anyone wanna learn acm's

[Stang]

Yup, now it has gotten to the point where people only vulch or get vulched, there aren't very many good fights at alt between fields anymore

[SlapShot]

Originally posted by Stang
Yup, now it has gotten to the point where people only vulch or get vulched, there aren't very many good fights at alt between fields anymore

ahem ... I beg your pardon !

[dedalos]

Originally posted by SlapShot
ahem ... I beg your pardon !

Yeah, stop vulching me Slap

[Edbert]

Originally posted by Stang
Yup, now it has gotten to the point where people only vulch or get vulched, there aren't very many good fights at alt between fields anymore

While that is generally true, there are SOME high alt fights, they just don't last long. One guy will begin to lose angles and then dive for the deck. The fact that the furballs don't stay in the middle is just a coincidence, like the natural ebb and flow of battle. A rook/nit furball seems to flow less than the rook/bish ones. The bish seem to die en masse, which also means they up and enter the fray en masse about 5 minutes later

[SlapShot]

Originally posted by dedalos
Yeah, stop vulching me Slap

LOL ... mid-air vulching is OK ...  

[Hajo]

Think it best to learn SA first.


Then learn some basic acm.


Great rules for situational awareness.

1.)  Location....close to nme air field where planes will up quickly?
2.)  Number of enemies and alt.  Always fight from top down.
      engage biggest threats and potential threats first.
3.)  Type of aircraft in fight...faster? better climbing etc.
4.)  Rule of thumb....don't get mad at pilot who shot you down.
      Get mad at yourself....you put yourself into position to be a
      target.  Make the others targets....not you.

All the ACM in the world isn't going to help you if you've got 5 aircraft on your 6 and they're faster.....you're 30 feet above the deck and headed into the nme airbase ack to avoid being shot down because you've forgotten where you are.  And there are 6 planes on the nme airbase runways taking off.

Placing ACM before SA to me like putting cart before the horse

Plan your attack by knowing the situation.....even if you've no ACM experience if you dive down high E and climb away from the threat with speed....that is ACM.  When you get down and dirty in a one vs. one then ACM is imperative....but getting into that 1 vs. 1 situation utilizes SA first....then ACM.

[Vudak]

I wouldn't mind learning a few ACM's in a FW190 (A5, D9, whatever)

Right now I'm doing alright, but yes, I do HO alot.  It's not the only thing I go for, and certainly not my first choice, but if it's sitting there, I take them.  You have to admit, although it is very, very dweeby, taking an A8 with some 30mm cannons HO can be fun for a change

Nevertheless, I don't feel like being a newbie forever in this regard, but there are just some planes I can't seem to deal with! Also, I really don't like going much over 10-12k so having a better understanding on how to fight-fight would really improve my K/D, and make the game more fun for everyone else.

It just seems like after a  non-HO merge, if I have E I'm going for spiral-climb or zoom rope-a-dope, and not much else.  If he has the E, it's usually a series of Split-S's.  I'd like to add some more tricks if anyone's interested in turning me into a more respectable pilot.

[Redd]

Originally posted by Vudak
I wouldn't mind learning a few ACM's in a FW190 (A5, D9, whatever)

Right now I'm doing alright, but yes, I do HO alot.  It's not the only thing I go for, and certainly not my first choice, but if it's sitting there, I take them.  You have to admit, although it is very, very dweeby, taking an A8 with some 30mm cannons HO can be fun for a change

Nevertheless, I don't feel like being a newbie forever in this regard, but there are just some planes I can't seem to deal with! Also, I really don't like going much over 10-12k so having a better understanding on how to fight-fight would really improve my K/D, and make the game more fun for everyone else.

It just seems like after a  non-HO merge, if I have E I'm going for spiral-climb or zoom rope-a-dope, and not much else.  If he has the E, it's usually a series of Split-S's.  I'd like to add some more tricks if anyone's interested in turning me into a more respectable pilot.

resist the temptation to HO completely and focus on the other merge options. By the time you have performed the attempted HO you have handed the angles adv to the other guy, which then reduces your options dramatically.

save  the HO for when you are outnumberd and desperate .

there are many threads on this in "help and training"

[TequilaChaser]

Originally posted by Hajo
Think it best to learn SA first.


Then learn some basic acm.


Great rules for situational awareness.

1.)  Location....close to nme air field where planes will up quickly?
2.)  Number of enemies and alt.  Always fight from top down.
      engage biggest threats and potential threats first.
3.)  Type of aircraft in fight...faster? better climbing etc.
4.)  Rule of thumb....don't get mad at pilot who shot you down.
      Get mad at yourself....you put yourself into position to be a
      target.  Make the others targets....not you.

All the ACM in the world isn't going to help you if you've got 5 aircraft on your 6 and they're faster.....you're 30 feet above the deck and headed into the nme airbase ack to avoid being shot down because you've forgotten where you are.  And there are 6 planes on the nme airbase runways taking off.

Placing ACM before SA to me like putting cart before the horse

Plan your attack by knowing the situation.....even if you've no ACM experience if you dive down high E and climb away from the threat with speed....that is ACM.  When you get down and dirty in a one vs. one then ACM is imperative....but getting into that 1 vs. 1 situation utilizes SA first....then ACM.

Got my vote, Hajo

what I find interesting is the fact that everyone in this thread never brought up that ACM's is different than BFM

BFM = Basic flight Maneuvers
ACM = Air Combat Maneuvering

you got to know BFM before you can do ACM, and ACM is a combination  of 2 or more BFMs that are decided upon & executed during an given fight depending on what the opponet is doing. There are no set ways. One could go from a immelman to a low yo-yo to a spiral climb to a split s or immelman to immelman to split-s. To know ACM is to have the knowledge of BFM and the acquired ability to perform such BFMs in a fluid like motion without hesitation when the situation calls for it , react to the fight don't think and go "what do I do now"! If you have the knowledge of BFMs with time you will learn when to use what maneuver and when not to use it.

so learn all the different BFMs there are to learn, then practice switching them up with a friend while fighting each other, or get with a long time player or Trainer and let them explain it to you in further detail and give you some things to practice on etc.........


anyhow. I just wanted to bring jaxxo's thread back up since  I thought  he had a great idea/suggestion!!!

[dedalos]

Originally posted by Stang
Yup, now it has gotten to the point where people only vulch or get vulched, there aren't very many good fights at alt between fields anymore

I ll tell you what.  If next time we meet you let me off the runway, I promise to kill you after we fight and not during the vulch atempt.





JK

[wetrat]

Originally posted by RedTop
.I have no idea what ACM really is. I don't really no what an immelman vs. a split s is.

You're right, you don't know what ACM is. Immelmans and split S's are BCM.

[TequilaChaser]

actually if you really want to get technical about BFM, ACM, ACT etc.......

check out Badboy's article below:

Transferable Skills in Simulated Air Combat


it is a great read........

[Magoo]

Originally posted by Hajo
Think it best to learn SA first.


All the ACM in the world isn't going to help you if you've got 5 aircraft on your 6 and they're faster.....you're 30 feet above the deck and headed into the nme airbase ack to avoid being shot down because you've forgotten where you are.  And there are 6 planes on the nme airbase runways taking off.

 

Were you in my La5 last night? I don't remember the join request...

Magoo

[SkyRock]

RedTopp, I too have a problem with the terminology of flight manuevers.  I have battled any "Elite" pilot that takes time to log out MA and in DA.  The majority of comments that I heard were "you're too timid".  I always felt why do they say this, I am trying to kill them.  Recently, I am realizing what they were seeing in me.  IMHO it is just as important to be "extremely" aggressive in your attack on the enemy while learning countering manuevers as well.  Right now I am trying to learn as many different ways to kill the guy d600 my 6 as possible.  Not just get out alive but kill him dead.  I suggest that learning the SpitV manuevers with planes like Jugs, ponies, hogs, and hellcats will greatly enhance ur SpitV manuevers.  I do not claim to be a real good pilot but dying as much as I have, You just learn things.  Mostly SA is key to landing multiple kill sorties in MA.  It can be easy to outfly a guy in a tight dogfight but to celebrate by being cherrypicked takes fun away. :-)
P.S. Sorry for babbling.   Jaxxo, yes I do go to DA and teach newbs all that I know, which isnt much. hee hee  But you would be surprised by how many newbs fly la7's cause they can see out the back default.  most common is setting views,  wep,  just basic stuff.  I also have been telling the guys how the initial merge HO is lowclass.  which is what I have come to believe.  :

[jaxxo]

4th and wayyyyyy long.