Hmm, this gun study in Australia may differ from Vulcans opinion

[_Schadenfreude_]

Is Laz actually Walter from "The Big Labowski"?

[Ripsnort]

Originally posted by _Schadenfreude_
Is Laz actually Walter from "The Big Labowski"?

Is Vulcan actually Michael Moore from "Bowling for Columbine" ??

[lazs2]

hmm.. vulcan.. you claim the U.S. is a mess...  you also say in the same breath that you don't think people from "overseas" should comment on other peoples laws... yet... you do not live in either australia or America.  I don't think that our gun laws are a mess except maybe far too restrictive..  I don't believe that human nature has changed much over the centuries  and I do not want to live in some police state or socialist paradise no matter how "safe".  would rather have the U.S. with all it's warts.

gixer..The comment about not bringing an icepic to a gunfight was a play on an old cliche for stabies benifiet but if "one" gets anything about my masculinity out of it then "one" is welcome to "ones" opinion.  I personaly think that macho guys that are fearful of and anti gun and claim that they can "handle themselves just fine without one"  or "don't need one to defend themselves"are probly just young and naive but could have issues about their masculinity.

lazs

[Ripsnort]

Originally posted by lazs2
 I don't think that our gun laws are a mess except maybe far too restrictive..  lazs

Just to add to this, its not our guns or laws that are a mess, its our inner city where most of the murders occur, with illegal weapons.  Crime committed by law abiding, registered gun owers is 1/10 of 1 %.  And, if one wants to dig alittle deeper and question why the aforementioned occurs...well, it begins with nurturing, family, responsibility, etc.

[lazs2]

It is also a fact that puting more guns (concealed carry) in the hands of city dwellers helps stop crime at an even greater rate than rural areas... the places that need em the most are getting the least in a lot of cases.

lazs

[Angus]

Now matter how you put it, the US has more people in jail than any western nation. It has a very high rate of capital crime, and a stunning number of corpses with a bullet hole in it.
Buying guns is rather easy, hence the baddies have them. So, do you think that a succesful way to fight that is by having even more guns?

[lazs2]

yes..  that and making penalties for commiting crimes with a firearm more harsh..

the best way tho would be to have a totalitarian government with strict laws and curfews and a large police state.

The U.S. also has a much higher conviction rate for crimes commited than say england.   I don't think I would brag that the criminals don't get caught.   Not getting caught doesn't make the crime or criminal go away.

lazs

[Ripsnort]

Originally posted by Angus
So, do you think that a succesful way to fight that is by having even more guns?

Actually, yes. and there are facts to back this up. Give me a couple hours after my meetings, and I'll give you the facts and data.

[Vulcan]

Originally posted by lazs2
hmm.. vulcan.. you claim the U.S. is a mess...  you also say in the same breath that you don't think people from "overseas" should comment on other peoples laws... yet... you do not live in either australia or America.  I don't think that our gun laws are a mess except maybe far too restrictive..  I don't believe that human nature has changed much over the centuries  and I do not want to live in some police state or socialist paradise no matter how "safe".  would rather have the U.S. with all it's warts.

Reading Comprehension 101, Identify the difference between these two statements:
The US is in a mess with guns
The US laws for guns are a mess

No matter how much you argue it, you cannot deny the fact that such proflific availability of firearms is causing problems in the USA. The gun related crimerates there are 10 or 100-fold that of other countries.

Police state? LOL. Good grief, we're just the opposite here. In fact I think you might find parts of the US are far closer to a police state than we are. If its about personal freedom lazs, why not just lift the laws on everything while you're at it, including things like hard drugs?

You don't need to be armed in the US for personal freedom, you need to be armed for self defence, that statement in itself speaks loads about the situationthere.

[airguard]

Why is guns so important that the subject get this big in this forum ?

Personally I dont care much about them, they do damage and I frankly dont need them.

I care more about getting drunk drivers off the road or maniac motorheads trying out their cars in populated roads.

But then again I am a socialist pig from skandinavia and have no clue about anything. (actually i vote in mycountry republican but for the reps in this forum I still am a socialist )

have fun and keep up with this stupid and endless theme.

[lazs2]

Of course I deny that the prolification of guns in America is the problem... I don't even see it as a problem..  White gun crime is very low.   I don't think we can in good conscience prohibit all minorities from owning guns tho.  

As for hard drugs..  I have no problem with "legalizing" drugs but would have harsh penalties for abuse like driving or commiting crimes while on drugs.   If you knew that you would not be fully aware when you took them and then did it anyway then you are responsible for anything you may do while on em... also... you should be heavily penalized for operating machinery in a public place while intoxicated.

I have also heard that NZ has become more like the U.S. in that it has cut it's taxes by 50% over the last couple of decades and trimmed it's useless government workforce by even more.  these actoions seem to have pulled you out of your econmic disaster you were headed for.

lazs