Author Topic: The USA  (Read 8760 times)

Offline Dago

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The USA
« Reply #165 on: July 10, 2004, 12:40:21 PM »
Ah Crump,  you bring back fond memories.

I have ate Dog, ate 100yr old duck eggs, and squatted over the hole. (used in Middle East too).  In Taiwan was fed a seafood meal, with some duck and goose thrown in, that had most things I have heard about or seen.  Offered beetle nut at the end (no thanks).

I agree that so many people of so many cultures exhibit incredible hospitality,  but a lot of Americans would and do appreciate these things.  True, not all would, but plenty.  Same I am sure for the Euro types.

Had curry chicken once prepared by a young Phillipino that was fantastic.  Have eaten in places too dirty to think about, but had some great food.  (some bad food too of course.)

Either way, not all Americans are snobs or slobs, and not all Euros are ettiquete and propriety personified.

We just live in the greatest country and they hate us for saying so!!  :D

dago
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, martini in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming "WOO HOO what a ride!"

Offline Crumpp

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« Reply #166 on: July 10, 2004, 12:49:19 PM »
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We just live in the greatest country and they hate us for saying so!!  


100 percent agreement on that!

Crumpp

storch

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« Reply #167 on: July 10, 2004, 01:14:44 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Chairboy
Actually, no.  I don't believe that there is any god or supreme being that has created the universe by design.  I've read the christian bible, studied other religious texts, and given it some serious thought and come to the conclusion that religion fills the psychological need many people have to have someone else be in control, like when they were children and their parents were ultimately responsible for their actions.

So, no.  Your assertion that being atheist means I 'just haven't thought about it' is both insulting, poorly thought out, and evidence that you may cling to your beliefs like a safety blanket without any comprehension as to the possibility of something else.

Let this be the end of this conversation, there's no good reason to hijack this thread about national pride with a fruitless argument about religion.  Neither of us is going to change the others mind, so it's only logical that we respect that we each have differing viewpoints and just live with it.  If you REALLY want to keep talking about this, start a new thread so this one doesn't degenerate.


Safety blanket?  Oh I get it!!! Like you cling to your non belief belief system with no concern regarding accountability.

Offline beet1e

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« Reply #168 on: July 10, 2004, 01:17:34 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by storch
Atheist eh?  actually that is very disingenuos.  you believe in  some form of a god.  perhaps you are too lazy to invest deep thought on the subject or are intellectually dishonest.  The choice is between two gods. That choice is God the creator or god the adversary.  No choice is still a choice.
I don't agree with that. That's like saying that "bald" is a hair colour.


Dago! I thank you for that list of US attributes. You're wrong about me - I have been to most US states (41 out of the 50) on various holidays/vacations as well as working in New York, Chicago and San Francisco. I've been to Calico ghost town in CA. I've hiked in Yosemite. I've been to the Redwood national park and stayed at Arcata,CA and spent two days hiking the trails in the Redwoods. I have been to Tombstone, AZ and seen a re-enactment of the events of 26th October, 1881. I have been to Grand Canyon. I don't need reminding of the wheat fields - I saw little else when driving through western Nebraska (west of North Platte) some years ago. I have been to Fort Sumter, SC where the civil war started at 4:30am on that fateful morning when a shell exploded overhead and signalled the beginning of hostilities. I have been to Stone Mountain,GA and seen the Confederate Memorial carving - Davis, Lee & Jackson. Later that day, I visited a museum in which there was a huge model depicting various Civil War battles. I also remember seeing a plaque about the Allman bros band from Macon, GA. I have yet to see Mt. Rushmore, but I have spent a lot of time in NYC - including visiting the WTC and the Empire State buildings. I spent a few days in Wyoming, hiking in the Grand Tetons, and visited Yellowstone Park. I had to cut that trip short because of bad weather, and because many trails do not open before Memorial Day. I've lived in the Chicago area, where it was perishing cold much of the time. The pizzas were good though. I swam in the Gulf off Galveston,TX - warmest water I ever swam in.

Large aircraft production is not the sole preserve of Boeing, by the way. Here, we have British Aerospace who worked with Airbus Industrie to produce large planes like the Airbus 340 - not quite as big as the 747-400, but the A340 has flown half way round the world non-stop (Toulouse to Perth), a distance of 15,000km in about 16½ hours. The Boeing 747-400 cannot do this without refuelling. Oh, and a new aircraft is in the works which is even bigger than the 747-400, and that's the Airbus 380. You might want to edit your post when that enters service in 2006.

We have many museums too, only ours depict historical events which happened more than 250 years ago. I'm sure the USA is not the only country where one can hunt for large or small game. In fact our friend Mr. Toad sometimes comes over to England - just to shoot game down in the west country. We also have some of the best trout fishing in the world. I know of Americans who come over to fish trout from the rivers Itchen and Test in Hampshire. I must admit I was surprised when I found that out.

You can learn to fly planes and race cars here and in most other countries. I have flown in the airspace of seven different countries, including five US states. I have both CAA and FAA licences. I have been to the EAA Convention at Oshkosh in 1991 - very impressive, but I was surprised it ran for only a week, which would not have been long enough to see everything. Here, we also have airshows in case you didn't know. One of the best I ever saw was the 50th anniversary of the Battle of Britain at Boscombe Down in 1990 - best airshow I ever saw. There are others - at Cosford and Fairford for example.

American healthcare is indeed of a very high standard, and my life was saved in an American hospital in 1980. However, there is something wrong when an AH subscriber has to cancel his account because he's struggling to pay medical bills. That can't be right. And my mother-in-law who lived in Chicago had to forego carpal tunnel surgery because it was not covered by Medicare/Medicaid and she could not afford the $20,000 to pay for it herself. That can't be right either.

In New York, I went to numerous theatre productions. I have met and had lunch with Debra Monk (wife of Sippowitz in NYPD Blue, and also had small role in Bridges of Madison County). It was she who told me that much of NYPD Blue is actually filmed in Los Angeles - bet you didn't know that. One time I found myself sitting next to the newscaster Stone Phillips - at Sarah Beth's Kitchen in NYC. (He asked to be moved - not because he was sitting next to me, but because his seat was where two sets joined and he wasn't comfortable!) I've watched tennis at the US Open in Flushing Meadow (Lindsay Davenport  - can't remember her opponent) and baseball next door at Shea Stadium. Saw a cracking game on 24th August, 1995 - the day W95 was released: Mets were down 3-2 but came back to win 4-3 at the bottom of the ninth. I have watched baseball at several other stadia - Oakland Coliseum, PacBell Park, Coors Field, Wrigley Field and Fenway Park. After the Fenway Park game, I had dinner at the Union Oyster House in Boston - oldest restaurant in the USA.

I have stood at the Continental Divide at Milner Pass, CO, and as a result understand the concept of Pacific Ocean drainage and Atlantic Ocean drainage.
Quote
You missed so much.
Like what?

Offline Dago

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« Reply #169 on: July 10, 2004, 01:33:42 PM »
Well Beetle, if you saw so many great things, why do you dwell on the negative?

Why didnt you mention and accept that when instead you choose to speak of Walmart etc?  

Why don't you show understanding instead of thinking less of those who are still discovering America instead of going elsewhere???

Because you hate the US and it's citizens I guess.

Regarding our medical system, as with any health care system, it is not perfect.  But, I certainly prefer it to the national system in England.   There, everyone gets access to a bad system.  Sharon Osbourne spoke of Ozzys hospitilization on her show and talked about the run down condition of the hospitals and the second rate health care system.  She did speak well of a nationalized system that offered health care to all, but poorly of the resulting available health care.

In the USA, nobody can be denied emergency life saving treatment by law.

But, so far they haven't forced taxpayers to give free treatment to all the unemployed and underemployed.  We subsidize them enough all ready with free or wildly reduced housing, food, education and heatlcare.

Maybe not giving away everything puts a little onus on them and their families to work, save and provide for themselves?

BTW, you must be one ungrateful SOB to have lived here, experienced so many great things and done so much, then consistantly use this forum to denigrate the USA.

dago
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, martini in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming "WOO HOO what a ride!"

Offline lada

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« Reply #170 on: July 10, 2004, 01:39:52 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Crumpp
I am not a fan of the Middle Eastern practice of homosexuality before marriage.  Especially when it is practiced with underage boys nor of the condemnation of Alcohol but an acceptance of Hash?

Crumpp



Well ... i dont know if you will belive me or not. But people who live in ME and want to have sex before marriedge, simply have it. Some of them do not have it classic way so they pick another. Fact, that huge majority  consider  it to be bad, wrong is another story.  I found a lot of oportunities in almost every city.

Hash does have long history over there.. people tolerate it w/o problem. Im not sure if it have worster impact that alcohol on population overhere.

But its also simple to buy there alcohol as well. Everybody who wants to look "in", modern will have something at home.

one more question. How many young boys you meet, were homosesuxals, because they could not have girl?
« Last Edit: July 10, 2004, 01:43:51 PM by lada »

Offline Crumpp

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« Reply #171 on: July 10, 2004, 01:40:01 PM »
quote:
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You missed so much.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Like what?

==============================================

The fact we DON"T miss YOU!

Crumpp

storch

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The USA
« Reply #172 on: July 10, 2004, 01:42:26 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Crumpp
quote:
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You missed so much.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Like what?

==============================================

The fact we DON"T miss YOU!

Crumpp


And America shouts AMEN!!

storch

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The USA
« Reply #173 on: July 10, 2004, 01:47:59 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by X2Lee
Would you knock it off Storch? I am still trying to not like you  ;)


Move to France you ignint hillybilly I already consider you one any way.

Offline Simaril

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« Reply #174 on: July 10, 2004, 01:59:08 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by lada
well true problems in europe were Church
They had power for looong time and it were  more and more clear, that they are loosing it. Their morale went down, corruption were pretty high and most of them abused word "God" in eyes of other.
I can imagine, that average people were interesting in living somewhere else.


Don't forget that in europe, many had to use the "church" as a way out from social or economic traps, or as a path to power. Mendel would have been a scientist in america, but became a monk to make a living. Cardinal Richelieu was a machiavellian narcissist, who took "holy orders" in name only. In this setting, of course much evil was done under the cover of religion, by people who were "christian" only in clothing. Fair assessment requires judgement based on the true expression of Christian morality, not judgement based on perverted expressions of the beleif system. I wouldnt say Hitler represented the true nature of German culture; why to anti-religionists use the same logic to condemn Christianity??? And, why do they (justly) defend Islam by saying that those espousing atrocity are a fringe, not a reflection of the faith itself?

Quote
Originally posted by lada
But some time has pass away and its kinda funny that religion in europe doesnt have as big influence on people, goverments as it have in US. Its kinda funny.


You're fooliing yourself to say that religion doesnt have an influence in Europe; 1500 years of Christian worldview has shaped the nature of european "right and wrong" deeply. And, the underappreciated heritage of Christianity is the scientific worldview: prior to christianity, the world was viewed as unpredictable and chaotic, controlled by the whims of animistic or polytheistic minor deities whose interactions were more soap opera than theology. Christianity gave europe the idea that there were priciples behind reality that could be understood, devloped, and applied.

It is no accident of history that europe outpaced the rest of the world scientifically, commercially, and socially. IDEAS HAVE CONSEQUENCES.

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Originally posted by lada Every little children in europe know, that most people in human history did die in name of God. Even Stallin or Hitler are pure suckers at kills compare to various  Churches in europe.[/B]


Then children in europe are being misled by modern propaganda. Even if you ignore the religious "lip service" and economic/political maneuvering that used religious verbiage to mask power plays, teh numbers dont even compare. All the horrors of the crusades together numbered their dead in the tens to hundreds of thousands.

Meanwhile, the really efficent mass killings were done by Europeans who had been "enlightened" away from absolute morality into the quagmire of relativism.  Napoleon, Hitler, and Stalin all were essentially atheists, who believed that their country's needs (and their own thirst for power) outweighed any sense of lasting Truth. They acted on the principle that the 'good" of the people they cared about jsutified any action, adn that might made right. Hitler explicitly outlined his worldview, and it clearly showed influences of Neizchean "god is dead", social darwinist "only the sttrong cultures survive", and so on. Ideas have consequences.

THE ONLY WAY THESE HORRORS CAN BE CRITICIZED IS BY APPEALING TO A HIGHER MORALITY, THAT TRANSCENDS TIME,PLACE, AND SITUATION. Without an absolute standard, the most you can say is "that was ok for them, in that time and situation, but wouldn't be considered right today."

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Originally posted by lada "freedom is gift given by god to all human beeing" or something like that GWB said, before he entered Iraq...... So whats the score ?
Ahhhh... 25000 death people in iraq  in name of "freedom by God" ...  damm im still wondering that they do not eat that
:rolleyes: [/B]


OK, you're kinda losing me here. I'm not sure what the right thing to do was in Iraq, which is why I don't get to live in the White House. If GWB decieved us to get revenge or some other ulterior goal, he screwed up and deserves the flack he gets. If he did his best to deal with a threat, and had the guts to make a risky call even at the cost of his place in history, then he deserves some credit for courage -- even if you think his choice misguided.

But don't use propaganda -- Iraqis died while the world watched and did nothing. Hundreds of thousands died in the Iran/Iraq war, adn at least tens of thousands more died in systematic terror and torture. He repeatedly used chemical weapons on his minority groups in the 80s, and europe did nothing. If you're going to blame the US for deaths in the last year, then acknowledge the lives saved as well -- and realize that the blood of those hundreds of thousands was shed because no one did anything about it.
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Common sense is trying to not be an idiot right now

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Offline Dago

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« Reply #175 on: July 10, 2004, 02:00:34 PM »
For Beetle and those who choose to read our "discussions",  what I have failed to understand in the past, and still do in the present, is Beetles motives.

He talks about living here, he talks in this thread about seeing so many of our beautiful sights, repeatadly traveling to the USA, yet he consistantly attacks our nation and our people.

I fail to understand why he does this, and he has yet to give any reason for it.  

So, time to explain beetle bug, why are you so angry and full of contempt?  Where have we hurt you or done you wrong?

dago
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, martini in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming "WOO HOO what a ride!"

Offline Crumpp

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« Reply #176 on: July 10, 2004, 02:16:16 PM »
Quote
one more question. How many young boys from, which were homosexuals, because they can not have girl, did you meet?


Quite a few.  They are quite rampant in ME military's.  Matter of fact one firebase I was at we noticed a 14-15 host nation guys would sneak into the chow hall late at night.  When we casually asked what was up they became evasive.  Since nothing was coming up missing in the chow hall we concluded something was up.  We suspected that some of our guards where behind some of the rocket attacks on the Firebase.  Well, we got quite a shock when we got film of these guys "buggering" one another.

Later we found the guards who were launching rockets at us.  They were afraid we would fire them if things calmed down.  So to keep their jobs they shot a few 107mm rockets near the base every few days.

 Another guy or around 19 years old brought his wife to our doctor.  He said she was "defective" and could not have children and asked if we could help.  The man had been trying for a year to get her pregnant.  Well, when the Doc examined her, she was still a virgin.

In another ME country the host nation troops thought our cooks were the same as their "platoon boys".  Since the platoon boys did the laundry, cooking, as well as entertained at night.  Their commander was not pleased when we refused his offer of exchanging Platoon boys for the awhile.

Another ME country the Host nation threw a party.  Since most of the host nation soldiers were single, they brought in "party boys".  In the US we call them "transvestites".  They danced, sang, and afterwards went off with soldiers for some private entertainment.   The officer in this country told me "Women are for having children, boys are for fun."  

I am not a fan of certain aspects of Arab culture.  Of course we have gays too.  Ours are just more vocal and practice the "gay" lifestyle on the open.  Even in these ME countries these men where not "gay" to their culture.  It was an acceptable substitute to homosexual sex since they were not married.  

Just can't follow that line of thinking!  

Not all ME countries now have these kind of standards.  It seems the more moderate the country the less this kind of stuff goes on.  The more "Theocratic" the Government the more you see this behavior since premarital heterosexual sex is frowned upon.

Crumpp

Offline lada

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« Reply #177 on: July 10, 2004, 02:25:06 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Simaril

 
You're fooliing yourself to say that religion doesnt have an influence in Europe; 1500 years of Christian worldview has shaped the nature of european "right and wrong" deeply.


You know whats most funny, that only western europe were Christians, rest were Orthodox or pohans.

Im not fooling myself. lets see Europian constitution. When godlovers call for integrating christian roots into it, it were deny and nobody gave a chit.


man at 15st. cen. did die in name of god about 400 000 only here in lill Czech.

Actualy it were kinds and Queens who made propgress in live of poeple, like  mandatory education for children and so on.

You can name some examples, when church use power for goodness of normal people ?

And thing you didnt get about Iraq.
When somebody who is "Christian" going to Liberate country where 70% are muslims with words " Freedom is gift given to us by God" it particulary smell even for atheists.
Another liberalization in name of God rights... ohh well... i trough that  we live in 21st. cen... and not 16st. cen.

Churches had their own part in history of Europe, but it seems to be over.
« Last Edit: July 10, 2004, 02:35:25 PM by lada »

storch

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« Reply #178 on: July 10, 2004, 02:28:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Dago
For Beetle and those who choose to read our "discussions",  what I have failed to understand in the past, and still do in the present, is Beetles motives.

He talks about living here, he talks in this thread about seeing so many of our beautiful sights, repeatadly traveling to the USA, yet he consistantly attacks our nation and our people.

I fail to understand why he does this, and he has yet to give any reason for it.  

So, time to explain beetle bug, why are you so angry and full of contempt?  Where have we hurt you or done you wrong?

dago


He is a euro. a poor misguided product of that failed social experiment dating back to post WWII europe.  There, but for the grace of God go we.

The same social experimentation that the liberals would inflict upon us.  With the aid and guidance of their wise euro mentors of course.

That is the battle we are currently waging.  We are fighting to preserve our rich and proven superior culture.

Note when scandinavia allowed homosexual marriage the result was that now 63% of all children are born out of wedlock.  the institution of the family is virtually dead.

In sweden there is a Pastor serving a prison sentence for preaching out of the Bible!  for preaching from Romans Chapter 1.

That is what they want for us.  oh and also to tax us to pay for more social experimentation on a global scale.

Does anyone ever go crab fishing?  when you go crab fishing you need to either get a lid for your container, or catch two crabs simultaneously.  If you do as one crab tries to escape out of the container the other one will pull it down.  The more crabs in the container the less likely any will escape.  Humans are like that also.

Offline lada

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« Reply #179 on: July 10, 2004, 02:34:28 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Crumpp

I am not a fan of certain aspects of Arab culture.  Of course we have gays too.  Ours are just more vocal and practice the "gay" lifestyle on the open.  Even in these ME countries these men where not "gay" to their culture.  It was an acceptable substitute to homosexual sex since they were not married.  

Just can't follow that line of thinking!  

Not all ME countries now have these kind of standards.  It seems the more moderate the country the less this kind of stuff goes on.  The more "Theocratic" the Government the more you see this behavior since premarital heterosexual sex is frowned upon.

Crumpp


:rofl

Well in out national guard, whitch is supposed to  guard president, we have homo incidents quite often. May be 3x times a year we can read in news papers, that some soldier raped another soldier and when he went to have a speach about it  with psycholog, psycholog raped him again and few more.

I expect it to be quite higher in "normal" unit. Its quite spread problem in army here and in jails.


i dont think its problem related to ME.


Where have you been in ME ?