Dear Mr. President..

[Hangtime]

Thanks for stopping by today.. you delivered many appreciated words of encouragement, I brought a truckload of socks. We're all doing what we can... but;

I have a request, If I may be so bold to ask.

The carnage demands a response, and I'd like you to consider carefully the measure of that response.. and it's consequences to Americans not only in uniform, but civilians here at home and abroad.

30 years ago we learned the futility of the use of an organized force against a diffuse enemy on his home ground, to the tune of 52,000 funeral dirges. Let us not repeat that disaster. Also, let us not put further at risk the stability of the world or the safety of our civilians.

I offer you another solution.

You have at your disposal weapons of mass destruction... and weapons of mass disorder.

Since Afganistans current regime is apparently unwilling to allow the majority of it's citizens to join the civilized nations of the world, and rather prefers and intends to serve as a rallying cry to other Islamic Fundalmentalist States I suggest you do not invade... but rather simply deny them the fruits of civilization.

You have in your arsenal the ability to disrupt and deny communications beyond that of a signal fire or jungle drum in their nation, and thereby deny communications to the terrorists they train and harbor via use of a Directed EMP Pulse, generated by a sub-orbital nuclear detonation over the city of Kabul.

A low- orbit focused EMP detonation would not directly harm the life of a single Moslem, nor disturb a single sacred artifact yet it would render useless the fruits of technology and civilization that the Afgan government has been only too glad to use against us at their convienience.

I would also suggest that your follow up the use of an EMP Pulse with a total and complete air, land and financial blockade of that or any nation that chooses to not deliver up the terrorists and/or their supporters. By "Blockade" I mean a TOTAL blockade. Nothing in, nothing out. No Trade. No Succor, no medicine, no food.

Declare COVENTRY.

Make it clear that Iran and Iraq are next, should they choose to oppose us, and fail to accede immediately to UN inspection, search and compliance with current directives.

Mr. President.. this time we were lucky. The governments of Iran and Iraq are currently developing Nuclear capability. The next attack may take 500,000 American lives... rather than just 52,000... or 5,200.

Stop them. Play the sane nuclear card... EMP the bastards back to the stone age they so insistently seem to desire.. while you still can.

God Bless America.

SRA, NY 9/14/01

[Maverick]

Hang,

It won't worki. Like ants they will scuttle accross the borders and move from there.

A nuke isn't the answer unless you want to call it end game for the globe. It might not be us that starts the exchange but it will come.

I understand the feeling I want them gone too but that isn't the way. I am afraid we'll have to do it the old fashioned way then depend on our allies to help seal them up economically. These animals like binladin have their money outside the country, we need to find it, freeze it and seal him off from it.

Mav

[Tac]

"focused EMP detonation"

Is such a thing possible?


Blockades dont work. Castro has proved it.

But I like the first idea.

How about cultural assimilation? Invade, occupy and slowly introduce the american way of life to them. Introduce free scholarship programs so that high school and college students can come to the US to study and live. After a decade or so, we'll see if their "cause" still exists. Sound "wrong"? Welp, its better than killing them or making millions life in suffering because their leaders have their dicks up their noses. Also brings a lot of economic benefits, making these nations protectorates of the US and managing them would mean an end to the US mid-east oil dependancy problem.

Operation Bene Gesserit! (brownie points to whoever ID's the name!)

[Hangtime]

Mav, if we don't hit 'em first and hardest, they WILL use nukes on us when they get them. It's not a question of "If".. just "When".

We just got a demonstration of what a suicide attack looks like.. why cannot you concieve of a madman with a finger on a nuclear button.. and the results?

An EMP hit gives us a better chance.. it will most likely make it impossible for them to continue either a development program or deploy tacticly as an organised force without anything more advanced than an AK47.

Strip them of the vestiges of technology.

EMP the bastards.

[Sandman]

Technology? In Afghanistan?

Nope...

[Hangtime]

Yes, Focused EMP is a reality.

Cuba saw one week of "blockade".. and that was just shipping with missiles on board.. What your refering too is an "Embargo".

What I'm proposing is a complete and total blockade, right dowm to the camel trails over the mountains. NOTHIN in. No phones, no electricity, no fuel, no food, no medicine, no NOTHING. From ANYWHERE. Cut 'em, off. Completely.

Any nation that attempts trade with the enemy becomes the enemy. Yah, this means France, too.

NO MORE TRADE WITH ROUGE STATES.

[Hangtime]

Sandman..

Yes, technology in Afganistan. Ours. Bought or stolen from us or others. Cell phones. PC's and the internet. TV. Radio.

And they are using 'em. Against us.

Deny them the vestiges of civilization. If somebody turns on a light, then there is technology. Lets put out the lights.

[Sandman]

France is an ally.

It's a small treaty... maybe you've heard of NATO... you know... that little group that has pledged their support of the United States and has agreed to Article 5 because of this attack.

   

The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all and consequently they agree that, if such an armed attack occurs, each of them, in exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defence recognised by Article 51 of the Charter of the United Nations, will assist the Party or Parties so attacked by taking forthwith, individually and in concert with the other Parties, such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area.

We are in for a long haul and I think we'll need all the friends we can muster, France included.

Oh... and as far as I know, the Taliban is already against all of those things that an EMP would affect.

[ 09-14-2001: Message edited by: Sandman_SBM ]

[capt. apathy]

I’d rather not irradiate a planet I live on.
A focused EMP pulse is a theory to my knowledge it has never been tested. Right now the teams are choosing sides and it looks like the whole world against Afghanistan and maybe Iraq. I think we can take them.  I’d rather see every population center in these countrys leveled with conventional weapons if necessary to ensure they don't fire a nuke (if that’s a serious threat) then to have anyone fire a nuke anywhere.

[Octavius]

Whoa nelly!  I'm not an expert on EMPs.. I know it would disable mostly anything requirign electricity.  But.. it doesn't disable them permanently does it?  Can you just turn it back on like a car engine?  

I dont know abou the "wait for them to fire first" idea.  (detonation on a something like a city, not an atmospheric detonation)  Doesn't that sound a bit extreme Hang?  Even if they *do* have nuclear capability and they *do* use it.. my only guess is that it would lead to much much more terrible outcomes.  Again, I'm no expert.. but I feel that is a path we shouldn't think about going down.  Conventional = safe  

[mrfish]

nawwwww cheese....hang's pissed.

[Hangtime]

Sorry Sand..

France is currently Iran's biggest trading partner. It was THEM that sold 'em the stuff and the techs to build a breeder reactor.

NATO signatories notwithstanding..

NO MORE TRADE WITH ROUGE STATES!!

[Sandman]

Hell.. a high school student in the U.S. damn near built a breeder reactor...
 

http://www.dangerouslaboratories.org/radscout.html

If I recall history correctly, were it not for France, there would be no United States in the first place.

[ 09-14-2001: Message edited by: Sandman_SBM ]

[Hangtime]

Statement of

Dr. George W. Ullrich
Deputy Director
Defense Special Weapons Agency

 

One of our earliest experiences with HEMP dates back to the resumption of atmospheric nuclear testing in 1962 following a three year testing moratorium. Starfish Prime, a 1.4 megaton device, was detonated at an altitude of 400 kilometers over Johnston Island. Failures of electronic systems resulted in Hawaii, 1,300 kilometers away from the detonation. Street lights and fuzes failed on Oahu and telephone service was disrupted on the island of Kauai. Subsequent tests with lower yield devices produced electronic upsets on an instrumentation aircraft that was approximately 300 kilometers away from the detonations.
 

Full text, Congressional record.

 
I can assure you, the component capability, directional focus, and effect area are all well known. They've been toying with it since 1962.

Sand, it matters not a whit that any school kid IN THIS COUNTRY can build a breeder reactor with plans from the internet. What matters is "our friends" like France in the past, would and WILL sell to Rouge states.

Lets deny France that Market, and deny Iran that Internet.

NO MORE TRADE WITH ROUGE STATES!! PUT OUT THAT LIGHT!

[ 09-14-2001: Message edited by: Hangtime ]

[Voss]

This idea will not work, Hang. Afghanistan doesn't have any technology. They don't even allow a deck of cards into the country. Communications, and perhaps a few refrigerators, would stop working, and that's about it.

What you are about to see is pretty straight forward. Either, we move in with Special Forces (in large numbers) and extract bin Laden, or we will open with NATO. NATO will send the government there a message.

AFGHANISTAN! WE WANT OSAMA BIN LADEN.

HOW MUCH DO YOU WANT YOUR COUNTRY?

When, they don't respond like we want, we will invade. Where you make your mistake is in the presumption that the government does not intend to win (as in your pointing out Vietnam). Westmoreland asked Nixon every day: "What day do you want us to win this war?" He never got an answer.

I suspect... well I'm not going to spoil any surprises.

OUT.

[ 09-14-2001: Message edited by: Voss ]