Kill stealing

[Don]

>>I kept thinking his wing would come off any second. It did. Just a second after he released his bombs. He took out the VH. I won't wait the next time.<<

Thats a different situation Lye-El and you at least attempted to avoid doing something crappy, next time you should make sure the guy is dead; from what I have experienced, the guy in the a/c will have gotten the kill anyway, even if you make sure of it while in a manned ack. This is different than the dweeb I wrote about who intended to steal the kill, or the guy who wanted to preserve "his kill" by calling it out before he finished the guy.

[AmRaaM]

snaking kills is a fine art..if not done properly you waste your ammo load.

Morally wrong?...yes.  
Fun?...depends on who from..sometimes very satisfying.


PS. I've learned in this game if it doesnt go "boom" then its not dead and has a chance to rtb.

[Tilt]

Its all too often that when in combat you oppose your enemy but compete with your ally.

There are some ac that continue to be viably offensive some time after they have incurred a pretty feroucious fire. The P38 is an example.

I think we all get annoyed when we see a player chase down a spiraling wingless ac trying to extract the explosion and possibly the "kill".

I think these guys generally do learn that they are displaying very child like game play tendancies and eventually will mature to enjoy the more skill related benefits the game brings.

The odd polite word over range can ususally help speed the process.

Cherry picking from an existing bloodless combat is not so cut and dry IMO.

I have been annoyed when tracers start coming past my shoulder after I have spent what seems like minutes getting my foe to this point.

I also have realised that on some occasions "I really should have have despatched this enemy already" and maybe folk (who have witnessed my foe get a couple of kills despite me stuck to his 6) have lost a little patience with me.

Sometimes I know I'm in trouble.................that I have chosen the wrong fight..........and am quite happy to have my enemy removed before he removes me.

Communication would solve alot of this..........its good to talk.

re a technical fix?


A big step would be to mimick WW2 actuality and award partial kills.

In AH2 it would be a little different.

> 66% of damage you get a kill.
> 33% but < 66% you get a partial kill (halving perks won)
< 33% you get an assist.

2 x a partial kill and you get a kill # added on landing.

This has one additional advantage.........its anti gang banging. There is a chance that none of the 20 folk chasing one poor sucker will end up with a kill. Infact they may all end up with only assists.

[Colt44]

As for stealing kills...

Most of the Pilots that do steal are new to the game.  I remember when I couldn't follow a plane...had 16 fr per second and couldn't tell if a plane was reversing, turning or just had its stabilizer shot off.  If it crossed my gunsite I shot.  You have tunnel vision and the game seems like a million miles an hour.  

As for experienced pilots doing it...well...I dont see it that much.  One should ask a teammate if they need help before you engage in almost every situation....but then again...

In a big furball or capped base defense there is no time to saddle up...run and shoot is the name of the game... and I defer to the previous statement...if it crosses my gunsite...

[Nuke33]

I would think that HiTech could come up with a series of missing flight surface combinations that would deem the plane unflyable. If those combinations are met, then treat shooting at a disabled plane as a killshooter..

[Clifra Jones]

Ya know, if more guys approached this situation with a loose duece wingman tactic they'd be surprised at how many kills they actually get out of it.

Drop down behind and above your countryman, let him know you are there and you have his 6 covered.

If it looks like he is losing the advantage on the bandit, call out "{callsign} break off and recover, I'm on him",  then press the offensive on the bandit.

A good countryman will regain his E and take up the wingman position covering your six.

You may get the kill you may not. If you both work this someone will get the kill and that is the ultimate goal isn't it?

[sullie363]

I rarely have a guy try and steal a kill from me, and when they try I don't think much of it and here's why.  I don't care if a guy joins in on the fight, and if he has the oportunity to get the kill then I say take it.  As for shooting at planes missing wings or something I don't think I have ever lost a kill to one of those guys.  Like Colt said, they tend to be new and not very good shots.  Even if they do get some bullets into the target, odds are I put in more.  Just from my own experiences, a successful kill steal is very rare.

[Don]

It seems Kill stealing is loosely defined as in the eyes of those who have had it done to them; the circumstances are different each time. However, the kind that seems to stick in everyones craw is the one done purposefully, and it IS NOTwhining when you get pissed about it. IMO it is the height of dweebery to swoop in when the work is done by another to take the kill earned by another. The one who does that is hard up for kills and doesn't care how he gets a kill. Here's another thought having to do with the damage model; if you are using regular mg's you may not get any a/c to go boom but, if you are using cannon it most likely will; that is one of the vagaries of this game. So, if you're in a furball make sure you are using a cannon equipped a/c, otherwise your hard earned kills will go to someone else, no matter how many BBz you put into a guy.
If the game makes it okay then it is technically not stealing, and all is fair. If this is the case, then we will have a lot more of it, and then I am sure there will be many more lame threads just like this one

[pellik]

Originally posted by JB35
I also love the whole on the NMY 6 while your fellow countryman is behind you shooting over your shoulder

If you've been on the guy for a while and feel the kill is yours then just quickly roll into your friendlys fire. Getting the killshooter in times like this is often more satisfying then the kill anyway. Usually the friendly will just knock off his aileron or something minor, but they get the message.

-p.

[Mobius0077]

Ok this has happened to me before. But heres my side of the story. If you guys read the other post about guys ditching at 200 MPH and no one getting the kill you'll hear a bit more. I've been in furballs over enemy airfields having a frendly get like a 38 to catch on fire only to have him ditch about 2 miles from the base and getting safly back to base. So after viewing this I decided to make those bishops pay lol, and finishing off a wounded bird to prevent a no kill ditch.

[Don]

I amn reading a book entitled "Wings of Gold" by Gerald Astor, following is an account as told to him by Lieutenant Charles Brewer, about a kill stealing situation:

"Upon getting into range of another fighter, as I was about to fire, a friendly F6F slid in front of me and took out the target. Had I started firing, he would have flown right into my tracers. Lucky guy...."


So we know kill stealing (as we call it) happened during WW2, and it was a dangerous proposition for those that did it. In AH no such penalties occur for the offender.

[Clifra Jones]

Originally posted by Don
I amn reading a book entitled "Wings of Gold" by Gerald Astor, following is an account as told to him by Lieutenant Charles Brewer, about a kill stealing situation:

"Upon getting into range of another fighter, as I was about to fire, a friendly F6F slid in front of me and took out the target. Had I started firing, he would have flown right into my tracers. Lucky guy...."


So we know kill stealing (as we call it) happened during WW2, and it was a dangerous proposition for those that did it. In AH no such penalties occur for the offender.

Correct, the penalty is only or the offendee. If he slides in front of you while your fireing you get the killshooter damage.

[Arcades057]

I've already learned not to get in someone's way.  That being said there have been a few occasions now where I let a burning/one-winged/spiralling downard aircraft slip out of my sights only to have the same badly damaged plane head back into the furball.

I feel bad about taking someone's kill, yeah, but I feel even worse about watching another Bish disintegrate when I could've killed his killer...

[Elfie]

PS. I've learned in this game if it doesnt go "boom" then its not dead and has a chance to rtb.

Thats not an entirely true statement. Damage can be lethal w/o the target going *boom*.

If a plane is missing an entire wing (not just part of one), he is going nowhere but down. If a plane is missing both horizontal stabilizers or his vertical stabilizer, or all 3, he is going nowhere but down.

If a plane is on fire do you shoot till he explodes? Depends on the situation. Bombers that are on fire but not near their drop point, no need to explode them. A Zero in a furball on fire? Yeah, shoot that thing till it goes down. Zero's can burn for days it seems like heh.


Last night I was in a manned ack (forget which base) and friendlies were on the 6 of a Knight F6F, one of them shot the right wing off the F6F but the guns in his left wing were still firing at my gun emplacement so I exploded him.

[Clifra Jones]

Originally posted by Arcades057
I've already learned not to get in someone's way.  That being said there have been a few occasions now where I let a burning/one-winged/spiralling downard aircraft slip out of my sights only to have the same badly damaged plane head back into the furball.

I feel bad about taking someone's kill, yeah, but I feel even worse about watching another Bish disintegrate when I could've killed his killer...

I never assume he dead unless the bandit is falling completely uncontrolable. I don't ussually worry about the kill steal as I've lit up planes that looked entirely undamaged only to be given an assist. So if I take out a heavily damaged plane to keep it from killing a countryman and I get the kill, Oh well. I say that's karma paying me back for all those assists.