Author Topic: Bf110G-2 vs. Mosquito FB.Mk VI (Read 2293 times)

GScholz · « **Reply #45 on:** July 23, 2004, 04:46:07 PM »

Here's a quiz for you: What was the fastest fighter in the BoB?

Answer: The Bf110.

It didn't help the 110, and it don't help the Mossie as a fighter either.

Karnak · « **Reply #46 on:** July 23, 2004, 04:51:01 PM »

No, but the more common crossing of the North Sea is fairly wide.

BTW, I assure you, the Bf109G-2, Bf109G-6 and Fw190A-5 will all handily run a Mossie down. No dive required.

I don't think it was a super speed demon. I think that it could do about 350mph on the deck. Enough to run in the flat, but not enough if attacked from above or if surprised.

337mph just doesn't get it done.

And that isn't considering the obvious short commings against the likes of the La-7.

EDIT:

Bf110C-4?

That, as I understood it, topped out at 340mph. The Bf109E and Spitfire Mk I both topped out at about 355mph.

In AH I consider the Bf110C-4 to be the best of the 1940 fighters. The Spit I and 109E roll too poorly and are too fragile and the Hurri I is too slow.

GScholz · « **Reply #47 on:** July 23, 2004, 05:11:37 PM »

The Mosquito FB.IV had a top speed of 380 mph at altitude, and our Mossie got those blasted flame dampeners. On the deck a speed of about 340 mph sounds reasonable without the dampeners.

The Bf110C-4 had a top speed close to that of the Spit I of about 355 mph at altitude, but on the deck the 110 was much faster than both the Spit and 109 at 300 mph.

And no. The 1942-43 German plane set will not "handily run a Mossie down" if they fly at cruise speeds and don't have an alt advantage when they spot the Mossie. In real life it was the exception that the Mossies were intercepted, and then it was the exception that the Mossies got away unscaved. Any fighter can catch a low Mossie if they have alt.

Urchin · « **Reply #48 on:** July 23, 2004, 05:13:56 PM »

I've chased Mossies around in a 109G-6 and never caught up, I think the Mossie is a little faster on the deck. The G-10 can catch it easy though.

Yea, looking on the charts at http://www.jannousiainen.net/online_sims/jg_4/index.htm
the Mosquito is faster than the 109F-4, G-2, and G-6 on the deck. Only like 5 mph faster though, the A5 is a little faster on the deck, and the A8 is about 10 mph faster.

J_A_B · « **Reply #49 on:** July 23, 2004, 05:15:15 PM »

"Now, why did the Mosquito have anything like a good reputation in reality?"

Performance alone doesn't deterine how good or bad an airplane is. It's ability to fill a needed role is what counts. For a long time the Mosquito was the only plane available that could do the jobs tasked to it.

Plus, if I'm not mistaken, some later versions were faster than the one we have in AH.

When are you usually on Karnak? I'll look you up.

J_A_B

JB73 · « **Reply #50 on:** July 23, 2004, 05:21:34 PM »

thinking about this thread on the way home.. Karnak, you originally wanted to know whay in the MA the 110 was used more.

i think i covered that in my post... it was all about MA "gameplay"

i'll alos add i think the 110 (in AH1) was (a huge WAS) better at knocking out GVs. in AHII the guns just dont work the same, but i used to be able to kill 2 panzers with the big bombs, disable 2 with salvo 2 on the 50kg's., and strafe out the turret on 3-4 more before damage or reloading.

another point....

IRL the 110 never faced any of the PAC fighters, or other LW planes.

in the game a 110 vs 109g10 is a great fight, co-E, i'd say 2/3 the time or more against an equal pilot i would win that one in the 110 easy.

stuff like that (what it faced and in what situation) makes a huge difference in the MA i believe. the 190d is my ride of choice because it is soo cool looking, but alos because i can chase a pony, run from a zeke, dive with a p47.. and so on.

my 190 almost never fights a pony @ 23,000 feet like IRL, but i do get in scraps with spitV's on the deck. if i want to extend and reset i can in the dora.

its hard to explain what im trying to say, but i think the 110 is better suited to the EXTREME diversity in the MA compared to the mossie, which was better suited to its role IRL.

does that make sence?

GScholz · « **Reply #51 on:** July 23, 2004, 05:45:58 PM »

Karnak · « **Reply #52 on:** July 23, 2004, 06:00:32 PM »

Without the flame dampers the FB.VI with Merlin 25 engines would do a little better than 350mph.

The charts put the it at 337mph or 338mph with the flame dampers.

If you like I can link some charts for the flame dampered FB.VI when I get home.

Urchin,

In the CT I have been run down by both the Bf109G-2 and Fw190A-5. It is a long, long chase, but they will do it eventually. Particularly after the Mossie's WEP runs out and they still have five minutes left.

J_A_B,

It is kinda random nowadays. I go for days or weeks without logging on, then I fly for three or four hours for a few days straight.

We'd have to agree to a time really.

I'm available Sunday afternoon, PST.

JB73 · « **Reply #53 on:** July 23, 2004, 06:05:58 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Karnak
Particularly after the Mossie's WEP runs out and they still have five minutes left.

more like 10+ minutes left if it was full.

Karnak · « **Reply #54 on:** July 23, 2004, 06:21:53 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by JB73
more like 10+ minutes left if it was full.

If the Bf109G-2 or Fw190A-5 do not use their WEP the Mossie will rapidly pull away. They start with 10 minutes of WEP, the Mossie starts with 5 minutes. When the Mossie runs out, they have 5 minutes left.

GScholz · « **Reply #55 on:** July 23, 2004, 08:29:33 PM »

There was a series on Discovery Europe some time ago that focused on the air war in Europe. One of the episodes was about the night-fighters, night-bombers, and flak. One Bf110G-4 pilot was interviewed and his stories was very interesting. One was over Berlin when a piece of debris from a Lancaster he had just shot down hit his 110 and he and his radar operator had to bail. He got stuck as he tried to get out and (he looked embarrassed as he said this) cried for his mother as he fought himself free of the plane.

His other story has more relevance to this thread however; he was hunting a Mosquito one night (he identified it by it's speed) and tried to intercept it. He pulled the handle releasing his drop tanks and turned on WEP. After a long chase he realized he could not gain on the Mossie, only keep up with it, and fearing his engines would blow he broke off the pursuit and returned to base. On the ground he found out the drop tanks never dropped and chewed out the ground crew really good (he smiled saying that).

Karnak · « **Reply #56 on:** July 23, 2004, 11:29:52 PM »

Here are the charts I promised:

And, less usefull, but still interesting:

GScholz · « **Reply #57 on:** July 24, 2004, 12:24:51 AM »

The Mk.33 was a 1944 carrier version, and the Mk.35 is a 1948 post-war model.

330-340 mph on the deck seems accurate for a Mk.VI

Edit: We have a Mk.VI

Karnak · « **Reply #58 on:** July 24, 2004, 02:13:55 AM »

The Mk 33 (particularly that Mk 33) is an FB.Mk VI with naval equipment and four bladded props.

I have a reference that says what effect the four bladded prop had, but it is at work. I won't have access to it until monday. De Haviland tested the four bladed prop in '42 or '43 and was not impressed with it. IIRC, the Mk 33 had it for the boosted accelration at low speed so that it could take off of a carrier.

The Mk 33 is a Mk VI in all but name.

GScholz · « **Reply #59 on:** July 24, 2004, 02:25:19 AM »

The Mk.33 had folding wings, a four bladed prop, different exhaust stack, and the engines ran on 1944 boost levels. Our Mk.VI is a 1943 version I believe.