Author Topic: The Arrogance Of A "Scientist"......... (Read 3987 times)

AKSeaWulfe · « **Reply #45 on:** March 29, 2001, 09:06:00 PM »

Heh, Yeager here's something else to think about:

What if whatever created us does not exist in our immediate form of "reality", what if this is where dimensions come into play? What if this place we live in is only a small part of a much bigger place? (by place I mean space as we know how it exists-- infinitalely)

Fact of the matter is, what we know is only limited by what we can see and how far out we can see. We can't even get past our own moon, we have no idea what is further out there.

So in a way, we know about 1% of what is actually out there and on how many levels it exists on. Our reality is limited only to our planet only.

Eh, I'll stop now.. this is starting to sound like a drug induced "what if" discussion.
-SW

StSanta · « **Reply #46 on:** March 30, 2001, 03:39:00 AM »

Ammo, that sort of argument is kinda a circular argument.

And you cannot use the very thing under debate to prove itself

.

I.e I could state in an essay that there are invisible pink unicorns. When you ask for proof, I'll point to the essay

.

Dinger, you're right; it IS crap. It's an attempt to mate science with philosophy and make it sound good. Relevant to the discussion, but not good.

. Glad ya picked up on it, as it illustrates some of the problems.

At any rate, faith vs science. Science has the definite edge based on track record and accomplishments

.

c202 vs 109G10

------------------
Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
"If you return from a mission with a victory, but without your Rottenflieger, you have lost your battle."
- D. Hrabak, JG 54 "Grünherz"

-ammo- · « **Reply #47 on:** March 30, 2001, 04:50:00 AM »

SAnta, yes I can

The word if God stands alone. There is an ongoing argument that has raged for years..but ever moreso in later times as to its validity. The prophesy's and truths within still show today their common sence, the Basic Nature of God as in Natuer and Human Nature, the Definition between wrong and right, etc... It hasnt lasted through the ages for nothing pal. You yourself claim to follow a character from the Bible, the loser in the end time, but he is in his season today, you seem to revel in it

But as you know all to well I believe his time is limited, where as the King I follow is eternal and already has the Victory.

SW, saNTa and the rest have their own way of doing things and the their own way at looking at the grand scheme. Its your own free will to do as you please in this manner. Go with it, as I will mine my way. I will continue to gather my strength from God Himself, and reap hios blessings. I am sure you will draw on whatever it is that keeps you going (self?).

In any case..<S>

Cyou in my gunsight

ammo

leonid · « **Reply #48 on:** March 30, 2001, 06:04:00 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Eagler:
Science will explain religion as religion will explain science, one day, when we are ready.

I really like this quote. Good one, Eagler

Eagler · « **Reply #49 on:** March 30, 2001, 08:08:00 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by AKSeaWulfe:
He has a good point right here....
-SW

Heaven isn't a place. It's a consciousness we are all striving for. Your actions here determines where you start next. It's called Karma and Reincarnation. The big boomerang of life. Don't think you every get away with anything, the boomerang just hasn't made it back yet to hit you in the back of your head when you are not looking and least expect it.

born and raised Catholic, just not buying the one shot deal. too many loop holes in it, like the one stated above. The confession helps, but you still have to pay for the bad karma you have created.... and it won't be pretty. We learn some of our best lessons from suffering...

Eagler

(steps down from soapbox)

Udie · « **Reply #50 on:** March 30, 2001, 05:10:00 PM »

Anybody ever think that maybe they are one in the same, only we're to stupid/ignorant to figure it out? Nobody will ever convence me that the dna molocule just worked it's way together through random occurances. Name one thing in nature that starts in a chaotic state and on it's own with 0 intellegence and only through random occurances gets into an organized state.

IMNSHO

God created science and used it to create us.

Udie

funked · « **Reply #51 on:** March 30, 2001, 05:30:00 PM »

Quote

Name one thing in nature that starts in a chaotic state and on it's own with 0 intellegence and only through random occurances gets into an organized state.

Actually there are too many such systems to name. There is a whole branch of science devoted to such systems which are all around us (self-organizing systems).

[This message has been edited by funked (edited 03-30-2001).]

Udie · « **Reply #52 on:** March 30, 2001, 06:18:00 PM »

name some

and tell me some books i can go get to read up on it. Seriously

I'm realy starting to get into science. I go to www.broadcast.com/audiobooks it's a good site, they have a science section with 3 good books to listen to. Reletivity, Characteristics of Physical law and Chance and Chaos. I've listened to them about 5 or 6 times each, very cool stuff to think about.

StSanta · « **Reply #53 on:** March 31, 2001, 03:37:00 AM »

Udie: I'll name two

Sand dunes. they are ordered so the more dense particles are below the lighter ones

.

Pebbles on a beach. Same principle

These two don't even include any form of intelligence.

The Blind Watchmaker by Richard Dawkins is a good popular easy to read book and has a chapter on it IIRC.

------------------
Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
"If you return from a mission with a victory, but without your Rottenflieger, you have lost your battle."
- D. Hrabak, JG 54 "Grünherz"

Udie · « **Reply #54 on:** March 31, 2001, 06:24:00 AM »

Santa,

I Don't know if those 2 apply. That I think is more a function of gravity and wind. Give me another please

Ydue

Dowding · « **Reply #55 on:** March 31, 2001, 06:38:00 AM »

The next question after you agree that there is a superior intelligence at work here, is which religion do you follow?

Why should you be Christians and not any of the myriad religions out there?

That is why I am agnostic, with a dislike of organised religion.

StSanta · « **Reply #56 on:** March 31, 2001, 06:55:00 AM »

Udie, well, they met the requirements in your question.

And you KNOW I am gonna be a smartass if given an opportunity

------------------
Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
"If you return from a mission with a victory, but without your Rottenflieger, you have lost your battle."
- D. Hrabak, JG 54 "Grünherz"

-ammo- · « **Reply #57 on:** March 31, 2001, 07:33:00 AM »

I got one for the scientist..
Explain the hummingbird. Its heart and lungs have many times the surface area within to accomodate its wings motion...which is anywhere from 50-200 times a second. The heart and lungs are capable of suppliing the blood and subsequent energy. The bones of the hummingbird are nothing like that of any other bird, or living organism. They are super light and the design is like no other. There IS NO way that this organism evolved or adapted from anything. It is just a picture of God's inifinate wisdom.

Cabby · « **Reply #58 on:** March 31, 2001, 01:23:00 PM »

Ammo, you are dead wrong. Hummingbirds used to be dinosaurs until they decided to become something else.

Lord knows what the little buggers will decide to be next....

Cabby

funked · « **Reply #59 on:** March 31, 2001, 01:54:00 PM »

Udie, the most common examples are in chemical reactions or flow of fluids, where if you mix things up they can form complicated structures that look "man-made", all by themselves. If you study fluid dynamics or chemistry you see this stuff a lot.

In the last 30 years or so, people have started to study the underlying mathematics and tie this kind of stuff in with complexity theory, and computer science topics like genetic algorithms or neural networks or adaptive control. And guess what... it works. You can predict a lot of observed behaviors and design useful things using these theories.

If you believe that the laws of physics extend to living things, then it's pretty clear that these mechanisms could explain how life formed and developed. Of course it is not proven, but it is not disproven either.

Personally, I think creating a simple set of rules which results in an incredibly vast and constantly adapting array of life forms is a much more elegant and awe-inspiring feat than designing each one individually. I don't think the Bible rules out the former possibility. Creationists might not be giving God enough credit.

[This message has been edited by funked (edited 03-31-2001).]