The 1945 arena

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

Originally posted by Arlo
Actually you are assuming. And in doing so, you reveal your own impressions. I never said that. Read the post again, my friend.

I read it. You've taken the position that those against the ENY limiter are the whiners. You consistently take the position that they should have to suffer a switch of sides they don't want or suffer the ENY limiter. Your position is that it is fair, and anyone against it is a whiner.

As far as your proposed time limits for change to take place, you know damned good and well you can't force the natural ebb and flow numbers swing in a certain time frame. It does not work that way, and you've been around long enough to know better.

You'll pardon me if I don't take much if any more time to verbally joust with you. I'm actually working on some theories about what is happening and why. The arguement for the sake of arguing is leading down a dead end road. It is gaining nothing.

[Shane]

Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
I'm actually working on some theories about what is happening and why.  

it's very simple...

here's the cliff's notes of zazen's opus....

human nature. in other words, #'s beget #'s.  lemmings are as lemmings do.

and the "vets" in general, on all sides, have been terrible role models for the noobs coming in.

and fragile egos.

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

Originally posted by Shane
it's very simple...

here's the cliff's notes of zazen's opus....

human nature. in other words, #'s beget #'s.  lemmings are as lemmings do.

and the "vets" in general, on all sides, have been terrible role models for the noobs coming in.

and fragile egos.

It is actually more complex than that, I'm pretty sure. Sure there is the herd mentality, but that does not explain it all. You make some valid points.

[Shane]

very few things, if anything, are more complicated than human nature.

but it boils down to monkey see, monkey do. of course there are different types of monkeys. and some monkeys evolve.

"birds of a feather, monkey-do together."

[Arlo]

Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
I read it. You've taken the position that those against the ENY limiter are the whiners. You consistently take the position that they should have to suffer a switch of sides they don't want or suffer the ENY limiter. Your position is that it is fair, and anyone against it is a whiner.

There ya go, Virg. And yes, that's my take. It had nothing to do with persecuting rooks from the get go. Thank you.

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

Originally posted by Arlo
There ya go, Virg. And yes, that's my take. It had nothing to do with persecuting rooks from the get go. Thank you.

You confuse using the Rooks as an example with saying they are persecuted. Which once again IGNORES my position that I don't like the restriction applied to ANYONE. This isn't about me, I fly other planes. This is not about the Rooks, others are affected as well. This IS about an illconceived "solution" to a problem that does not really exist to the extent some claim it does. And the fact that the solution isn't really a solution at all.

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

Originally posted by Shane
very few things, if anything, are more complicated than human nature.

but it boils down to monkey see, monkey do. of course there are different types of monkeys. and some monkeys evolve.

"birds of a feather, monkey-do together."

LOL. Monkeys, slobberdonkeys, whatever. Always the same. Name calling is an effective solution. It is a real boon to the community. Everyone responds well to it. NOT.  

And yes, you fly better than I do. So what? My son is better at Pokemon on his Gameboy. So you're on the same level, you're better at a game than some. Big deal. In the greater scheme of things, even in the game, it means little. Or really, it means nothing. And you know it.

[Guppy35]

Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
You confuse using the Rooks as an example with saying they are persecuted. Which once again IGNORES my position that I don't like the restriction applied to ANYONE. This isn't about me, I fly other planes. This is not about the Rooks, others are affected as well. This IS about an illconceived "solution" to a problem that does not really exist to the extent some claim it does. And the fact that the solution isn't really a solution at all.

There is always going to be restriction in one form or another.  I would imagine the argument was made that the overwhelming hordes restrict people's flying.

If I'm hemmed in to a couple of constantly capped bases with no real chance to fly, where's the enjoyment for me?

You could in return say, "Switch sides" but that's hardly balancing if I join the horde just so I can get up and away from an airfield.

So it still comes down to trying to balance things so the restrictions on everyone are limited as opposed to overwhelming.

Dan/Slack

[Elfie]

The ENY limiter applies to all three teams equally. How Rooks are the *persecuted* team is beyond my comprehension. Flying for Knights there have been times I couldnt fly certain planes because of the limiter, no biggie for me, I just select a different plane.

If I am flying against a team that has a large numbers advantage I am happy that I wont be facing 5 P51D's, 8 Spit9's, 12 La-7's and 15 N1k2's all at the same time.

The ENY limiter evens the playing field. If you choose to change sides or not, that is up to you.

Mr Virgil, how much fun do you think it is to repeatedly get ganged by hordes of late war planes? It's not fun at all and I suspect that is a big reason why HiTech implemented the ENY limiter. Games are meant to be fun, when a game isnt fun for everyone involved it is no longer a game.

No one is forcing you to change countries, although that is an option and always was. We all make many many choices everyday. Why is one more choice to make so horrendous to so many people? If you choose to not change countries then you may very well have the ENY limiter kick in and have limits imposed on what aircraft you can fly. You make the choice and the consequences (good or bad) kick in. That happens with every single choice we make in life, why should this game be any different?

[SlapShot]

NEVER punish a paying customer by taking something from him. Offer a reward or incentive or something to another customer to make them happy. But NEVER punish a customer by taking something away from him that you allow another customer to continue to have and enjoy. Never FORCE a customer to do something he does not want to do, like make a choice he would not ordinarily have to make.

It all depends upon the angle at which you look at it.

Just think of it as a REWARD ... you can fly all planes because you chose to fly for an outnumbered country.

Think of it from the standpoint that all countries have all planes disabled and only if you try to achieve numbers balance, will you be REWARDED with better planes.

It's where you came from that leads you to believe that it is a punishment ... I have chosen to look at it from the other angle.

[Roscoroo]

OH the insanity ... Help help help somebody Saaaaaaaaave ME !!!

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

Once again, for those of you who choose to ignore what I'm saying, and to repeatedly make this about any one country, or any one person, or any one plane. Read carefully.

The ENY limit rarely affects me and when it does, I fly another plane. Not a problem for me. From a personal enjoyment standpoit I DON'T CARE. It is NOT all about me, or my favorite plane. I don't have a problem with flying the TBolt or the Corsair. As much as you'd LIKE for this to be the case it is not. Get over it. I'm just as bad in one as I am the other, and I don't need this game to stroke my ego.

This is not about the Rooks being "persecuted" no matter how much you'd like that to be the case. It IS about any player on any side who happens to like a particular plane, and is forced to either abandon that plane or switch sides, neither of which he WANTS to do. I really don't care if he's a Bishop or a Knight, or a Rook. I don't even care if it is a person I have a personal dislike for. He's playing a GAME because he WANTS to, because he ENJOYS it. I don't give a damn WHAT he flies, he can have it. It's part of his fun. More power to him.

The absolute worst he can do to me is shoot me down in virtual reality. Big fat hairy freaking deal. And I'll still fight him if he has an ENY 5 plane and three buddies with ENY 5 planes, and I'm alone. I'll fly out of my way and specifically go there to fight him and his buddies, even alone. I do not need a silly GAME as a yardstick to stroke my ego or prove my manhood. If I'm in the mood to play, I'll take any fight, against any plane, and any pilot. I'll go look for a better pilot who always beats me, and fight him over and over, and don't care if I lose every time, so long as I most often make a decent fight of it. If the odds get too bad, I'll either log for a while, or move.

I don't want to see anyone face overwhelming odds every time they log on. But I have yet to see that happen to any one side on a daily basis for even a week. I log on at least five out of seven days, often more. And despite all the Bravo Sierra to the contrary, I've seen the Rooks outnumbered and down to 1/3 or less the fields of either of the other two countries as many as 2 or 3 nights in any given week, and if you divide 7 days by three countries, you get 2 1/3 days each, so that ain't too bad at all. I've logged on and found Rooks to be in the hole on just about any night of the week but Sunday, and a time or two I've seen it then. I've seen Knights or Bishops with the upper hand 1 or 2 nights a week a piece most every week. To hear a bunch of people around here tell it, the Rooks have both countries down to 3 or 4 fields and getting vulched to pieces at least 5 out of 7 nights every week. That's the biggest crock of crap I've heard since I started flight sims 6 or 7 years ago.

I'm going to go and celebrate my daughter's birthday, and then fly. I'm sure I'll here plenty of whines tonight about numbers and altitude. I'll ignore them because they are whines. If you are looking for someone to give you a level field or to come at you with no advantage, quit playing against real people and go find an AI game. Enjoy yourselves, I know I will.

[Arlo]

Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
You confuse using the Rooks as an example with saying they are persecuted. Which once again IGNORES my position that I don't like the restriction applied to ANYONE. This isn't about me, I fly other planes. This is not about the Rooks, others are affected as well. This IS about an illconceived "solution" to a problem that does not really exist to the extent some claim it does. And the fact that the solution isn't really a solution at all.

Why's it ME gots ta be confused bout dis, Kingfish?

Ah says all de whinin' and carryin' on ovuh not wantin' ta switch cause switchin' too hard is de sillyest ting come down de pike.

Yo says Ah is assumin' all sorts o' evil tings `bout dee rooks.

Ah says yo is assumin' Ah's gots a problem wit dee rooks.

You says *AH'S* confusin' yo tawkin' bout dee rooks wit you meanin' ta tawk bout somethin' else an' dat Ah's ignoin' whut ya really meant ta say.

Wait .... yeauh .... ok, Kingfish .... Ah *IS* confused now.

[Roscoroo]

I think I'll take my pet rock out for a walk ...  by the glass house's of course

[Shane]

Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
And yes, you fly better than I do. So what? Or really, it means nothing. And you know it.

correct.  that's why i never raised the issue.

ever heard the idiom's "birds of a feather flock together" and "monkey-see, monkey-do"? all i was referring to is the human nature aspect of what i perceive to be the "problem" with the overall in-game AH community.  i never mentioned any specific ride, side or coding.