never be comfortable with it.


 :salute

Offline Plawranc

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2683
      • Youtube Channel
Re: An Intruder last night….
« Reply #79 on: January 26, 2014, 03:20:39 AM »
In my nation we aren't allowed firearms and are prosecuted for hurting anyone even in self defence.

However.

A police officer once told a guy who owned a shop before the universal firearms ban took place after the Port Arthur Shooting. (Australian Gun Control History)

"Shoot the *****er in the face, and then put a hole in the roof. You fired a warning shot... no one can tell which shot was which"
DaPacman - 71 Squadron RAF

"There are only two things that make life worth living. Fornication and Aviation"

Offline RotBaron

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3451
Re: An Intruder last night….
« Reply #80 on: January 26, 2014, 03:41:03 AM »
In my nation we aren't allowed firearms and are prosecuted for hurting anyone even in self defence.

However.

A police officer once told a guy who owned a shop before the universal firearms ban took place after the Port Arthur Shooting. (Australian Gun Control History)

"Shoot the *****er in the face, and then put a hole in the roof. You fired a warning shot... no one can tell which shot was which"

I thought you were in Wisconsin, as I responded to in your thread  :headscratch:  Well that changes everything, TELL ON THEM,  :old:  Jus kddn.   I guess I'm getting senile   :rofl

Or maybe just crotchety in my mid years.
They're casting their bait over there, see?

Offline zack1234

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 13182
Re: An Intruder last night….
« Reply #81 on: January 26, 2014, 04:47:03 AM »
I have a set of tea spoons and a old sock for defense :old:

You use maximum force and hope its enough :old:

If its scum your dealing with and he is despatched job well done :old:

And if a rich liberal starts complaining punch them in the balls :old:
There are no pies stored in this plane overnight

                          
The GFC
Pipz lived in the Wilderness near Ontario

Offline Nimrod45

  • Copper Member
  • **
  • Posts: 280
Re: An Intruder last night….
« Reply #82 on: January 26, 2014, 06:17:17 AM »
I live in Alaska as well Columbo, it's seems like there is an ever increasing amount of Scumbags running around.  I have had people come in my house twice while I wasn't there.  Cant wait till the day I am there and it happens, it will be a good old fashion Old West party then.

Offline MrRiplEy[H]

  • Persona Non Grata
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 11633
Re: An Intruder last night….
« Reply #83 on: January 26, 2014, 08:06:00 AM »
The way I see it, the second someone makes a choice to threat you or invade your property he just lost all his human rights and became just a hostile force to be dealt with.

Zero compassion from me. The only thing that limits is your own liability.
Definiteness of purpose is the starting point of all achievement. –W. Clement Stone

Offline BreakingBad

  • Copper Member
  • **
  • Posts: 271
Re: An Intruder last night….
« Reply #84 on: January 26, 2014, 08:12:07 AM »
Fire a few shots from a gun that go safely wide while yelling "I will slit your throat and drink your blood".

Hahaha, that's funny.  Don't forget the insane laugh as if you're really enjoying it. :devil

Offline MrRiplEy[H]

  • Persona Non Grata
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 11633
Re: An Intruder last night….
« Reply #85 on: January 26, 2014, 08:29:37 AM »
Hahaha, that's funny.  Don't forget the insane laugh as if you're really enjoying it. :devil

It would be even more fun if the gun jammed while doing that and the attacker would wield a knife at close range in response.  :banana:
Definiteness of purpose is the starting point of all achievement. –W. Clement Stone

Offline ink

  • Persona Non Grata
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 11274
Re: An Intruder last night….
« Reply #86 on: January 26, 2014, 09:03:33 AM »
I have a set of tea spoons and a old sock for defense :old:

You use maximum force and hope its enough :old:

If its scum your dealing with and he is despatched job well done :old:

And if a rich liberal starts complaining punch them in the balls :old:


that last one is great :rofl

Offline colmbo

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2246
      • Photos
Re: An Intruder last night….
« Reply #87 on: January 26, 2014, 09:37:23 AM »
I live in Alaska as well Columbo, it's seems like there is an ever increasing amount of Scumbags running around.  I have had people come in my house twice while I wasn't there.  Cant wait till the day I am there and it happens, it will be a good old fashion Old West party then.


Had a burglar come in the house while I was home a few years ago.  My basic plan worked then also, confront them, let them decide what comes next.  He left a lot faster than he entered.
Columbo

"When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will always long to return."

Fate whispers to the warrior "You cannot withstand the storm" and the warrior whispers back "I AM THE STORM"

Offline colmbo

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2246
      • Photos
Re: An Intruder last night….
« Reply #88 on: January 26, 2014, 09:55:25 AM »
Oh, and Colmbo, if you ever have to use a firearm to challenge a criminal again, safety off before your encounter them. Fine motor skills go to hell when the adrenalin is flowing. The only functions you want to have remaining to do is develop your sight picture and pull the trigger.

I'll leave the safety on until the rifle comes to my shoulder.  It is the way I was taught and is the way I train/practice.  While fine motor skills do deteriorate under stress training and practice, the development of muscle memory, can overcome that.  You will do under stress what you have developed as muscle memory (which is why it is very important to train like you fight, fight like you train)

The safety on an M4/AR15 is much easier to operate than the retention devices on the l holster I carried on duty, I never had any issues drawing the weapon and did it under much greater stress than this encounter the other evening….I practice with the M4 nearly every day so I'm not concerned about being able to put it in action if needed.

Columbo

"When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will always long to return."

Fate whispers to the warrior "You cannot withstand the storm" and the warrior whispers back "I AM THE STORM"

Offline CAP1

  • Radioactive Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 22287
      • The Axis Vs Allies Arena
Re: An Intruder last night….
« Reply #89 on: January 26, 2014, 10:05:35 AM »
With a bit less of, you know? Starving to death?  :D

Sounds like fun. I may just do that if I can find time.

 you ain't gonna starve while your camping. if you can find time to play that video game, you can find time to go camping. or if you don't wanna camp, then just spend the day hiking somewhere.
ingame 1LTCAP
80th FS "Headhunters"
S.A.P.P.- Secret Association Of P-38 Pilots (Lightning in a Bottle)