Russian classrooms reverting to soviet version of history

[Estel]

Originally posted by MiloMorai
Nope,:)  I asked you.

On the copters, it only shows how incompetent the commie soldiers are that they could not take care of a minimum of 24 'enemy' soldiers when the copters landed.

For your information. The density of soldiers per square kilometer in that place was something about 1 soldier per 30-40 square kilometers. There is a decert.

[Boroda]

Originally posted by Toad
Face it? I'm proud of it.

Still feel pity it didn't happen?...

Originally posted by Toad
The war plan was never to make a pre-emptive first strike. I know. I was tested on the SIOP.

Yeah, you know, and the Drop Shot plan was published in 1968 IIRC. Better try to find anything about it, there was a book devoted to it widely published, and then - try to say something about "denying history".

Originally posted by Toad
However, if the USSR started it, you would have ceased to exist. Period.

And even if that cost the existence of the US, it would have been better than you lot dictating to the world.

Lunatics. Absolute, complete insanity.

Fortunately your plans didn't come true - you realised that USSR can retaliate. Thanks to Khruschev's "missile bluff", otherwise there was nothing to stop you, criminals.

BTW, who's dictating to the world now, even reasoning about history school books? Is it USSR?

[MiloMorai]

Originally posted by Estel
For your information. The density of soldiers per square kilometer in that place was something about 1 soldier per 30-40 square kilometers. There is a decert.

Sure Estel, the copter soldiers were to walk across tens of km of desert to get to the precious oil fields. No commie soldiers in the near vicinity of those precious oil fields? Not like the commies to leave such a precious installation so unprotected.

[genozaur]

Originally posted by Toad Michael J. Kennedy was not one of the Joseph P. Kennedy line. There's a TON of Kennedys in America, some in politics. You think the CIA kills them because of their name. Don't like Stalinist? How about "lunatic"? "Idiot"? You certainly seem to come from an alternate, parallel dimension where everything is exactly the same only completely different. Maybe that's just the USSR though...........

Toad, you are really trying to look as an intelligent person. But maybe you trying too hard?

[genozaur]

Originally posted by MiloMorai Toad, do you have any examples of commie a/c entering North American air space and being allowed to go on their merry way? How about commie a/c that overflew USN ships and were allowed to go on their merry way? How about commie ships that put themselves in the way of USN ships? They could very well have been suicide ships. LOL Borada. How far away was the Canadair from your precious Caspian oilfields?

Milo, this CIA cargo plane (as we now know) was closing on Yerevan,the capital of Armenia, the city with the population of over one million (one third of the population of Armenia). Yerevan is situated in the Araratian Valley where there lives over one fourth of the rural population of Armenia. That makes together about one million six hundred thousand Armenian people under immediate threat from the sky (slightly over one half of the whole population of Armenia). Armenian nation suffered the Turkish genocide in 1915. You think any Soviet pilot would hesitate to shoot down or even ram those bastards flying "a civilian plane" ? The problem is that the "humanistic" intentions of the USAF highest command (and of higher circles) directly resulted in the thousands of deaths in the WTC inferno on 9/11. And still some retired pilots are trying to defend that "humanistic" approach to the concept of the national air defence system. Take for instance the notoriously known here at these BBS Mr Toad. He is a tipical volunteer stool pigeon (in Russian "podsadnaya outka",literally="set duck") who thinks that he is defending his country against the threat of Communism. On the contrary, with the kind of attitude he has, he is just handing his country out to the home "Bolsheviks".

[genozaur]

Originally posted by MiloMorai Sure Estel, the copter soldiers were to walk across tens of km of desert to get to the precious oil fields. No commie soldiers in the near vicinity of those precious oil fields? Not like the commies to leave such a precious installation so unprotected.

Wait, Milo. Look up the posts of Boroda here. He's just said that those copters were flying all over the important water supply canal. Taking into account the use of the chemical weapons during the Iraqi-Iranian war, (not mentioning the recent WMD scare that led to the USA-Iraq war), can you just imagine what the presence in the USSR air space of four Iranian Air Force copters could mean for the Soviet air defence command at the time ?

[genozaur]

Originally posted by Staga Disrespectful? Well that was kinda the idea behind that post. Nobody who's defending the crimes Soviet Union and its communist regime did won't get anything else from me. In my books they are just like revisionists and neo-nazies denying holocaust never happened; they all should be put in camps and gulags and lock the gates forever. Don't like it? Not really my problem.

Staga,  there is a very good derogatory term in Russian: "gandon shtopaniy" ("mended condom"). But you are even bigger that that, so this term won't fit you.

[genozaur]

Originally posted by cpxxx You Russian guys have no idea of how strange you views come across. Look we all like paint our country in a good light. But how would you feel if a bunch of Germans came on and claimed Hitler was only trying to protect the world from Bolshevism? Some do in fact. The Japanese have made a big effort to do much the same. There is a big difference between Stalin and Hitler and the Japanese. Most of his repression was against his own people. You should at least recognise that. It is not slur on Russia. It is a slur on Stalin and whole Bolshevik idea. In my history in school I was told that Russia was not the ideal country for Communism. Not enough industry at the time. Germany was the ideal candidate. It went in another direction in the end. Stalin was a tyrant. The political system he presided over was brutal and repressive. If you can't accept that or try to play it down because you feel it embarrasses Russia. Then you need to modify your views.   The regime shares the guilt not the country or it's people.  The only way you can avoid a similar situation in the future is to know what went wrong with your history and try not to repeat it.  It can happen again. The countries and citizens of the Soviet Union were the victims.  The Russian people themselves were victims of Stalin who wasn't even Russian. One other point, I really find it surprising that someone living in New York, Russian or not still equates Western propaganda with Soviet propaganda. Remember Genozaur you are quite free to produce your own propaganda leaflet refuting the Pole's views on Stalin. Try that in the old Soviet Union. Interesting too, that the old resentment against the Poles is still festering. The feeling is mutual I assure you, based on those I've met.

CP, Hitler WAS trying to eliminate Bolshevism. But he did not see that Stalin had already beheaded the Bolshevism in Russia and the USSR. Just try to name the top Bolsheviks who in 1917 led the October (Socialist) revolution. Almost all of them were executed on Stalin's orders by 1941. The rest who survived were in hard labor camps or in prison. You history teacher was following the guidelines laid out by communist theoretitians Marx and Engels in XIX century. They were the guys who considered Germany as the first candidate for the socialist revolution. Stalin WAS a tyrant. Nobody here is trying to deny it. Where did you take it from that myself, Boroda, and other reputable "Stalinists" here ever denied that ? Because our opponents are calling us "Stalinists" ? It's just laughable. Debilitating Western propaganda in no way can be compared to the "soft core" Soviet Agitprop. Try to find here on these BBS my posts about the so-called "Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact". And don't forget to apologize for the above remark of yours. Sincerily,

[mietla]

Originally posted by Estel
After report Kulyapin was ordered to destroy LV-JTN. Considering that fact, that R-98M missiles should have enough distance from target to fire, Kulyapin has made a decision to ram LV-JTN.

Don't tell me that Russki pilots are so stupid. They might be misguided and clueless commies but no one is that silly.


 This is probably the most idiotic thing I've read on this BBS.

[genozaur]

Originally posted by scout What is that about ? Never heard of  western churches 'hating' eastern churches, much less 'hating them more than moslims'. I do know of a serb christian making common cause with american & european christians on an islamic board. No strife there.

Scout, haven't you heard of the late Pope officially apologizing for the crusades against Eastern Christianity and the peoples of eastern Europe ?  

[mietla]

Originally posted by Boroda


No Toad, it's you who denies your participation in preparing nuclear genocide of Soviet people

Put down the bottle Boroda... now!

[Vad]

My dear russian friends.

Your efforts to convince our dear american friends are amazing but it is complete waste of time. You can't do that.

They hate russians. It is just the fact, and you can do nothing with that.

Let see. America has never been at war with Russia. Moreover, almost in all great wars we were together. Russia was one of the first countries who recorgnized the United States after the war for independence, and who even helped the States at that time sending  fleet. But they hate us.

They don't hate Germans with whom they were at war twice in the last century. If you tell them that they hate Japanies for Pearl Harbor they will laugh. No, they don't!. May be, they hate only commies? No, they have no problems with Chinese, half of Americans even don't know that the ruling party in China is Communist Party. May be USSR harmed USA during Cold war, and they can't forgive us? Don't tell them that!. They are convinced that they won the war, and as a result  the USA became the most powerful country in the world. Actually, they are right in that. May be, the reason of this hate is few incidents with Korean, Finnish or American planes? My God, a lot of such incidents happen every year,  but Canadians and British don't hate Americans for friendly fire, Israel doesn't hate Ukraine for good missile shot, etc. May be, they hate us in responce, because we hate them? It is funny, even during cold war I don't think that anybody in USSR seriously hated Americans. We disliked our own  goverment and Party much more. Most of us dreamed to visit New York or Los Angeles, they had much more interesting supermarkets than Russia had.

So, why? Why do they hate commies so much that even now want to send us in Gulag? I don't see any reason. We did nothing wrong to Americans, at least we didn't do anything so serious that it could be reason for such strong feelings.

Why?

Ask any psychiatrists how they call people who hate somebody for no serious reason. Yes, they call them psychopaths. But it is absolutely impossible that the whole country, the most strong and prosperous country in the worls consists of psychopaths.

I know only 2 examples in history when the major part of the population became psychopaths: Germany in 1933 and Russia in late 1920's. In the both cases it was the result of brainwashing.
Seems, we are having the third now.

And you, my dear russian friends, can't compete with free press!

[Toad]

Originally posted by MiloMorai
Toad,

do you have any examples of commie a/c entering North American air space and being allowed to go on their merry way?

[/b]

“On February 27, 1974, a Soviet AN-24 reconnaissance aircraft was low on fuel and made an emergency landing at Gambell Airfield in Alaska. The crew remained on the aircraft overnight. They were provided space heaters and food. They were refueled the next day and they departed. The crew was not detained and the aircraft was not detained.

A Soviet reconnaissance  aircraft, refueled, crew fed and sheltered for free and sent on their way.

There's the difference between us and the "Kill 'em all" Russians you see defending their country's murders.

[Toad]

Originally posted by Boroda
Hint: if you see an interceptor that orders you to land - you are probably in somebody's else airspace.

[/b]

Not likely. 2 of the best navigators in the USAF on each RC using an inertial nav platform coupled to a stellar astrotracker that was proven accurate to within 1/8th of a mile after 8 hours of flight and each Nav having to use another method of plotting position every thirty minutes.

What the interceptors wanted was to capture an RC. Wasn't going to happen. Ever.

 

Proof please. If a plane was shot down - it happened in Soviet airspace.

[/b]

Just ONE example:

22 June 1955 A US Navy P2V-5 Neptune of VP-9 (BuNo 131515), flying a patrol mission from Kodiak Alaska, was attacked over the Bering Strait by two Soviet MiG-15 studmuffinots. The aircraft crash-landed on St. Lawrence Island after an engine was set afire. Of the eleven crew members, including pilot Richard F. Fischer, co-pilot David M. Lockhard, Donald E. Sonnek, Thaddeus Maziarz, Martin E. Berg, Eddie Benko, David Assard and Charles Shields, four sustained injuries due to gunfire and six were injured during the landing. The USA demanded $724,947 in compensation; the USSR finally paid half this amount.

Here's another:

1 July 1960 A US Air Force ERB-47H Stratojet (53-4281) of the 38th Strategic Reconnaissance Squadron, 55th Strategic Reconnaissance Wing, flying over the Barents Sea was downed by Soviet pilot Vasili Poliakov, flying a MiG-15 studmuffinot. Co-pilot Bruce Olmstead and navigator John McKone survived and were taken captive. The pilot, Bill Palm and ELINT operators Eugene Posa, Oscar Goforth and Dean Phillips were killed. Olmstead and McKone were released from Soviet captivity on January 25th, 1961. Bill Palm's remains were returned to the US on July 25, 1960. Eugene Posa's remains were recovered by the Soviets, but never returned to the US.

Wait.. one more..

1967 A US Air Force ERB-47H Stratojet of the 55th Strategic Reconnaissance Wing, flying over Iran, near the Soviet border, was reported to have been hit by a Soviet surface-to-air missile. The damaged aircraft managed to reach the mountains north of Tehran, but crashed before being able to land, killing the entire crew.

I expect a bunch of great arguments like "Soviets are evil by nature" and so on.

No, not by nature... by choice. Which is far, far worse.

 

So - you were not on "combat service"? Here one year in combat counts as 2-3 years.

[/b]

How could we be on "combat service"? There was no war going on with you guys, other than the Cold War. It was no big deal.

 

Don't worry, they'll turn to you later.

I hope so but I think not.