Author Topic: Federal Judges are stupid idiots  (Read 2949 times)

Offline Samiam

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Federal Judges are stupid idiots
« Reply #75 on: January 14, 2005, 09:45:55 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by weaselsan
You are telling me that it is not a proven possibility to "seed" life on a planet? To purposely transport and seed life elsewhere...that it has never happened....but life crawling out of a primordial ooze makes sense...no wonder our education system is in a shambles.


I should be more specific.

The creationist belief (not theory, but belief) that the earth is only 6,000 years old, that fosil records are being missinterpreted, and that humans did not evolve and adapt from previous primate-like beings is in no way provable and is not supported by anything that is provable.

On the other hand, it is entirely possible that the "seeding" of life occured; that the appearance of the raw ingredients and the event that "sparked" life were divine. The theory of evolution does not yet adequately explain this nor is it likely ever to.

My own religious convictions do not stem from naively clinging to a belief that flies in the face of all scientific evidence. They come from unsterstanding that there are places where science simply fails us and that even hard core atheist scientists are often amazed at the sheer elegance and awsome beauty of our universe.

But, it took the Catholic church 350 years to absolve Galileo and admit that the earth does, indeed, revolve around the sun (doing so a mere 23 years after we landed a man on the moon using science established by Galileo). Why should evolution be any different?

Offline capt. apathy

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Federal Judges are stupid idiots
« Reply #76 on: January 14, 2005, 10:22:21 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by fd ski
capt. apathy,

with all respect to your train of thought, which is more then most people in this treat, do you suppose that this sort of open interpretation applies to all portions of the bible and religious dogma or to whichever ones we find to "need fixin" at a given time ?

I personally have a big logical problem with people "interpreting" the bible, because depending on will and skill of the person doing the interpretation, you can draw any conclusion, just to suit your desired result.
Which makes the book meaningless.

Recently i read and article about virginity in relation to catholic tradition. There was this girl who would only have oral and anal sex but not vaginal, before the marriage, because THAT would be a sin.

See the sillyness ?
:D


interpretations are useful, different points of view help widen your perspective.  the trick is to not let any persons (or church hierarchy) interpretation over-ride your own.  read for yourself, and think for yourself.  listen to what others say and consider their opinion but don't give any mans interpretation more weight than your own.

my main point is we were gifted with important information, and instead of focusing on that we tend to spend all of our time arguing over some nit-picky little piece of the text and avoid the bigger issue.

more often than not I've found that the majority of people who are overly focused on the literal word instead of the big picture are either trying to avoid dealing with a message that makes them uncomfortable, or they are pushing some kind of agenda other than a better understanding of Gods word.

it's not hard to picture how this argument could have started.    

the Catholic Church (who tends to be the most public in their efforts to interpret the Bible for us, and occasionally come up with rules that I am hard pressed to find reference to in scripture)  has never been big on new ideas.  they see (or at least have in the past) new knowledge as dangerous, a threat to Christianity, or a threat to the power the church controls here on earth.
  at various points in history the idea of a spherical planet, gravity, or the earth orbiting the sun  could have got you in a bit of trouble.

so the theory of evolution gets batted around and the church sees it as a threat and condemns it.  but the only real problem with the theory is the conflict with the word 'day', so thats all they can really focus on.

instead of pointing out that they seem to be missing the bigger point, the scientists get suckered into the time frame argument and start parading around evidence that supports their position of a more lengthy time span.

the end result is it breaks down into a us vs them argument where nobody really listens but just keeps stating that they are right and the other side is full of crap.

there is a lot of relevant info that gets completely overlooked while we argue back and forth about a small discrepancy that is based on what definition of the word 'day' you choose to use.

the creation passage not only tells us where we come from, it shows how the earth came to be and if you are paying attention you'll see the stages that progressed until we were created.  for me, one message I get from this is our dependence on all of the things created before us.  how everything from our solar system to the plants and animals on this earth are the foundation that we are built on, and if we screw them up we'll likely suffer for it.

we argue about a word interpretation and completely blow off the fact that the theory of evolution confirms through science what God told us in Genesis.
  it also raises the question as to how that information got into the Bible several thousand years before science brought us the theory of evolution.  how would an atheist explain that?  Lucky guess?

Offline DREDIOCK

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Federal Judges are stupid idiots
« Reply #77 on: January 14, 2005, 01:23:35 PM »
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Originally posted by JB73
rpm you are confusing Christianity with Religion.

if there is to be TRUE seperation then it has to be equal on all grounds.

there are religions like the defination says that believe we came from UFO's and the planet evolved...

one could say teaching evolution in a school is an endorsment of that religion,


Nowhere in the constitition does it mention a "seperation of church and state"
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Offline Sandman

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Federal Judges are stupid idiots
« Reply #78 on: January 14, 2005, 02:02:48 PM »
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Originally posted by DREDIOCK
Nowhere in the constitition does it mention a "seperation of church and state"


What do you think "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion..." means?
sand

Offline Nwbie

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Federal Judges are stupid idiots
« Reply #79 on: January 14, 2005, 02:30:49 PM »
What I don't get is--who said "The Creator" didn't create evolution?

Jeez you guys argue about everything lol

NwBie
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Offline DREDIOCK

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Federal Judges are stupid idiots
« Reply #80 on: January 14, 2005, 02:49:06 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Sandman
What do you think "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion..." means?


Its meaning  and its original intended meaning is that the governmentis will not have an "Establishment of Religion"
Meaning a specific religion.

What they were trying to prevent was having an "establishment" ruled by a specific religion such as was the case with Englands Church of England.

Meaning you couldnt have a say "Church of the United States" be the ruling power.

The word "Establishment" is what is getting misinterpreted
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Offline rpm

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Federal Judges are stupid idiots
« Reply #81 on: January 14, 2005, 02:52:10 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Nwbie
What I don't get is--who said "The Creator" didn't create evolution?

Jeez you guys argue about everything lol

NwBie
That is the most plausable theory IMHO. Who says God's day is 24 hours long?
My mind is a raging torrent, flooded with rivulets of thought cascading into a waterfall of creative alternatives.
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Offline SaburoS

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Federal Judges are stupid idiots
« Reply #82 on: January 14, 2005, 03:26:55 PM »
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Originally posted by Lazerus
All this is easy. There is no guarantee of 'seperation' of church and state. There is only a guarantee of that the state will not endorse any one religion. Atheism IS a religion. By excluding the statement that evolution is only a theory and that there might be other explanations of the creation of the world as we know it, the government is favoring atheism and is violating the constitution.

The ruling is unconstitutional and should be overturned.


Sorry,
Atheism is not a religion. IIRC, we atheists are not out to make organized religious organisations pay taxes and force them to teach evolutionism, let alone elimination of creationism in their private schools and Sunday schools.
Some of you Christian types have been trying to force your religion on to us as well as non-Christians for ages.
Two samples:
1) Forced prayer in schools.
2) Elimination of evolution/forced teaching of creationism in public schools.
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Offline Samiam

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Federal Judges are stupid idiots
« Reply #83 on: January 14, 2005, 03:51:19 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Sandman
What do you think "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion..." means?


Wouldn't it be nice if this didn't have to boil down to a church vs. state issue? Which at it's heart it isn't.

It's an issue of whether or not we are going to teach our children honest to goodness science. Putting a disclaimer on a science text that somehow leads a student to believe that true science is not based on fact, when it really is, is harmfull to kids developing critical thinking skills and is ultimately detrimental to our economy.

It's unfortunate that in order to teach science as science we have to fall back on the 4th amendment and the public school system.

Then we sit around and lament why it is that Korean, Chineese, and Indian nationals are taking all the top spots in our elite institutions of higher ed.

Offline Raider179

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Federal Judges are stupid idiots
« Reply #84 on: January 14, 2005, 05:59:39 PM »
Hehe I live in the county that this is going on in. It's bible belt BS. Every now and again in the south they try to ban a few books from the libraries and keep evolution out of textbooks. Wish they would at least act like they live in the 21st century.

Offline JB73

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Federal Judges are stupid idiots
« Reply #85 on: January 14, 2005, 06:02:00 PM »
does it matter what century we live in?

in my mind corrupt morals and ideals are timeless.

sodomy is not named after sodom by coincidence
I don't know what to put here yet.

Offline DREDIOCK

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Federal Judges are stupid idiots
« Reply #86 on: January 14, 2005, 06:07:17 PM »
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Nwbie
What I don't get is--who said "The Creator" didn't create evolution?

Jeez you guys argue about everything lol

NwBie
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote
Originally posted by rpm
That is the most plausable theory IMHO. Who says God's day is 24 hours long?


Oh my goodness, RPM and I agree on something
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Offline capt. apathy

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Federal Judges are stupid idiots
« Reply #87 on: January 14, 2005, 06:11:45 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by rpm
That is the most plausible theory IMHO. Who says God's day is 24 hours long?


exactly the point I was trying to make earlier in this thread.  it was about half way through the 7 days before orbits and rotation stabilized.  how do you measure the time before earth was on a reliable schedule of orbit and spin?

myself I just choose to use the meaning for day that is closer to an age, era, or point of time, instead of the time it takes the little hand to go around twice.

Offline weaselsan

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Federal Judges are stupid idiots
« Reply #88 on: January 14, 2005, 06:29:03 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Sandman
What do you think "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion..." means?


It means congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion.....Now you tell me when at any time in the history of this country,  congress has ever attempted to PASS A LAW establishing a religion. This was part of the constitution to prevent congress from establishing only one legal church such as the "Church of England". That is why the second part goes on to read "or to prohibit the free excercise".

Offline lasersailor184

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Federal Judges are stupid idiots
« Reply #89 on: January 14, 2005, 07:00:01 PM »
I happen to agree with the verdict, even though the fact is that Church and State are not seperated.


School is a place to go to learn what the scientific community believes.  Church is a place to go to learn what the religious community believes.
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