Author Topic: Prisoner Abuse  (Read 6488 times)

Offline Tumor

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Prisoner Abuse
« Reply #150 on: May 08, 2004, 12:04:30 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by StabbyTheIcePic
You are right, i am at fault. I appologize.


STOP BEING REASONABLE!!!... it's so freeking wierd on this BB I'm liable to have a breakdown in rational thought!

:)



Tumor
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Offline FBRaptor

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Prisoner Abuse
« Reply #151 on: May 08, 2004, 01:41:47 AM »
I am sorry but I just can't help myself, so here goes.

I am appalled as well at the complete stupidity of the soldiers responsable for these moronic acts.................HOWEVER. .............

I do not remember recieving an appology from the Iraqis or the Islamic extremist groups for killing, dragging, mutilating and hanging the dead bodies of our soldiers and innocent contractors from abridge like cow meat!!!!!!!!!!!!

The Iraqi prisonors children will have to live with knowing there fathers genetalia was photographed and they were humiliated!!! oh no, woah is them to have to live with that kinda horror...wha wha.. while our innocent civilian contractors and soldiers children will have to know that there fathers died painfully and were tortured and treated worse than animals!!!!!!!!!!!

Dont even bother suggesting I encourage or condone what happened at the prison cause it makes me sick, however (again) I dont want to lose sight of what kind of people (word used loosely) we are dealing with!

Kill em all and bring our people home!!!!! FBRaptor

Offline Steve

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« Reply #152 on: May 08, 2004, 02:20:00 AM »
Raptor... I agree... I take umbrage that people call this torture.

I'm worried though.  Rumsfeld says the activity was worse than what was shown...I'll be outraged if there is any real torture going on.  Not that I feel anything much for the Iraqi's, I just expect  our people to behave better than the savages we are at war with.
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Offline Steve

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« Reply #153 on: May 08, 2004, 02:24:34 AM »
Stabby, I really cannot help but wonder... where was your righteous wrath as the bodies of Americans were being hung from bridges after suffering torture, mutilation and murder?

Did you keep that feeling secret?  That feeling that said: "good, this will cause more trouble for Bush!"

Do you harbor such unreasonable hatred for the President that you take perverse satisfaction in what  the Iraqis do to their prisoners?


Where  is your anger about this? your outrage?
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Offline Tumor

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« Reply #154 on: May 08, 2004, 02:26:50 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by FBRaptor
I am sorry but I just can't help myself, so here goes.

I am appalled as well at the complete stupidity of the soldiers responsable for these moronic acts.................HOWEVER. .............

I do not remember recieving an appology from the Iraqis or the Islamic extremist groups for killing, dragging, mutilating and hanging the dead bodies of our soldiers and innocent contractors from abridge like cow meat!!!!!!!!!!!!

The Iraqi prisonors children will have to live with knowing there fathers genetalia was photographed and they were humiliated!!! oh no, woah is them to have to live with that kinda horror...wha wha.. while our innocent civilian contractors and soldiers children will have to know that there fathers died painfully and were tortured and treated worse than animals!!!!!!!!!!!

Dont even bother suggesting I encourage or condone what happened at the prison cause it makes me sick, however (again) I dont want to lose sight of what kind of people (word used loosely) we are dealing with!

Kill em all and bring our people home!!!!! FBRaptor


Raptor... a few (very few) of the abuses committed were in fact very deserving of harsh penalties.  Non compare even slightly to atrocities committed against US interests, however we do not condone sinking to the level of those we carry the fight against.

T.
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Offline Rolex

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« Reply #155 on: May 08, 2004, 05:55:03 AM »
So FBrapter wants to kill everyone in Iraq and Steve admits he has no love for Iraqis. :)

Well guys, I didn't originally disapprove of the Iraq invasion, but there still aren't any WMD so Saddam was not (and is now not) an imminent threat to the U.S.

Fighting for 'Iraqi freedom' doesn't mean killing everyone that you don't care about anyway, so why don't we just declare a victory and pull out?

There are no other reasons left of those originally put forth to justify this occupation except the so-called freedom of Iraqis. Saddam and his henchmen couldn't harm us before and sure can't do it now. I'm truly concerned about losing more American lives and I think we're breeding new Iraqi terrorists who had no hatred for America before.

Every day another Iraqi (and Arab ally) becomes as enraged about a family member, friend or countryman being killed, injured or mistreated as much as any American or American ally in Iraq becomes enraged by the same. People will pass on their rage to their children. We are only setting ourselves as a common target for their common rage to bring harm to those they believe hurt their family and friends.

It doesn't matter if they are ideologically or factually correct in their hatred - Only their perception of who caused the pain. Ideology goes out the window when you or yours are killed, hurt or abused, regardless of your nationality, skin color or religion.

There will always be someone like Osama bin Laden or Yasser Arafat willing to step in to give them a rifle or bomb and a target to complete their revenge.

Look at the history of the middle-east and the Israeli/Palestinian quagmire. The resentment and hatred on both sides runs generations deep. Millions of people hating other people and passing their hatred on to their children.

I spent 8 months in Vietnam and 3 months in a hospital and I'm still not sure why. If you truly believe in the cause of Iraqi freedom. then quit your job tomorrow (you too Ripsnort) and double-time your little gung-ho butt down to the recruiting center and get your gung-ho little butt into a war zone. We'll see just how gung-ho you are after that. Post a copy of those recruitment papers here this week.

If you're too old, then quit anyway and become a contractor to wash dishes, clean latrines or any form of support function for the troops in Iraq. If you are too young or not fit enough to to do it,  then send all your money to Iraq.

Remember... this is not about the money. You should sell your house and cars and all your property to pay your way over there because you believe in the cause.

If you are unwilling to do that, then you have to start asking yourself just what the hell are my fellow countrymen and women still doing there? I'm getting disillusioned at who I thought would be the better president in the last election. I wish there were someone else to choose from other than the current crop. Are these candidates the best America can up with? I'm embarrassed by both of them.

Let the Iraqis have Iraq today, not tomorrow. They can fight it out among themselves for control. I don't want to see one more American or coalition country national or Iraqi killed or hurt in Iraq. Enough of this nonsense. Iraq is no threat to America.

Let's move on to find Osama bin Laden. Now there's a target I can get excited about. We have enough troops in Iraq now to lock hands at the Afghan border and walk across it for heaven's sake.

« Last Edit: May 08, 2004, 06:05:52 AM by Rolex »

Offline stegor

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« Reply #156 on: May 08, 2004, 07:38:32 AM »
Very interesting conversation, some good opinions and a bunch of s****.
My big to the guys that have faced the facts with a good sense of reality, and mantaining a cool way.

Blame to the ones which have fallen in rethoric,  stupid excuses, non requested defence; one in particular saying all, and the contrary of all..... that's not the way to be useful to your country, IMHO

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Offline StabbyTheIcePic

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« Reply #157 on: May 08, 2004, 10:12:31 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Steve
Stabby, I really cannot help but wonder... where was your righteous wrath as the bodies of Americans were being hung from bridges after suffering torture, mutilation and murder?

Did you keep that feeling secret?  That feeling that said: "good, this will cause more trouble for Bush!"

Do you harbor such unreasonable hatred for the President that you take perverse satisfaction in what  the Iraqis do to their prisoners?


Where  is your anger about this? your outrage?



I had plenty of anger towards that, but those were not americans doing the torture and mutilation. I never made justifications for those piece's of ****s actions, why do you try and justify the crimes our troops have done. You are avoiding the arguement when you bring what happened in fallujah. Americans are not expected to do this. Crazy religious nut bags in the middle east are. How can i be outraged about something that i expected to happen. I had no idea that we would be doing a bit of the old ultra violence ourselves to POW's. Now i am going to quote myself ripsnort style.


Quote

It gets piled on America because we are not Iraq. We are not the soviet union, we are not north vienam. We are the US of ****ing A. We do not mistreat our prisoners, we stand for what is right in this world. When did it become in fashion to defend people that represent us to allow our name to be tarnished? These people are scum, they will get punished, and i truely hope that the people that commanded them and all others that knew it was going on but said nothing are punished fairly as well.
« Last Edit: May 08, 2004, 10:14:51 AM by StabbyTheIcePic »

Offline FBRaptor

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« Reply #158 on: May 08, 2004, 02:35:36 PM »
Let me just make one retraction to my previous statement. I used the words "kill em all". I did not mean kill all Iraqis, I meant kill all of the Muslam Extremest that want to harm Americans or American interest.

As for the guy who said "Iraqi does not pose a threat to America". That is totaly wrong. Iraq, as is alot of the Middle East, is a breeding ground of hatred, terrorism and death!!!

We can not leave Iraq to continue to breed these terrorist groups!!!

What if we all left Iraq now, and in one year a terrorist group injects a lethal Bio-Hazzard into the water supply of Manhatton. Then 800,000 people of all ages die a horrible death. What if we then find out this terrorist group was founded, trained and based in Iraq. How would you feel about our need for a presence in the Middle East and Iraq then?? Our countries leaders would come under so much fire for not finding this threat ahead of time and stopping it where it festered.

Does this hit home yet? We (the USA and allies) simply just can not allow the Middle Eastern terrorism supporting countries to be left un-checked!! It is because of leaving the Muslam killers to do as they please that we lost thousands of innocent lives and the safety we felt at home on September, 11.

It is for these reasons that we must stay in the Middle East and Iraq untill the job at hand is done.   FBRaptor

Offline 00Buck

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« Reply #159 on: May 08, 2004, 04:08:35 PM »
I've seen a lot of valid points made, and a lot of ridiculous, emotional statements.

What's important is doing what's right. I believe the US should stand for good in the world.

I want to believe that if my president tells me and the rest of the world that Iraq has weapons of mass destruction, he is telling the truth. Where are the weapons?

I don't know if everyone here realizes this, but there is NO evidence, NONE, that Iraq had anything to do with 9-11. Iraq and El Quaida were enemies. Now terrorists, including El Quaida, are active in Iraq and are killing Americans on an almost daily basis.

I am stunned that more people don't see the irony that no WMD were found in Iraq, while our ALLY Pakistan, was busy pedaling nuclear secrets to the rest of the "Axis of Evil." Why doesn't it worry people that North Korea has nuclear weapons and has threatened us over and over?

If it IS true that the invasion of Iraq was part of the "war on terrorism," it is proving to be a profound failure. The war on terrorism isn't going to be won on a conventional battlefield. It is going to be won by killing or capturing key terrorists and winning the hearts and minds of the people. We are losing the battle for hearts and minds, in a big, big way. Our actions, including the invasion of Iraq itself, are playing directly into the hands of Bin Laden.

To loudly decry the abuse of prisoners is not criticism of the military in general, (or do you think the President is anti-military?) The treatment of prisoners that we've been seeing IS unAmerican, at least in the America I hope I'm living in. And there is no question that the abuse of prisoners will lesson our chance of victory in Iraq and cost more American lives.

Offline Steve

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« Reply #160 on: May 08, 2004, 04:12:34 PM »
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why do you try and justify the crimes our troops have done.



Stabby, show me one.. just ONE place where I tried to justify the behavior of the troops we are discussing.. just ONE.
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Offline Steve

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« Reply #161 on: May 08, 2004, 04:13:43 PM »
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Iraq and El Quaida were enemies.



uhhhhh Wrong.
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Offline Steve

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« Reply #162 on: May 08, 2004, 04:18:36 PM »
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and Steve admits he has no love for Iraqis.



Did you deliberately take my words out of context to validate your point or did you misunderstand?

The comment I made was referring to Iraqi prisoners, ergo enemy of the U.S.. It was not directed at the whole populace of Iraq, my apology to you if I was unclear on this.

I choose not to love those that would kill me or any of my fellow countrymen in this conflict.  Hope that clears things up.


My quote was:
Quote
Not that I feel anything much for the Iraqi's, I just expect our people to behave better than the savages we are at war with.


It seems clear to me as we are not at war with entirety of the Iraqi population, just those who still bear arms against us.
« Last Edit: May 08, 2004, 04:20:57 PM by Steve »
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Offline Pooh21

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Prisoner Abuse
« Reply #163 on: May 08, 2004, 04:21:12 PM »
Ummm 1 perverted woman and her buddies made a few  Iraqis her "gimps"

those pics were torture for my eyes when I didnt turn away quick enough, but oh well Amerika is teh suxx0r!!!

come on Gixer say it you know you want in every post you make

"amereeka is teh suxxor,Boosh is teh Satan"

Who the devil is this Stabby anyway? Bout as sharp as a cinderblock so theres false advertising there
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Offline Gixer

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« Reply #164 on: May 08, 2004, 04:28:51 PM »
"I do not remember recieving an appology from the Iraqis or the Islamic extremist groups for killing, dragging, mutilating and hanging the dead bodies of our soldiers and innocent contractors from abridge like cow meat!!!!!!!!!!!! "


True that was a terrible act however you can't expect appologies from the local population when you occupy another country. In a war that is totally unjustified.

You don't expect to see your fellow citizens being treated in such way in priisons from those that are suppose to of "liberated" you from such aggression in the first place.

Unfortunetly those images of prisioners are going to stick with the Iraq war and the US military for years to come. Just like the image of the burnt vietnamese girl running out of the napalmed village did from the vietnam war.

One wonders if the next most memoriable images of this war (which seems to be nothing but a war of choice and a  complete disaster) in 20 years time will be those of the last US troops being airlifted from the embassy.



...-Gixer