A Whine has been recorded...

[gofaster]

Originally posted by muckmaw
Is it my skewed peception or do I fight the same 5 planes 95% of the time?

Spitfire
LA-7
P-51
Niki
109 (Might be 190...I get 'em mixed up)
 

Actually, you should clarify.  I would suspect that you're fighting the Spitfire IX more than the Spitfire V, Seafire II (unless its a carrier fight), or Spitfire I.

The P-51 is probably a P-51D.  Only the better players with guts fly the P-51B on a regular basis.

The LA-7 is over-rated and over-used.  The Yak9U is much more of a dogfighter than the LA-7.

You're probably seeing the 109 and 190 in equal numbers, probably the 109G10 and 190D more than the other variants of either plane.

If the Ki-44 were around, there'd be less LA-7 and N1K2 usage.  I would think the Ki-44's blend of speed, climb, and four 12.7mm guns would be competitive enough to draw some of the players from the LA-7 and N1K camps.  Historically, the Ki-44 could bring down B-29 Superforts so I would think it'd be a pretty popular option in the MA.

[gofaster]

Originally posted by LePaul
Im telling ya Muck, do the A-20.  Great forward guns...peppered up a P-47...he struggled to make a forced landing and got popped with some 500's    Its my plane of the week

One thing I'm going to try this week is taking an A-20 NOE to an enemy airfield and see how many enemy aircraft I can pop on their climb out by using the top turret gun to fire upwards from their blind spot.

[WldThing]

Originally posted by beet1e
P51 is a good survivalist plane if not quite as easy, but still easy enough. Just as folks can't be bothered to spend more than 5 minutes to get to a fight, so are they victims from their own lack of attention span when it comes to learning new ideas/planes. So instead, they'll just choose an easymode ride.

Easymode is the way i like it!  Actual skill in this plane is minimal,  i recommend it to all the fellow rookies like myself!

[gofaster]

... I tend to select my aircraft based on the map in play.

For AKDesert, I usually bring something fast with a big fuel tank that works well at high altitudes, like a 109G10 with drop tanks, 190A8, P-51B, or even a C.205.  The distances from the bases, and the altitude of the terrain, pretty much limit the effectiveness of the early and mid-war planes.

For Mindanao, I use the Ki-61 as a counter to all of the navy planes, with some P-38, P-51B, FM2, and Corsair work thrown in for kicks.  I'll also use the P-40E and some of the midwar stuff since the bases are fairly close and at sea level.

For Trinity, its long-distance time again, so its P-51B, Corsair, and Yak9U, and 190A8, with FM2 and F4U1D for navy work.

For Big Isles, its P-51B, Ki-61, 109F, and Spitfire V for interceptions, and Corsair from the boats for attack missions.

[WldThing]

Originally posted by gofaster
The P-51 is probably a P-51D.  Only the better players with guts fly the P-51B on a regular basis.

BTW .. Actually gofaster P-51D and the P-51B are almost the same planes,  just that i need more ammo for the masses in the MA ..  Doesnt take more skill or "guts" to fly the one or the other ..

[Guppy35]

Originally posted by beet1e
MuckMAW. It's easy to understand.  There is a huge swathe in this community that has no interest in WW2, no interest in learning ACM (which is why you see all the HO) and who just want to pummel a fire button and make stuff go boom. The Spit and LA7 are the easymode planes. P51 is a good survivalist plane if not quite as easy, but still easy enough. Just as folks can't be bothered to spend more than 5 minutes to get to a fight, so are they victims from their own lack of attention span when it comes to learning new ideas/planes. So instead, they'll just choose an easymode ride.

Do not confuse the fact that these oft chosen planes feature so prominently in the obituaries with the reason why they are chosen in the first place. More of them get killed because so many idiots fly them. Look at the kill stats for any pilot ranked in the top 200. In most cases the P51, Spit ix and LA7 will be in the top 5 in his list of fighter kills.

It's debatable whether I'm an idiot or not, but if you want to equate my flying a Spit with a lack of knowledge of WW2 aviation history, I'd beg to differ.  My passion for WW2 history goes back 35 years or so, a lot longer then my flying computer flight sims.

I'd offer another suggestion since we're going to make some sort of connection between WW2 aviation history and AH flying.

Find me one actual fighter pilot in 1945 that would have happily turned in his 51D, 190D9 or Spit IX for a P40, Hurricane or 109E.  Now that would have been idiotic.

So why not press for a 1939 Arena, then a 1940, 41 etc.  Let the planes that fought each other at that time go at it if the idea is "pure ACM".   I'd bet the house the whining would be the same cause there would always be a plane that upset the balance.  Can't you just hear the 1941 arena howls from the Spit V drivers about all those 190s.  Damn that progress!

But then again this is kind of a pointless argument cause since we're not really dying and this isn't really WW2 aviation, it all comes down to....AGAIN....people finding fun in the game however they choose.  And if flying an early war plane make you happy go to it.

Dan/Slack

[gofaster]

Originally posted by WldThing
BTW .. Actually gofaster P-51D and the P-51B are almost the same planes,  just that i need more ammo for the masses in the MA ..  Doesnt take more skill or "guts" to fly the one or the other ..

Actually, it takes guts to fly with a huge blind spot behind, two fewer .50s in front, grill work to the sides, and downhill compression below.  

One of the common complaints of players new to the P-51B is the number of assists they get, instead of kills.  Another one is the compression when diving down to attack lower fighters.  The D eliminates or reduces the chance of both of these happening.

I prefer the B over the D because:

(a) it climbs faster;
(b) it blends into the terrain better; and
(c) it scores more perks per kill.

Now, if they'd given it a Malcolm hood, it would be my regular plane of choice.  But alas....

[beet1e]

Guppy, I didn't say ALL Spit pilots were idiots. I even fly the Spit V & Seafire from time to time.

[fofy]

Nothing will ever change Muckmaw... people will still do what ever the game let tham do.. and that means each one for his own purpose.

The onlt things closer to real WW2 enviroment are the scenarios and WB2.77... I myself liked the axies vs allies plane set and 3 weeks rotation better, but... that's life.

Needless to say - it's a great whine  

[Guppy35]

Originally posted by beet1e
Guppy, I didn't say ALL Spit pilots were idiots. I even fly the Spit V & Seafire from time to time.

So look at it this way then.  Lots of folks find AH. They come in, greener then grass, hop in a Spit, LA7 or whatever comes easiest to them.  They play for a while and a couple things can happen.  They get bored and leave or become bomber pilots (sorry couldn't resist .  

Or they get better, start feeling some success and start learning more about the history, the pilots, the planes.  Their interest deepens and they start to challenge themselves with different aircraft, learning more ACM skills and continuing to push their abilities.  As time goes by they end up joining that upper echelon of AH ACM experts.

A third group might include a lot of us too, who don't have the time to spend like we used to, flying all the time, trying to get better.  We've found a comfort level in the game and do what we enjoy.  I know that's where I am.  I'd suggest that lots of this third group may have already done what my second paragraph suggests, whether it be here, Warbirds or Airwarrior.  I know I chased it for a while in Airwarrior.  Not that I ever got there but I tried

Kind of a natural evolution don't you think?

Dan/Slack

[Dead Man Flying]

Originally posted by beet1e
Guppy, I didn't say ALL Spit pilots were idiots. I even fly the Spit V & Seafire from time to time.

But Beet1e... you are and idiot.



-- Todd/Leviathn

[muckmaw]

The D has much better visibility, does it not?

If the D and the B are the same plane, why do we always see the -d in the arena?

Is it all a matter of perception?

BTW, here are my numbers..

very little stick time this tour:

N1K 2  5
Boston III 0 3
La-7 0 3
Spitfire Mk IX 0 2
La-5FN 0 1
Typhoon IB 0 1
Spitfire V 0 1
Fw 190D-9 0 1

Now for last tour..

Spitfire Mk IX 10
La-7 9
SeaFire 5  
Typhoon IB 4  
Me 262 4
N1K2 4
P-51D

Hmmm..

Looks like the typhies getting more play...

How do you get those arena wide usage numbers?

[WldThing]

Originally posted by muckmaw
The D has much better visibility, does it not?

If the D and the B are the same plane, why do we always see the -d in the arena?

 

Where did one say they were the same  planes??

I merely said they were almost the same.. Except for the few minor specifications, like arnament, 6 view,  and a couple of the other things gofaster pointed out..

[beet1e]

DMF!  

Guppy - I agree with everything you've said - wish there were more like you.

[muckmaw]

Originally posted by WldThing
BTW .. Actually gofaster P-51D and the P-51B are almost the same planes,  just that i need more ammo for the masses in the MA ..  Doesnt take more skill or "guts" to fly the one or the other ..

The way you wrote it, one would believe the only difference between the B and the D is the amount of ammo.

So the B and the D are the same plane except:

The D has a better 6 View
The B climbs better
The D carries more ammo

Anything else about these planes which are the same but different?

Like I said, if this is a recurring whine, maybe it's because the complaint has merit.

If someone could double check these numbers, I've got the P-51, Spit9, Niki, 109g-10 and La-7 accounting for 23% of the kills vs the knights last tour. (I just picked a country0

Out of 179611 Knights shot down:

The pony got 8,949
The spit 9 got 12,999
The Niki got 7,512
the 109G-10 got 3,234
and the LA-7 got 9816

That's 42,510 kills across 5 planes out of 179,611 kills, or 23%

Are these figures right?

One quarter of all the kills in a 70 plus plane set went to 5 planes?