Author Topic: What to do with American Taliban John Walker? (Read 4949 times)

SirLoin · « **Reply #45 on:** December 22, 2001, 07:33:00 AM »

Until gays have the same rights as everyone else Grun(eg,right to marriage,same sex benifits,adoption etc..)they are not "fair game" as you suggest.They are the" discriminated against"

ET · « **Reply #46 on:** December 22, 2001, 07:52:00 AM »

Tah Gut
Wasn't meaning to nitpick your words.I'm just tired of hearing liberals on TV refering to him as misquided youth,not really old enough to make decisions,just a kid, etc etc etc.They are already building a case for leniency.
ET

-tronski- · « **Reply #47 on:** December 22, 2001, 08:19:00 AM »

You have a problem with gays on a political level??
riiight...because Gays have it so good as SirLoin already posted

Quote

my comment is directed at the permissive and culturally relativstic parents that just say every culure is OK and there is no such thing as bad chioces and lifestyles. Its directed at that and you all know even and especially if you dont want to admit it that many SF Bay Area gays are among the leading members of that line of thought.

sigh, I bet you don't have a clue do you...

You're right, parents should teach descrimination and repression at a young age. We wouldn't want any free thinkers or people making their own choices out there..stinkin up the place.

Be careful Herr Grunherz when doing your washing. Make sure you seperate the whites fom the coloured, you wouldn't want to be the only one to march in a pink hood.

Tronsky

Udie · « **Reply #48 on:** December 22, 2001, 08:34:00 AM »

studmuffins are bad.

hey I'm talking about British cigarettes!

Wotan · « **Reply #49 on:** December 22, 2001, 09:39:00 AM »

the guy was over there priorto any actions committed against the US.

He didn't help plan any of it. How do you know if he even fired a shot at an american or an ally of america.

So you don't like him so fediddlein what. Treason?
Sedition?
roadkill......

He needs to be debriefed and interogated but until theres any evidence that he actually did anything illegal y'all are just spewing propaganda.

The same type that led to waco and ruby ridge.

"this guy doesn't like America"
"This guy aint like us"

ah fek it kill the bastard.

Wtf country are we living in?

What should we do with him?

Nothing until theres some evidence that he did something wrong.

There was a sedition trial against neo-nazis in the mid 80's in which none were found guilty of that charge. They actually declared war on america in a signed document and sent it to congress renouncing there citizenship. They actually killed people and robbed amored cars and banks. Shot at and wounded federal agents. The printed counterfiet money by the millions. Again sedition was not provable. They are doing time for the real crimes they did but not for thought crime.

"Nuke the ragheads" and "kill anyone who dont like it "

gimme a break....

[ 12-22-2001: Message edited by: Wotan ]

Kieran · « **Reply #50 on:** December 22, 2001, 10:10:00 AM »

I suppose they kept him in the dark about 9/11? I suppose he didn't know about the U.S.S. Cole when he went? I suppose he didn't know about the first WTC blast?

The agenda of both terrorist organization is crystal clear. He joined. He had an assault rifle in hand. As far as I know, the preferred weapon for stalking squirrel isn't a high-powered assault rifle.

One or both of the organizations with which he is affiliated appear to be responsible for terrorism world wide. And don't wag your finger in my face about what America does, that isn't the real issue. The real issue is he is on our side or isn't. Right or wrong he is with America or he is against us. Let's forget the morals lesson too, okay? You see, if his conscience told him it was time to fight the great devil, great. He did. Trouble is, the great devil now owns his ass, and should make an example of him for the next conscience-stricken youth that decides to support an organization that launches terror attacks against our home country.

[ 12-22-2001: Message edited by: Kieran ]

Udie · « **Reply #51 on:** December 22, 2001, 10:12:00 AM »

Article III section 3, US constitution.
Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.

The Congress shall have Power to declare the Punishment of Treason, but no Attainder of Treason shall work Corruption of Blood, or Forfeiture exept during the Life of the Person attainted.

Wotan I don't think it matters if he help plan the 9-11 attacks or if he fired a shot at an american soldier. He, at a minimum, helped and aided our enemy in a time of war and fully admits to it. That's treason any way you look at it. Here's some of the facts as known to date, not propoganda as you put it. His group was an Al Queda unit fighting for the Taliban, they were knows as "the helpers" these are his own words. His group of freedom fighters surrendered to the Northern Alliance and went to Konduz to turn over there weapons, yeah right. He's interogated by 2 CIA agents, on video, and was not cooperative, which as an American captured with the enemy by an ally, he should have been majorly cooperative and told them about the terrorist that had hidden grenades by his own admission he saw them do it. That led directly to the death of a CIA agent.

Fact is he F'ed up in a huge way, and now he's got to face the consequinces. I feel pretty weird about this. On one hand I'm pissed as hell at him and want him off the planet, but on the other hand I just feel sorry for the guy for making a stupid choice at a young impressionable age. Unfortunately for him, the choice he made was such a big one that as a society we can't just turn our heads at this one.

It's kind of like in the Band of Brothers 2nd episode when the GI is talking to the German POW who was American and from the same town as him. The the Lt. comes and shoots the prisoners. Walker is lucky to be alive right now and lucky to be an American. Otherwise he'd most likely be in an unmarked grave by now, or roughting in the middle of some desert.

Kieran · « **Reply #52 on:** December 22, 2001, 10:17:00 AM »

Wotan, I must say I can't believe you advocate doing NOTHING to this "man". That is taking tolerance to an absolute extreme. Are you next going to argue we have no grounds to confiscate the weapon? After all, he is an American, and it IS his right to bear arms...

Sorry, but useless extrapolation over what is a crystal-clear case of treason just gets my goat. What's it going to take for you to see the light? Do we need to have Johnny drop a dirty bomb by his mom and dad's house to prove it to you?

They caught him. DO something with him before he has the chance to do far WORSE harm.

midnight Target · « **Reply #53 on:** December 22, 2001, 11:42:00 AM »

Quote

A guy I knew from Junior High decided to "come out" in the school newspaper, writing a delightful little article about his "Starry night in the Castro" (Castro District of SF, a sort of Gay Mecca)where he described a night out of dancing with his boyfriend and all that. No problem with that its his business and his life experience to enjoy and express. But soon he gets some gay hero scolarship from the State and gets pretty much accepted to any University he wants. Yea the gays arent any diffiernt and shouldnt be treated any different, riiiiight.

Sooooo....if he had described his night as a born again christian, and how he had come to love Jesus....and a Christian Hero Scholarship were presented......you would be pissed that "Christians" wanted to be treated differently?

Toad · « **Reply #54 on:** December 22, 2001, 11:45:00 AM »

It's clear that the government will charge him.

He'll get his day in court; that's the way this place is supposed to work.

Give it a rest.

Wotan · « **Reply #55 on:** December 22, 2001, 12:05:00 PM »

This guy was fighting indians in kashmir as part of a taliban/pakistani/islamic "mercenary group".

He may have trained in an el quaeda camp but these same camps were sponsored by the taliban and the pakistani military.

The northern alliance blame pakistan for aiding and supporting the taliban.

We are doing nothing to pakistan.

This guy was sent to afganistan to fight the Nothern Alliance.

The US started bombing the taliban. This guy (as fediddleed up as his is) happened to be there.

Now you can argue that once it started he should have walked away. But if you think they would just let well I doudt it.

As fer the cole all that was reported was that he said he agreed with the fact that the US military presence there is unwanted by some extremist and the us got what it deserved. That hardly translates to treason. He may well have agreed with the wtc/pentagon attacks but that dont translate to treason.

I saw a news report of a small group of muslims celebrating in Detroit over those attacks.

If they prosecute this guy for a crime and he is found guilty thats one thing.

But because he dislikes america or that he agreed with the talibans idea of a islamic state is not prosecutable as treason or sedition.

Now he may well be charged with conspiracy in regards to the cia guy that was killed but thats a "real crime".

Or if he fired on American troops maybe.

The hippy toejam bag aint worth a fek to me personally. I could careless about him. But however we have laws in this country that should be non biased in terms of belief.

Until they charge him with a crime as much as he is hated there is no way to come up with a proper judgement. Being talibany is not a crime.

So the answer what should we do with that freak.

Nothing until theres some tangible evidence that a crime was committed. What you feel he should be charged with is irrelevant.

And udie where did this guy say he declared war on the US?

and its not a crime not to report grenades being hid. If they prove he hid them and/or used them then he may be prosecutable. or that he had prior knowledge that they would be used to kill anyone he may be prosecutable.

All you all are doing is putting your personal idea into something and using that as grounds fer treason.

The accuser bares the burden of proof.

And when they dont prosecute this guy for treason/sedition and all these other made up crimes of yours you'll be back here telling us how fediddleed up the government is for not agreeing with you.

GRUNHERZ · « **Reply #56 on:** December 22, 2001, 02:21:00 PM »

But If I described a night out with my girlfriend would I get a scolarship?

Guess not huh?

GRUNHERZ · « **Reply #57 on:** December 22, 2001, 02:26:00 PM »

Thx for for proving my point Sir Loin, gays must be treateted with kid gloves because they are the only people with problems in the world, well the other "specials" are too.

pathetic...

Kieran · « **Reply #58 on:** December 22, 2001, 03:50:00 PM »

No, I won't.

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As fer the cole all that was reported was that he said he agreed with the fact that the US military presence there is unwanted by some extremist and the us got what it deserved. That hardly translates to treason. He may well have agreed with the wtc/pentagon attacks but that dont translate to treason.

You're right, that doesn't. The fact he stayed in their service afterwards does. It's not "my agenda" I am espousing here. I have not pointed a finger at anyone other than one person- the traitor. I don't care if he is Osama bin Laden's squeak, that doesn't matter.

You want an agenda? Here's one; I am sick of crime being commited in broad daylight, the perpetrators caught, and then skipping free because of some legalistic interpretation of their acts.

midnight Target · « **Reply #59 on:** December 22, 2001, 04:08:00 PM »

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But If I described a night out with my girlfriend would I get a scolarship?

Guess not huh?

I read this reply and thought to myself....which is more important, replying to an obvious and poorly camouflaged bias, or using what may be the best straight line I've read in this BBS for a good long time.

1. Depends on the date.
2. Your right...I've seen your girlfriend
3. No just boyfriend essays get the dough...she needs to write about you.
4. Did you go to the Castro? Maybe its a community based award.
5. If she works at the Condor Club...you may get something.

No time to add more....but I'm sure there is plenty I haven't thought of Thank You GH.