Who is lying about Iraq?

[mrshiver]

The knowledge that someone such as Saddam was in  the process of aquiring, developing, or even just thinking of  WMD's, is in my opinion more than enough justification to go to war.

One of the tenets of "The Art of War," is to take the fight to the enemy.

GW did just that.

A majority of the terrorist who would like to do us harm are lining up in Iraq to be sent to meet their maker.

And before anyone makes the comment that the war in no way affects me personally, I have several relatives currently in country, on the front lines.

[Raider179]

Originally posted by mrshiver
The knowledge that someone such as Saddam was in  the process of aquiring, developing, or even just thinking of  WMD's, is in my opinion more than enough justification to go to war.

 

Really? hope you are ready for the draft, cause there are lots of countries out there doing the exact same thing. Iran, North Korea for easy examples, So you saying we are going there next?

[Maverick]

Uh exactly what would have been the "correct" thing to do then Raider? Cough up something constructive.

[Raider179]

Originally posted by Maverick
Uh exactly what would have been the "correct" thing to do then Raider? Cough up something constructive.

Correct regarding what situation Mav? Iraq? Iran? Syria? North Korea? Indonesia? Phillipenes? Afghanistan? Bin laden? Omar? Jordan?

Be specific and I will answer specifically. Overall, not sure but what we are doing is not working. Torturing people in foriegn countries so they bypass OUR laws is not American.  I know war is horrible and people die but this was bad planning.

[Raider179]

Why did Colin Powell resign?

That is a man of integrity and honor. I know why he did. He hurt because he lied to the UN. Check statements by his Chief of staff.  You die hard republicans are no better than the far right. It's obvious what took place. Read Bob Woodwards book and tell me Iraq wasnt a target after 9/11...

[Gunslinger]

Raider on your first point do you have ANY shred of proof of this besides an un-confirmed times article.

On your second Colin Powel said from the begining he only wanted to serve on term.

[Raider179]

Originally posted by Gunslinger
Raider on your first point do you have ANY shred of proof of this besides an un-confirmed times article.

On your second Colin Powel said from the begining he only wanted to serve on term.

I have no idea what you are asking for the 1st one.


Powell has tip-toed around since leaving. You ask your self why. I know , but then again I read what his chief of staff has said. Perhaps you should. Has a lot to do with crappy intelligence. Jeez bro, they took intelligence from a guy named "CURVEBALL". what does it take to realize they were only going after stuff that made their case? Where is the intel that they got wrong? Oh that rights its everywhere.

[Gunslinger]

Originally posted by Raider179
I have no idea what you are asking for the 1st one.


Powell has tip-toed around since leaving. You ask your self why. I know , but then again I read what his chief of staff has said. Perhaps you should. Has a lot to do with crappy intelligence. Jeez bro, they took intelligence from a guy named "CURVEBALL". what does it take to realize they were only going after stuff that made their case? Where is the intel that they got wrong? Oh that rights its everywhere.

my first point is your reference to torturing at secret bases.  I want to know how many aledged terrorists we've tortured, where they are, and when they've been there.

On Powell I will agree with you that the state dept. intell service was one of the few that got it right from the begining.  BUT, that really doesnt mean squat when EVERYONE else on point is saying they are wrong and have been saying it for a long time.  My point about this thread is the history revisionists that have been slowly getting louder over the years re-writing history and they "bush lied" crowd.  Don't think that this opinion piece is about Bush's recent speech when he took a jab at the "bush lied" crowed.  It was in fact written before it and probably caused Bush's reaction.....about time if you ask me.  Either way re-read the peice I posted, it's pretty hard to dispute.

[Raider179]

Originally posted by Gunslinger
my first point is your reference to torturing at secret bases.  I want to know how many aledged terrorists we've tortured, where they are, and when they've been there.

On Powell I will agree with you that the state dept. intell service was one of the few that got it right from the begining.  BUT, that really doesnt mean squat when EVERYONE else on point is saying they are wrong and have been saying it for a long time.  My point about this thread is the history revisionists that have been slowly getting louder over the years re-writing history and they "bush lied" crowd.  Don't think that this opinion piece is about Bush's recent speech when he took a jab at the "bush lied" crowed.  It was in fact written before it and probably caused Bush's reaction.....about time if you ask me.  Either way re-read the peice I posted, it's pretty hard to dispute.

ok first one is easy. Egypt admits 70 prisoners have been moved there by the U.S. Why are they in Egypt if not to avoid our laws? Same goes for a dozen other countries.


your right, 1 dissenting opinion shouldnt void information, however it was not just 1 opinion. There is a lot of information that points in the oppostite of everything the administration was saying. Especially Dick Cheney. I could point out hours of quotes of "slam dunks" and Iraq-al-qaidai connections that were given, when in fact this intelligence was questionable at its best.

I dont think bush lied. I think he had it in for Iraq and that swayed how he gathered information. Plain and simple, he wanted the war and they made it happen.

[Gunslinger]

Originally posted by Raider179
ok first one is easy. Egypt admits 70 prisoners have been moved there by the U.S. Why are they in Egypt if not to avoid our laws? Same goes for a dozen other countries.


your right, 1 dissenting opinion shouldnt void information, however it was not just 1 opinion. There is a lot of information that points in the oppostite of everything the administration was saying. Especially Dick Cheney. I could point out hours of quotes of "slam dunks" and Iraq-al-qaidai connections that were given, when in fact this intelligence was questionable at its best.

I dont think bush lied. I think he had it in for Iraq and that swayed how he gathered information. Plain and simple, he wanted the war and they made it happen.

It was questionable at best after the fact.  The problem here is information itself even after the fact isn't reliable.  A reporting agency could have reported those 70 prisoners going to Egypt to be tortured when they could have left of the handy little tidbit that they were all egyption citizens or they were wanted there in connection with other crimes.  The fact that the "secret prisons" article was leaked is criminal at  best.

There are many people out there trying to rewrite history when the truth is history writes itself (or is sometimes written by the winner).

and since I didn't get a chance to respond to O'riely's comments in the other thread before the lock here's my chance.

I agree with what he said.  SF mayer (iirc) basically said the measure probably wont hold up in court but it's the message they want to send that matters.

SO here's what I gather, SF doesn't care about the constitution or the federal govt. that's established by it.  BO's comments are spot on.  This would be no worse than if a small town in Alabama legalized slavery of black people again.  Or a town in Utah saying that the city govt will now be based off of Morman religion.  It doesn't seem at all extreme the comments he made.

[Raider179]

Originally posted by Gunslinger
It was questionable at best after the fact.  The problem here is information itself even after the fact isn't reliable.  A reporting agency could have reported those 70 prisoners going to Egypt to be tortured when they could have left of the handy little tidbit that they were all egyption citizens or they were wanted there in connection with other crimes.  The fact that the "secret prisons" article was leaked is criminal at  best.

There are many people out there trying to rewrite history when the truth is history writes itself (or is sometimes written by the winner).

All I see are exuses. We screwed the pooch on iraq, Time to step up or sit down..

[Gunslinger]

Originally posted by Raider179
All I see are exuses. We screwed the pooch on iraq, Time to step up or sit down..

you speak in past tenses......you realize there are troops still their still fighting right?

[Raider179]

Originally posted by Gunslinger
you speak in past tenses......you realize there are troops still their still fighting right?

Oh ok lets just forget all responsibility. This is just the start of whats coming.

And yes I speak in past tenses, He who forgets the past is condemned to repeat it....

guns you know whats gonna happen, why wont you say it.