Reperations..........

[Airhead]

Originally posted by StSanta
What we're taking about is paying money to the descendants of slaves. how they're currently treated is unrelated. Whether they're  ebing subjected to a racist society is not what we're discussing.

We're discussing whether they should have reparations or not. And part of that debate is their current status vs where they WOULD have been had *their ancestors* (i.e not them) not been taken slaves.

Address this, and the other points. Building up straw man arguments is laughable. Ignoring other points is dishonest.

Hey, you started the mudslinging with the laughable comment. I'd contend that I mudsling with the best of them. [/B]

StSanta, it WAS laughable tho in an Archie Bunker sort of way. Really, I have no intention of "mudslinging" and if you feel the past treatment of African Americans has no bearing on the reperations issue then I'll play by your rules and ignore past treatment- however, I wonder if reperations would be an issue if we'd had racial equality for the last hundred years or so.

All I can address then is 1) Are African Americans better off today than thier African counterparts and 2) if I'm in favor of reperations or not. Fair enough.

The statement that African Americans are better off than thier African counterparts is debatable given the 500 years of European colonization of Africa, of which the slave trade was a large part. I wonder how many of Africa's problems are a result of colonization and white rule? When Europe pulled out of Africa it created a power vacuum filled by disease, starvation and tinhorn dictatorships. If you murder my family and only wound me then yeah, I guess by your logic I'm better off than I could be. Perhaps a better question is would Africans be better off today without the yoke of European colonizalition they bore for 500 years.

Am I in favor of reporations? No, I'm not- in fact nobody who's posted on the subject has stated they're in favor of reporations. However, in the true spirit of BB debates many posters are continuing on as if some of us actually ARE in favor of reperations. I will say, however, that the more I read here the more I'm rethinking my position on this issue.

[GRUNHERZ]

Does anyone know which group of people protested the most when the slave trade was outlawed?

[funkedup]

I think it was the Croatians.

[Thrawn]

I'm in favour of reperations.

[funkedup]

Spelling Nazi!

[Thrawn]

Originally posted by funkedup
Spelling Nazi!

Your just saying that because I'm not black.

[GRUNHERZ]

Funked...

But seriusly can you guess which group of peoole were most pissed off when slavery was outlawed by the Europeans?

[StSanta]

Airhead, while I'd hate to say so, what white Europeans did in Africa is also unrelated . That's what the Europeans did, not the Americans, and if anything, that'd be an issue about whether and how much Europe should have to pay Africa in reparations

We're dealing with a specific case here: would the blacks in the US be better off in Africa, given the development and history of the place as we know it? I mean, we can't do what-if scenario and base reparations on it.

And we really can't do "would black be.." in a strict sense. We'd have to use statistics and averages.

I contend that 90% of US african americans have a higher disposable income, better living standards etc etc than the average black african.

I'd have to dig through some numbers to back it up though.

[Tumor]

Originally posted by Thrawn
"It's TUMOR (problem spelling Thrawn?) "

Bit me.  Your the one that can't spell tumour.

It's BITE not BIT and YOU'RE not YOUR and... http://www.dictionary.com/search?q=Tumor

Originally posted by Thrawn
Yeah, your opinion is that certain events WILL happen, when you have no way of knowing whether or not they will...unless you can predict the future 100% accurately.

http://www.dictionary.com/search?q=opinion

Might I suggest dear Thrawn, that attempting to dictate another persons opinion is a rather futile exercise in bad judgment.

 http://www.dictionary.com/search?q=futile<< just in case you need a little help.

[Tumor]

Originally posted by funkedup
Affirmative action is a racist income redistribution program.  The government takes jobs and other benefits away from deserving whites and gives them to undeserving non-whites.

Welfare and Social Security and the various medical handout programs also constitute an income redistribution that benefits non-whites.  I have seen statistics (although I don't have them handy, sorry) which show that blacks are overrepresented in these programs, that a black is much more likely than a white to recieve government assistance.  Put another way, the average black recieves more government assistance (monetary) than the average white.  Likewise, the average white pays more taxes into this system than the average black.  Therefore, regardless of intent, the system is effectively a racist income redistribution program which benefits blacks and hurts whites.

OMG FUNKED!!.. you do realize your going straight to hell for even thinking about thinking like that!

[funkedup]

It's the same rationale by which the drug war and the death penalty are declared to be racist.  Results matter more than intent.

[Tumor]

After reparations payments begin... I formally declare my intent to lobby for a program in which any direct decendant of a soldier who fought in the Civil War, for the NORTH send a bill to the reparations committee... a big one.

Tumor

[funkedup]

Originally posted by Tumor
After reparations payments begin... I formally declare my intent to lobby for a program in which any direct decendant of a soldier who fought in the Civil War, for the NORTH send a bill to the reparations committee... a big one.

Tumor

What about the people who were never born because their ancestors died to free the slaves?  Let's calculate the number of potential offspring and their projected earnings and sue for that.  We can put it in a trust fund for white folks.
Also the present value of all expenditures related to the conduct of the Civil War.  Anybody whose ancestors were freed by the Emancipation Proclamation will have to pay.  I'm sure the people building such databases for the reparations movement will lend us their data.

[abunabi]

Guys, I think that we certainly do owe reparations for the years of slavery.  SO, every man, and woman that can prove they were personally held a slave in the United States, pre-Emancipation Proclomation / Civil War should be due, say $10,000,000 each, from the states that allowed, encoraged, or participated in trafficing of slaves.

-Abunabi

[StSanta]

Abunabi has it. That's very fair - if something wrong has been done to YOU by the state, you should get cash.

Wonder how many old ex-slaves will collect this most generous of offers?