The Void between Machine guns and cannons.

[Pooh21]

1 hit from a hispano will when the fight at least 50% of the time each additional hit rachets the percentage up about 25%

[Fishu]

uber hispanos and unuber LW cannons are still true? sheesh..

[MANDOBLE]

Originally posted by Kweassa
targets.. but most usually, they never come within 300~400 yards. Almost never.

600 yards and you are done, 800 yards and you will be more than probably heavy damaged for one or two lucky hits. We are playing something very different than WW2 aerial combat, but with similar performance planes.

[Maverick]

I just can't help it......



A whine has been recorded.

[joeblogs]

If people were willing to share enough information, there are ways to separate the effect of the quality of the plane and the quality of the pilot.  

Otherwise it is nearly impossible to make the right distinctions.

-blogs

Originally posted by Furball
F4U-1C isnt dominant because of its guns.  Its because it is flown by better pilots (perk plane) and it is used as a vulchmobile.

[brady]

MANDOBLE, the Type 99 fires a larger round than the MG 151/20, the Type 99 also fired almost all HEI the tracer round being the only AP round in the chain, while the MG 151/20 fired a more mixed ammo load,The MG 151/20 scores higher do to it's higher rof and the scoring system used to determine overall efectivenss, a scoring system that is not used in AH.

 It should also be noted that the table says that figures are for unscnichorised guns, most MG 151/20 instalations in AH are firing throught the proeller arc and suffer a 10% ( I thnk it's 10%) reduction in preformance, the 205 is a good example of the added benifit you get from the guns being out side the propeller arc.

[Batz]

the mg 151 in ah are fine. Its the mgff thats a bugger. Same as the type 99 mk1.

[MANDOBLE]

brady, AFAIK, 205 guns are sync.

MG151/20 CARTRIDGE POWER: 16
MG151/20 GUN POWER: 192

Type99/2 CARTRIDGE POWER: 15
Type99/2 GUN POWER: 120

Not considering ROF, it seems 151/20 is a more destructive weapon.

[Batz]

To calculate the destructive power of the gun, the 'POWER' factor from the above table has been multiplied by the RoF, expressed in the number of rounds fired per second. This gives the relative 'GUN POWER'

20x101RB = power = 15 * rof  =  'GUN POWER'

20x80RB = power = 14 * rof = 'GUN POWER'


So by Tony's charts a single type 99 mk 2 has a higher "power" then the mg151/20mm. "Gun power" is combination of "power" * rof.

So like Brady said the chart is for unsynched guns. Multiply by synched rof and the "gun power" value you will drop. But it wont change the fact that the type 99 has the potential to be more "desctructive" per round then the mg151.

You cant not consider rof to determin which is a more destructive weapon. 1 20x101RB is more destructive the 1 20x80RB.  What makes the mg151 a better weapon is rof.

Just look at the damager column in table 1

type 99 mk2 (20x101RB) = 154
 
mg151/20 (20X80RB) = 90  /  89  /  206 (M'geschoss)


Its obvious from this which is the more desctructive round (excluding the M'geschoss).

The type 99mk 2 round fer round will do moere damage the the mg151. The mg151 will let you get more rounds on target faster. Just like in ah.

The mg151 is fine.

[MANDOBLE]

Thanks Batz, so, one of every three rounds of 151/20 would be considerably more destructive.

20x82 damage: 110  /  109  /  236
20x101RB: 154 / 154 / 154

Even so, the overal power of 20x82 (151/20) is 16 compared to 15 for 20x101RB (Type99/2).

BTW, you are considerong 20x80RB, listed for MGFF, not 151/20.

[brady]

I am prety shure Mandabol that the 205's MG 151/20's are mounted outside the covered arc of the prop.

[Steve]

The lesser kill ratios of ther F4U-1 can also be attributed to its JABO roll. Very few people select an F4U-1C then take it on higher risk JABO runs.  These attack missions expose the plane to more attacks when it is otherwise occupied(bombing, rocketing).
In fact, I'm confident this is a large reason for the disparity in ratios.

[Batz]

oops you are right i was  cutting and pasting to something else when i must crossed up.

But anyway

20x82RB = 16 power = 110 / 109 / 236

20X10 = 15 power =154

It nots one in every three that is m'geschoss (I will post typical load out later).

In ah we dont have specific round types but averages. Just for arguement if we take the average of the three types API HET and HE (M'geschoss) as listed in Tony's (110+109+236= 455/3 = 151)

154>151 Type 99 mk 2 still is larger.

The Type 99 mk2 is well respresented in AH. So is the mg151/20mm. The type 99 mk1 oth just sux in ah.

[Karnak]

Where are you guys getting these one hit wonder Hispanos?

I practically never get a good effect from one Hispano hitting, and it's not like I don't use the gun.  The same is true of the Type 99 Model II.

Certainly I have a slightly easier time hitting with the Hispano, but the Type 99 Model II and MG151/20 are pretty parable weapons.

I will admit that sometimes a single Hispano hit can be surprising.  I had the left wing torn off of my Spitfire Mk XIV by a single hit from a Spitfire Mk IX while I was zooming.

Frankly, the guns that scare me most in AH are the Browning 50 cal and the MK108 30mm.  The 50s because they are so easy to hit with, hit at such long ranges and come in such large numbers and the 30mm because it is a one hit one kill weapon.  Other than those I don't feel particularly wary around any of the other guns.

[Kweassa]

slightly easier time

 Slightly easier.... Just how much 'slightly easier'?

 Slightly easier by about 300 yards?

 I usually feel safe when I see a plane with one of those 'slightly' worse armaments behind me at 500 yards. But when I see one of those planes armed with 'slightly' easier cannon/gun behind me at 500, I better get ready to open my chute.

 That 'slight' difference, determines whether I die or not.

 Sure, the Type99 and the MG151/20, even the ShVAKs are pretty good cannons, comparable with the Hispanos.... but only when they are compared within 300~400yards.

 And.. how many people actually start firing within 300 yards distance?