A discussion on troop porking

[Morpheus]

OMFG It is a TROLL. Yu R trolling your SElf

OMG YOU R TEH CRAZY!!!!11oneone!!1

[ROC]

Attacking the way the question is posted, and nitpicking about the way it is written just seems to prove to me a lack of defensible arguments in favor of it and an effort to draw attention away from the real debate.

I don't see anyone attacking anything.  I see lack of interest at this point.  Might change, might not.

It's not encumbant on anyone to prove by their argument that you are wrong.  You created the debate, and clearly haven't proven you are right.  Lack of the response you were looking for does not, in any way, shape or form "prove" a lack of defensible arguments in favor of the current system.

It might simply be that not many think this is an issue.  It's not a fantastic idea to start a "debate" then get irratated if it doesn't go your way.  Perhaps nitpicking about the way it is written is the only logical way to address an issue that in itself appears to be nitpicking.  Maybe, but it seems that conversations tend to flow exactly down the channel they create.

I did notice, however, that in your fervor to point out the inequity in our replies you clearly avoided, what I felt was the strongest defense of the subject, which is frankly to simply up defenders and stop the attackers.  That seemed reasonable, well thought out, and quite easily done.  Should I cry foul or simply take stock in the impression that you didn't want to address so simple a solution, chosing to perpetuate an argument instead?

[Morpheus]

lack of defensible arguments

I gave you the best argument so far.

Aces High=Game
D-Day=Rea Life

The fact that you are using real life to argue this game is the very reason you will never win with this argument.

You're trying to argue to change the design of the game. In that design not call for tens of thousands of players to produce D-Day type senerios. That was a foolish comparison, no offence.

The very reason the barracks are as easy as they are to destroy is simply because we do-not-have thousands of players to use in mounting an all out assult on a set of barracks.

[crowMAW]

The best argument for the current system is as a hoard defense.  When 25-30 ponies and JugNs come in at 20k+ to a lightly defended base and take down the VH and all FHs, there is not much other way to slow the hoard down other than goon hunters and troop porkers.

If you want to make it more challenging for the hoard, then harden the hangers so that only bombers can take them out.  Plus increase both type of AA accuracy and make the AA guns harder to destroy.  That keeps vulchers away while allowing the attacked base to mount a viable defense.

[Jackal1]

  And it`s a winner.
The Worse Troll Evaaaar award goes to this thread.

[Morpheus]

[Booz]

Troop & Ammo porking is done by the strat/base capture guys to the other teams strat/base capture guys.

   Furballers dont care, don't bother over it and don't desire to defend it. They got their way when they whined & won about gas porking. (but of course now they whine about hangars dying a WHOLE 15 minutes).

   It's YOUR job to stop the porkers Mr.Strategy...don't whine about being beat at your own game please, be smarter, pork first, supply faster, win the war.

   You know why rooks face 2v1 gangbang so often?? Cause knits & bish done porked their entire front lines vs each other and only have eggs & troops on the rook front.

   Know why rooks always have the best k/d? They catch & shoot down heavy porkers more than the other 2 teams.

[Morpheus]

How about when you die you never get to play again?

How's that for comparing this crap to D-Day???

OMFG I R TEH SMART ONE!!!!oneoneone!!11

[FiLtH]

Id prefer that the troops require 3k damage.  With 80% of the players on the deck, I rarely if ever have a problem killing the troops. I dont think anyone plays the game with defense in mind. Loitering over a base just isnt fun.

[DREDIOCK]

You generally couldnt capture an entire airfeild and town with only a small handful of ground troops either.
 Imagine what would have happened on DDay if all they landed was less then 20 troops.

Leave it as it is.

There are times when its the only way to stop an advancing horde. To change that would only give horde tactics an even greater advantage then they already have.

Plus, porking troops encourages Furballs ( a point Im sure the furballs like)

and you CAN defend your feild. The mistake everyone makes is in defending the feild AT the feild.
The idea is to stop em before they get there not once they have arrived.
fly toward their airfeild. The closer to their arifeld you get the lower they will be. Then you wont have to worry  about stopping a plane diving in from 20K.
Hang out at 8-10K a half a sector away from their base and you should be able to stop alot of planes from comming to pork your feild.

And taking troops out at anything but a small feild isnt always as easy as it looks.
feild ack often gets you more often then enemy planes and almost as often before you can finish porking troops.

I know. I do it

[Rino]

Originally posted by ROC
I'll bite, dinners late and even bait looks good at this point.

You mean it is honestly that difficult to mount a defense against that one single porking fighter that is taking out the Troops?  At the moment, in "real life" a single insurgent can sneak into an encampment in Iraq, lob a single grenade and wreak havoc.  I can only imagine what a cannon loaded 109 would do to that real life situation.  

The game is defendable.  The troops can be defended.  You want it harder so you don't have to waste your furballing time defending?  

My "score" sucks.  I spend alot of time taking troops to bases, and Supplies to bases, and Supplies to vehicles out in the fight, and Chasing down city and factory porking dweebs.  This is a well rounded, multi faceted game that requires not just an artificially hard defense so everyone can participate in the funner aspect of an offensive position.  Sometimes you gotta be the grunt and be in the background supporting the effort.

Good point, though, that you "think" it's gamey.  Don't take this as a personal insult, I think the alternative is "gamey" and would cheapen the game to "Quake" level.

In My Humble Opinion, Your Milage May Vary, Opinions are like...well..you know.

     I think you are completely offbase as to the nature of the whine.  This is
OBVIOUSLY a strat weenie whine, not a furballer one.  What does a
furballer care if the troops are down or not?

[Tilt]

I also think it inappropriate the way the game models the ability of a single ac to wipe out all infantry at a base or field.

Troops based at airfields could be considered smaller para regiments and so could be much as we have now.

Infantry based at vehicle fields should be virtual garrisons and have tented (defended) areas as large as the towns we have now.


Always seemed more logical to me that garrisons (not towns) should be depleted before capture was possible..ie you have to destroy the enemy infantry forces before yours can capture........

Supply should be a hanger function not a barrack function IMO.

[101ABN]

Originally posted by crowMAW
Didn't it used to be two goons to capture a base a loooong time ago?  Back before base towns...back when maprooms were on the base.

As I recall, it was dropped to 1 goon cuz it was too damn hard to coordinate 2 goons getting in and dropping with in the time limit between drops.

Troop porking seems to be the only way to slow an advancing hoard.  ENY is effective when one country has 200+ players and everyone else has half that number...that was the situation a couple years back with the Rooks and within the last few months with the Knits.  It is not effective against hord attacks going for lightly defended milkrun bases...I watched a Bish attack the other day.  More than 50 attackers simultaneously hit 2 lightly defended bases (one airbase and the other a v-base).  I saw three 262s many many Ponies and JugNs...ENY was not working against this hord.

Porking would have slowed the hoard...but not stopped it since I've noticed that Bish have been bringing 4-5 goons on attacks like that and hot loading them if necessary.

However troop porking was effective Wednesday night against a similar Bish hoard attacking a22.  A couple of Knits were able to sneak out of the vulched base and kill all the hiding goons (I counted 5 and one at 15k+).  In the mean time, another Knit had wacked the troops at the near bases.  It held off the hord for hours.

ha ha ha... we had a horde of rooks last weekend trying to take a base and myself with 3 others defended the base until they gave up.... it isnt impossibel to defeat the horde... i like to call it a target rich enviroment.. ha ha... a

as for getting 2 goons on target.. i agree with morph.. its really hard to get someone to bite the bullet and up a goon, now you want 2? wow, it will be like asking them to give up their left nut....

[Patches1]

Be care for what you wish....as it may come true...as in the past ability to limit (pork) fuels at enemy airfields (which, by the way, limited the range of certain aricraft such as the LA-7, making them less of a threat overall and we didn't need an ENY limiter). The obvious result of this past wish is the importance now of denying enemies the ability to bomb your resources (take out  the ordnance), and their ability to capture your fields (take out the troop barracks).

Another consideration is the time zone in which you play the game. For some who log on during prime time USA, they may see "hoardes" of folks online....say upwards of 300, or so. For others, who play at other times... for example, very early morning Pacific Times Zones... one may log on to find a total of 60 folks online between all three countries. For these folks, a "hoarde" may be 5, or 6 folks, and of the 20 or so players online in your country, some may be furballing, some may be GV'ing, some my be in Bomber mode, and others in PT's or attack mode.

Increasing the difficulty in capturing fields by requiring more C-47s, or increasing the amount of ordnance required to drop various targets may make game play more challenging for an MA of 300, or more, players, but, may also make gameplay less enjoyable for those who play when the numbers of players online is quite less. It's not easy to acheive a balance of gameplay enjoyability and gameplay difficulty...just my opinion...

[BlkKnit]

Look, how about you just....

Defend your fields!


oh, yeah...and maybe add a few barracks to each one