200 Christian Homes Burned in Pakistan

[FiLtH]

One final note...on the question I asked her if it would bother her if we all just end up a pile of black ooze on the bottom of a casket? Personally...It really doesnt bother me. After a life of hard work, and imagining the ailments old age may bring...the peace of nothingness seems somewhat comforting in itself. Yes we love alot of people in the world, but if by chance we arent destined to see them again, we did our best to enjoy those that we had the privilege to share this brief moment in time with.

[Seagoon]

Originally posted by myelo
Seagoon, thanks for the informed replies.

Could I ask a couple more questions along the lines of infants if you have time? What about adults who never have exposure to Christian teachings --for example, a hunter-gatherer in the New Guinea highlands. Is there any exception for them as for infants?

And this may seem a bizarre one but I’ve wondered about it: when an unborn baby – say a 4-week old embryo – goes to heaven, does she stay at that age?

Myelo,

I hope you will forgive me if I answer these quickly, without as much nuance as I would like. I have a committee meeting tomorrow AM and have to drive 3 hours to be there.

1) The bible is quite clear that all men are born fallen, and that in order to be saved, they must be "born again" in the case of normal adults, this comes via the preaching of the gospel. The bible is also clear that salvation cannot be obtained via any other means than faith alone in Christ alone, hence the urgency that attends missions and evangelism. As Christ put it "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me." (John 14:6) and the Apostles echoed, "Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved." (Acts 4:12). We should remember there are no "innocent natives" out there just fallen ones, and we should remember that there are places in Europe and North America were people are just as likely these days to live their entire lives without ever once hearing the gospel. The wonder of it all isn't that some men remain in their sins and end up going to hell, it lies in the fact that we have a God so merciful that he made a way for sinners to be forgiven and reconciled and end up in heaven at the greatest possible cost.

If men could have been saved by any other means than the sacrifice of God's beloved Son in whom he was well pleased (Matt. 17:5) then the Father surely would have encouraged us to follow that path, rather than doing that which was most painful and costly to him.

2) The bible tells us that those who die in Christ, of what ever age, will be raised with bodies that have become incorruptible, celestial, and eternal (1 Cor. 15). I have no doubt that each and every renewed body will be perfectly suited for life in the heavenlies. So no, I don't think they will exist as embryos, but rather their bodies will be made perfect and absolutely adapted for eternity. This is after all the work of the God who "does all things well". Other than that, we don't know much, other than that it will be far, far, better than we could ever imagine: "But as it is written: "Eye has not seen, nor ear heard, Nor have entered into the heart of man The things which God has prepared for those who love Him." (1 Cor. 2:9)

Lets put it this way, the "heaven can wait" theme of movie is entirely wrong, trust me that none of your loved ones of whatever age now present with the Lord in heaven would ever want for a moment to be back here.

- SEAGOON

[Vulcan]

Originally posted by FiLtH
One final note...on the question I asked her if it would bother her if we all just end up a pile of black ooze on the bottom of a casket? Personally...It really doesnt bother me. After a life of hard work, and imagining the ailments old age may bring...the peace of nothingness seems somewhat comforting in itself. Yes we love alot of people in the world, but if by chance we arent destined to see them again, we did our best to enjoy those that we had the privilege to share this brief moment in time with.

The death question is usually a fundamental one many religious followers have issues with. Why do we die? Why do we age.

The answer is evolution, a fundamental part of evolution is the ability to adapt, unfortunately to adapt we must die to make way for offspring, who get weeded out by natural selection. Some people can't deal with the fact that built into our genes is this live reproduce die loop, and that when we die the only thing we leave behind is our children.

On the UFO note, yes I do believe in "ET"s. However, when you take the size of the universe, the statistical likely hood of the right planet, life evolving, life developing technology (this is a biggie, do you need an air breathing organism to develop along the fire technology tree?) then throw in the span on time I think we aren't going to meet someone anytime soon.

[straffo]

Originally posted by Seagoon

732    Battle of Tours: With perhaps 1,500 soldiers, Charles Martel halts a Muslim force of around 40,000 to 60,000 cavalry under Abd el-Rahman Al Ghafiqi from moving farther into Europe.

hu ?

It was Poitier not Tours.100km between both towns

[Seeker]

Originally posted by straffo
hu ?

It was Poitier not Tours.100km between both towns

Quite right.

You guys lost at Poitiers, non?

[straffo]

yep, yetanotherexample of the english treachery  

[fd ski]

   32 Battle of Tours: With perhaps 1,500 soldiers, Charles Martel halts a Muslim force of around 40,000 to 60,000 cavalry under Abd el-Rahman Al Ghafiqi from moving farther into Europe.

Sure it wasn't 15,000 ? Estimates go as high as 75,000 at times.

[myelo]

Thanks Seagoon.

[lazs2]

It is never good to allow any religion to become too big.

lazs

[mosgood]

Originally posted by Seagoon


Yet the Fall is not simply a question of rational deduction. It is a point of divine revelation. It refers to what we call original sin. Original sin does not refer primarily to the first or original sin committed by Adam and Eve. Original sin refers to the result of the first sin—the corruption of the human race. Original sin refers to the fallen condition in which we are born.

That the Fall occurred is clear in Scripture. The Fall was devastating. How it came to pass is open to dispute even among Reformed thinkers. The Westminster Confession explains the event simply, much in the manner that Scripture explains it:
Our first parents, being seduced by the subtlety and temptation of Satan, sinned, in eating the forbidden fruit. This their sin, God was pleased, according to His wise and holy counsel, to permit, having purposed to order it to His own glory.1
Thus, the Fall occurred. The results, however, reached far beyond Adam and Eve. They not only touched all mankind, but decimated all mankind. We are sinners in Adam. We cannot ask, “When does the individual become a sinner?” For the truth is that human beings come into existence in a state of sinfulness. They are seen by God as sinful because of their solidarity with Adam.


- SEAGOON

Nice.  The drug companies have started to learn a thing or two about marketing from religion and you can see it on TV more and more these days.

If they could just make everyone think they are sick with somekind of problem that they have the solution too, from the first day they are born... (as christiananity makes everyone think they are a sinner) then everyone will think they immediately need their drugs from the first day of life to the last.  

I work in Direct response marketing and one of the most amazing things in DR is watching how people are always on the lookout for the easy "Miracle" product that will fill a need.  Usually, it is presented as something incredibly easy to do....but you have to get it from the guy that is selling it.  Getting it from  someone else doesn't work becasue it's a inferior product.

This pitch about accepting Jesus Christ (Who happens to be the main man in christiananity) as your ONLY way to get into the best place to be after you die (Hell being the ONLY alterative) is pretty much the same thing as any other marketer trying to convince you that you can ONLY lose weight and thus being happy (heck who doesn't want THAT!) ....by doing something incredibly easy like taking this "Miracle" pill that only they offer.

Accepting Jesus is the ONLY way to get into heaven.....  so call now while supplies last!

[Tilt]

Originally posted by Seagoon

The Bible teaches

[Staga]

That Jesse guy sounds bit selfish and arrogant bellybutton dont you think? "It's me or hell; whatcha gonna do?"

I think I choose ancient Norsk gods like Freya and Odin; looks like Folkvang will be open to just anyone and if watermelon really hits the fan I may find myself from Valhalla drinking with old vikings.
Sounds much more interesting way to spend the eternity

[lazs2]

Not if their favorite drinking game is "pass the staga" around.

lazs

[Elfie]

Originally posted by lazs2
Not if their favorite drinking game is "pass the staga" around.

lazs

[Silat]

Originally posted by FiLtH
Spiritual Update:

   And if they could travel to us..why wouldnt they land, and teach us how to better improve our lives. I cant help but think that any species that made it to the point they could space travel light years across space..must have conquered war,greed, aggression. That said..why wouldnt they help us?

 

This one I can answer:)
Greed and Power:)

 With all the modern worlds marvels we have, we dont completely help those with less. And with all our material superiority over much of the world we havent conquered war,greed, aggression ourselves:)

Just because a distant more advanced civilization exists doesnt mean that they have become peaceful and loving.

Now you have made me feel DIRTY:)