State of Sim'ing 2024 Survey

[The Fugitive]

I remember when IL-2 first came out. 2001? Chatting with an AH squad member and told him I thought the IL-2 graphics were better and would like to see AH and IL-2 collaborate. He didn't agree and of course there was no collaboration. Graphics are important, to almost everyone. So is realism in both modeling and physics.

I dont agree with that at all. Graphics may be important to some but not "almost everyone". I know 30+ people in my squad that would rather fly together in AH with its "not up to date" graphics than spend any time flying pretty planes in DCS. Personally I could never understand the attraction of "Microsoft Flight Simulator". Plane checks, warm ups, taxi to runway while getting instructions from the tower, wait for permission to launch, fly a charted course, request permission to enter airspace, request permission to land, follow instructions on landing runway and taxi info and shut down at the gate. Hell I was bored just writing this!

DCS is much the same to me. Way to much time mapping keys, too much time learning those keys, too much time on start-up and launch, too much time to target, and if lucky an enemy aircraft to fight. Just too much time wasted. Sure its pretty as hell, but not much fun, just boring.

Its very nitch game, more so than Aces High. MSFS caters to those people who are afraid to fly, or like to build their own cockpits (which Ive done) or they would have taken the time to get their licenses and done it for real. It seems to me that those in DCS are afraid to fly against real people and so hide behind pretty planes that can shoot down AI. I havent played IL2 for years so Im not sure what they are up to, but if it was better than what we have at Aces High, Aces High would be empty.

With me pushing my YouTube channel on different media outlets a majority of the posts/comments I have been getting from people say "Aces High is still around?".

Personally I think the action far out ways the "pretty planes" aspect any day. VR is handled so much better in AH than any other flight sim Ive played even if the resolution isnt there. The action and how immersive VR makes it  is as Brooke said, "is like a prime-rib dinner vs. McDonald's cheeseburger". 

[AKIron]

What I said is true. You're being defensive of AH. If graphics were not important to almost everyone they never would have progressed to the point they are today and we'd all be playing on Nintendo consoles.

The "pretty planes" defense is weak btw. It says denial to me every time I see it used.

[AKIron]

Don't get me wrong. I enjoyed Aces high as much as anyone. This forum however is not just for fan boys and this particular thread is not AH vs everything else. If AH were truly as great as you and some others here feel it should be there wouldn't be the disparity in interest. I applaud your efforts to draw interest but reality is that I make half assed youtube videos mostly on DCS and I have an aggregate of over 87,000 views. Does anyone here come close to that with AH videos?

Of course if all you want is views just make dog or cat videos.

[CptTrips]

What I said is true. You're being defensive of AH. If graphics were not important to almost everyone they never would have progressed to the point they are today and we'd all be playing on Nintendo consoles.

The "pretty planes" defense is weak btw. It says denial to me every time I see it used.

Other comments from Fugi's Reddit thread:

“These days I think ppl avoid it mainly because of the monthly subscription and there are other alternatives for multiplayer (War Thunder, IL-2 etc), plus Steam regional pricing.
Graphics fidelity is also another factor.”

“Subscription based games are a hard sell nowadays. “

“ remember there being commercials for that game on cable TV lol. I always thought it had a subscription like WOW so I never looked into it because my mom was never going to pay for something like that lol. “

“If I wanted to pay $15 a month to play a 25 year old game, I’d play iRacing. “

If you are going to try and learn from interacting with broader market, you need to listen to all their comments, not just the ones you like.

Listen to the criticism if you are looking for where you might need to improve.
Listen to the praise if you need to be stroked.

[CptTrips]

I dont agree with that at all. Graphics may be important to some but not "almost everyone". I know 30+ people in my squad that would rather fly together in AH with its "not up to date" graphics than spend any time flying pretty planes in DCS.

And those 30+ old geezers probably grew up on AW and WB.  So, that is not surprising.

As far as the current market that didn't, where are your customers at?

You honestly feel it's only because of advertising?  OK.
Animl made a passable vid that could be used in an advertisement.
Setup a Go-Fund-me  and get enough money from the current player base to fund a months worth of media advertising and go prove your point with HT's permission.

If you are correct, that should show a noticeable bump in account creation.  If you can show HT a positive ROI on the advertising test with hard data, I have no doubt he will raise the VC funds to turn on some serious advertising volume and rake in the cash.

[DmonSlyr]

Other comments from Fugi's Reddit thread:

If you are going to try and learn from interacting with broader market, you need to listen to all their comments, not just the ones you like.

Listen to the criticism if you are looking for where you might need to improve.
Listen to the praise if you need to be stroked.

No doubt the subscription is the #1 thing holding AH back. Its just incredibly tough to get an old player to subscribe again just to try the game again. For example, i still hop into Il2 from time to time, but its not my favorite, so if I had to pay $15 just to play it again for a month, I'm not sure I would because I'm not sure how much time I could put into, or if I even wanted to.. thats probably the conundrum so many have. We really need some server FTP custom arenas to get popular in AH. That would go a long way IMO.

[CptTrips]

No doubt the subscription is the #1 thing holding AH back.

Maybe.  It's close. 

IMHO, graphics have the edge in importance.  I think many are not getting further along enough in the sales pipeline to even consider the subscription.

I think, like curb appeal in real-estate, if they pull up and the front looks like an old shack, they are not really even going to care what the loan terms are.  In the first 5 seconds of laying eyes on the property, they are like, "Nope.  Drive on to the next listing.  No need to stop here."

I think the graphics lose you the first large cohort, those that get past that are then culled once they find out it is subscription only without any F2P to entice them.

Fugi's experience with his squamates does suggest a solution though (Assuming that a complete graphics overhaul, reimagining of the monetization model, and the addition of F2P are off the table as possibilities), I don't think there is any realistic chance of attracting meaningful numbers of new, durable customers.

The only path I see is viable is some how reactivating all the old previous players of AH to come back for one last hurahh before the circus leaves town.  That is going to have to take some kind of plan\incentive and effort because obviously it is not going to happen in high enough numbers on it's own to turn the tide. 

All those old players are demographically hitting retirement about now.  It would be the best time of suggesting how they should spend some of that new found free-time.

[Eagler]

Free two weeks should be extended to 90 days

What do you have to lose?

Eagler

[LCADolby]

Have you tried AH and IL2 with max graphics in VR?

IL2 in VR is bonkers!

[The Fugitive]

What I said is true. You're being defensive of AH. If graphics were not important to almost everyone they never would have progressed to the point they are today and we'd all be playing on Nintendo consoles.

The "pretty planes" defense is weak btw. It says denial to me every time I see it used.

Don't get me wrong. I enjoyed Aces high as much as anyone. This forum however is not just for fan boys and this particular thread is not AH vs everything else. If AH were truly as great as you and some others here feel it should be there wouldn't be the disparity in interest. I applaud your efforts to draw interest but reality is that I make half assed youtube videos mostly on DCS and I have an aggregate of over 87,000 views. Does anyone here come close to that with AH videos?

Of course if all you want is views just make dog or cat videos.

OH I get it, I cant be a "fanboi" and stand up for why I think Aces High is better, but you can come here and stand up for DCS and brag about your total youtube views. Sounds a bit lopsided to me. On the other hand, we really are the same. You believe your multi million dollars investment of a game with the "pretty planes" is the best game out there, where I think our cheap, easy to run action packed game is the best and nothing either one of us has to say will convince the other they are wrong.

This is where I agree with Animl. If you dont believe Hitech is going to do any more work on AH, that the game is dieing its slow death, and you dont plan on ever playing again (unless they fix a bunch of things like graphics, realism, and subscriptions) Why are you even here?

[CptTrips]

Why are you even here?

You're just trying to take the argument ad hominem because you have no answers. 

Back to topic.

Where are the customers at?   
Why did 600 a night leave?
Why have they never been replaced?

[AKIron]

OH I get it, I cant be a "fanboi" and stand up for why I think Aces High is better, but you can come here and stand up for DCS and brag about your total youtube views. Sounds a bit lopsided to me. On the other hand, we really are the same. You believe your multi million dollars investment of a game with the "pretty planes" is the best game out there, where I think our cheap, easy to run action packed game is the best and nothing either one of us has to say will convince the other they are wrong.

This is where I agree with Animl. If you dont believe Hitech is going to do any more work on AH, that the game is dieing its slow death, and you dont plan on ever playing again (unless they fix a bunch of things like graphics, realism, and subscriptions) Why are you even here?

I suspect you and animl agree on a lot of things. I don't owe you an explanation for my presence.

[Busher]

You're just trying to take the argument ad hominem because you have no answers. 

Back to topic.

Where are the customers at?   
Why did 600 a night leave?
Why have they never been replaced?

Only my 2 cents but when AH2 went to AH3 a huge block of customers no longer had a machine that would handle the game. Seems they did not re-visit even if they completed an upgrade.

[CptTrips]

Only my 2 cents but when AH2 went to AH3 a huge block of customers no longer had a machine that would handle the game. Seems they did not re-visit even if they completed an upgrade.

That would have been 2017ish?

Lusche had a pretty interesting graph estimating player count off some proxy measurement like  Kills per tour or something?

I seemed to remember the down trend starting way before that.  I think his graph looked like things had rolled over around 2009ish?  It's been a sleigh ride down ever since, though it has flattened a bit last couple of years. 

Doesn't mean events like AHIII didn't give it a booster kick along the way. 

I Kinda felt like canceling of Tour of Duty and the arena split were similar kicks down the slope.

But that doesn't explain why AH can't seem to attract new players to replace them.

[Busher]

But that doesn't explain why AH can't seem to attract new players to replace them.

Maybe because those who had a serious interest in WW2 are too old or dead.

Aviation enthusiasts today all want to be Tom Cruise.