has anyone flown the 190A5 lately?

[1K3]

190A-5 is delightful to fly but i must admit...  it doesnt feel right.  190A-5 is suppose to be a dog in r/l compare to 190A-4, A-6, and A-8.  From now on when i fly 190A-5 i must imagine that im flying an Fw-190A-3... lol

[Grits]

Originally posted by Crumpp
I don't know what it is or the cause.  The behavior of the aircraft in the game is not the same as it was when AH2 was first released and it is not mine or the others who fly the FW190's imagination.

Just to satisfy myself, I have an archived copy of beta 1.97 or somewhere thereabouts before AH2 went live. I will confirm what version it is, fly around some, do some tests, and see what I can find.

[hubsonfire]

I flew the A5 last night, and I think it's exactly the same plane I quit flying a while back. It's good, but thoroughly outclassed by all the other allied planes.

Uberplane of the era, it is not. Lucky you might be. Lucky I was not.
Perhaps, as I've hoped, the overall aptitude has dropped. Lawd haf mercy.

[Krusty]

Well I have an old install file for AH1 as well... I think it is 1043 or something. If you'd been flying 190s right when AH2 came out you'd not question whether things were different. They are. AH2 changed them a lot. There was no change with the new graphics for 190s, but there WAS for 109s. Specifically roll rate. If you have a second machine install 2.0 patch 2 or 3 or something and note the 109E roll rate. Then try AH1 roll rate. Then try 2.06 roll rate. The roll rate jumped noticably when 2.0 came out, and dropped again the instant 2.06 came out. This for 109E and K4, not so much the others.

EDIT:

I'd like to clarify something. I'm not a "LW Conspiracy nut". I don't think the LW planes are being intentionally hindered blah blah blah. Good or bad, whatever, for whatever intentions, there *have* been certain key changes. The increased turn capabilities of the Fw190 was a change that came about with 2.0. That's all I've advocated in this issue. Not that HTC is out to get us.. whooo...

Whether HTC intended it, there have been certain changes. None recently to the 190s, but there have been them.

[Grits]

Originally posted by Krusty
Well I have an old install file for AH1 as well... I think it is 1043 or something. If you'd been flying 190s right when AH2 came out you'd not question whether things were different. They are. AH2 changed them a lot.

[/b]

I WAS flying 109's and 190's when we switched to AH2, ask Crumpp and Storch, since I always fly on the side with the least numbers in the CT, I flew LW 80% of the time back then as the Axis were usually heavily outnumbered. I never said AH2 did not change the planes, you are putting words in my mouth, what I have said is that since AH2 no patches have made changes to any flight models that were not noted in the ReadMe for that patch.

There was no change with the new graphics for 190s, but there WAS for 109s. Specifically roll rate. If you have a second machine install 2.0 patch 2 or 3 or something and note the 109E roll rate. Then try AH1 roll rate. Then try 2.06 roll rate. The roll rate jumped noticably when 2.0 came out, and dropped again the instant 2.06 came out. This for 109E and K4, not so much the others.

[/b]

I just tested the 109E, 109F, 109G-10/K-4, F4U-1 and Tiffie in these versions of AH:

AH1.14, 2.0, 2.02, 2.03, 2.04 and 2.06.

Krusty is correct, there was on average nearly a full second reduction in time to roll 360 deg for the 109's that the F4U and Tiffie did not get with the change from AH1 to AH2 (something I have never disputed). In every 2.0x version I tested however, EVERY version of EVERY plane is IDENTICAL in roll rate. I repeat, there is no difference (past the margin of error for a human's thumb working a stopwatch) in any version of 109 in any patch of AH2 up to the current version. You can claim they are different all you want, but I just tested five patch levels of the game and they are all the same.

I'd like to clarify something. I'm not a "LW Conspiracy nut". I don't think the LW planes are being intentionally hindered blah blah blah. Good or bad, whatever, for whatever intentions, there *have* been certain key changes. The increased turn capabilities of the Fw190 was a change that came about with 2.0. That's all I've advocated in this issue. Not that HTC is out to get us.. whooo...

Whether HTC intended it, there have been certain changes. None recently to the 190s, but there have been them.

As I have said, I dont want this to sound like I am calling you guys liars, I am not. I truely believe you feel something is different. I think you are flat wrong, I think it is your imagination, I know my testing bears that out to my satisfaction, but I dont think you are just making it up.

Who knows, maybe down the road HT will find something wrong and say "hey, this has been porked off and on" but I seriously doubt it.

[Krusty]

I shall then let the matter rest indefinitely. Sorry if I seemed combatitive earlier, Grits.

[Grits]

I dont mind a good debate Krusty, you were not combative at all. The intardnet is hard to get things to come across in type the way you meant them too. In my case when I am really only trying to make myself and my point clear, I come across as a little more harsh than I really intended.

Just out of curiosity you should do what I do and try to save old versions to do testing between them, I enjoy doing it. Keeps trying things, maybe you will stumble onto something, you never know.

[Wilbus]

I was flying 109's and 190's when AH2 came out.

NO planes had remodelled flight modells but what changed was the entire way AH modells the FM.

HTC added more points to be calculated (if I remember correct) which changed several characteristics of most planes, most noticably close to stall.

The 109 E did infact roll much faster (finally, it could hardly roll over on its back before). The 190's just felt overall better.

This has been a recent development in the last two patches. First the FW-190 FM became extremely erratic, then on the Italy map, it became very stable.

Crumpp, the FM exists in your version of the game on your hard drive, it does not exist in an arena nor on any particulair map, it can not be changed by arena settings.

The only way to change the FM is if HTC does so and releases a new version or... if you somehow successfully hack the game. The only thing that can be changed is the AoA for the stall limiter when it comes to flight modell.

Other then that there are ofcourse lots of things that can be changed for each arena but not FM wise.

I flew the 190 A5 last night, wanting to get back into my old ride, I also flew it in the CT. There is no difference.

[storch]

boy have I improved overnight then.  I was K/D 12:0 while I was flying alone in a Dora.  I suffered a few deaths last night doing base defense and coming to aid of squaddie who squawked for help claiming to be at 2k when he was in fact at 12k (sure is hard to read the LW guages now).  I don't care about my score at all I mention this because generally all I fly is LW and generally all I see are spits. IMO the FW190s are holding their own as I said before maybe it's pixie dust because I haven't changed anything in my settings.

[Oldman731]

Originally posted by Crumpp
Please feel free to point out where any "conspiracy" is mentioned??  What a silly thing to imply.

There was the implication that the CT staff could change the flight characteristics of planes.  Cliffra's research shows that, with the exception of fuel burn rate, this isn't so (except for people who use the stall limiter).  I think it's important that everyone know that, because from time to time some have accused CT staffers of changing settings to promote their favorite planes.

So, now that it's all been explained, we can forget about that, yes?

- oldman

[Crumpp]

I flew the 190 A5 last night, wanting to get back into my old ride, I also flew it in the CT. There is no difference.

How in the world did you fly it last night in the CT?  It has not been available since Thursday night.

We were supposed to have another day to check it out but Oldman made an error and flight was disabled for axis.  The arena changed over shortly afterwards.

boy have I improved overnight then. I was K/D 12:0 while I was flying alone in a Dora. I suffered a few deaths last night doing base defense and coming to aid of squaddie who squawked for help claiming to be at 2k when he was in fact at 12k (sure is hard to read the LW guages now). I don't care about my score at all I mention this because generally all I fly is LW and generally all I see are spits. IMO the FW190s are holding their own as I said before maybe it's pixie dust because I haven't changed anything in my settings.

Yeah I guess suddenly everyone improved in skill in the Focke Wulf.  Of course when AH2 first came out, I had the same success.

I went from 105 kills and 30 assist in 128 sorties in the last CT tour down from 59 kills, 26 assist in 142 sorties during FinnRuss.  

The Finruss stats are pretty much average for the past several months of FW-190 flying.  Before that my stats go back up to the the same level as this last CT tour.

Gotta just be me as nobody else who flys the Focke Wulf in the CT is experiencing the same thing.

All the best,

Crumpp

[Wilbus]

I was unclear, didn't fly it in the CT last night.

I flew it before the setup changed and I tested in in the MA at the same time, aswell as offline. There was no difference.

Other then that I got back in it in the MA last night and it felt the same as in the CT prior aswell as offline.

[Crumpp]

I flew it before the setup changed and I tested in in the MA at the same time, aswell as offline. There was no difference.

I flew the FW190A5 in the main and you are correct.  It has not changed.  This has been a CT characteristic.

All the best,

Crumpp

[Larry]

Originally posted by Oldman731
Not to be irritating, but this is the first I've heard of this.  Would be interested to hear how to do it.
- oldman

Originally posted by straffo
conspiracy theories again ?

OM yes you can do alota wierd stuff with the arena settings. And straffo go cheack out the facts before opening your mouth.


MA is setup by HTC and everything works right. But CT is setup by CMs that maynot know what some settings do. Thats why I think sometimes the planes dont fly right.
Yall say that the "Stall AoA" only works when you have "Stall Limiter" on. Well if you take a look in the settings you would know that the CM can enable and disable stall limiter for everyone in the arena regaurdless if you have it on or off. So if SL is enabled for the arena and sAoA is messed with then all planes will stall out easyer BUT since the 190 already stalls out easy then its like paper cought in the wind. You will notice that all other planes stall easyer to but they dont stall or wingdip like the 190s do so its not as bad. All that say fuel burn might be the thing thats screwing it up, but thats not the problem. Iv always took less fuel in the CT then I do in the MA, but everything is screwy in the CT because I have less fuel? I dont see how that is.

[Wilbus]

Originally posted by Crumpp
I flew the FW190A5 in the main and you are correct.  It has not changed.  This has been a CT characteristic.

All the best,

Crumpp

Are you trying your very best to missread and missunderstand or is that something that just happens???

Note this part and read it carefully:

I flew it before the setup changed and I tested in in the MA at the same time, aswell as offline. There was no difference.

That means I flew it in the COMBAT THEATER before it changed to a new setting and I compared that to the current MA and also Offline with my own setup.

It hasn't changed nor was it different in the CT.