Author Topic: Civil liberities at risk. (Read 2065 times)

Eagler · « **Reply #30 on:** January 15, 2006, 06:03:48 PM »

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Originally posted by Hangtime
[BThree years after 9/11 we got WHAT?[/B]

not another terror attack on US soil?

BluKitty · « **Reply #31 on:** January 15, 2006, 06:06:53 PM »

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Originally posted by Gunslinger
I'd be the first to disagree with the program if proof was shown that these wiretaps where being used in a criminal prosecution.

Well when you have a place like Guantanamo Bay .. it certainly looks like Bush is bypassesing the judical branch.

Hangtime · « **Reply #32 on:** January 15, 2006, 06:11:01 PM »

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Originally posted by Eagler
not another terror attack on US soil?

Wow.

That's deep.

I feel sooooo much safer now.

Thanks for pointing that out.

lasersailor184 · « **Reply #33 on:** January 15, 2006, 06:17:49 PM »

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So if you don't share the zeal and love for war or just happen to disagree with the 'goverment' your a security threat? Sounds like a secuirty threat to thier power, not our country. Just like Nixon.

I have an NSA document that says Girls have Cooties. And because of this, can't be trusted.

Of course I won't ever show you this NSA document, I'll just make you assume I have it.

Vulcan · « **Reply #34 on:** January 15, 2006, 06:40:36 PM »

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Originally posted by 2Slow
Echelon - This is a secret network rumored to be under development by the National Security Agency (NSA), supposedly designed to detect and capture packets crossing international borders that contain certain keywords, such as "bomb" or "assassination."

http://computer.howstuffworks.com/carnivore4.htm

Actually echelon is quite old. There are two echelon sites in NZ, probably the worst keep secrets in the US spy system. The monitor analog RF traffic, afaik theres never been an upgrade to monitor digital tech. They're in NZ due to some geographic thing with RF signals from China (I think) bouncing back down into our location.

Hangtime · « **Reply #35 on:** January 15, 2006, 06:41:35 PM »

We've already slipped very far down the slope... to have the Executive just ignore and bypass the rule of law without consequence in the name of 'security' is very telling indeed as to what kind of government we have.. and what kind of citizens we've become... no scratch that...

...what kind of 'subjects' we've become.

To allow this president (or any other) to do this we have indeed forfeit the right to the honorific term of 'citizens'. We're just 'subjects'.

Safe happy subjects, secure in our knowledge that the government will not use these 'extreme measures' in any way that could be used by contracting corporations or even other government agencies like the IRS against our fellow americans. Oh, no, no no.. these measures are reasonable and correct for the times and are only used to identify and detain our enemies abroad.. it is after all a very unsafe world.

...and, once the 'terrorist war' (aka Forever War) is concluded, the government will of course, cease spying on us and restore our rights to privacy.

Chumps. Have we become a freakin nation of cowards and gullible chumps.. so willing; as Franklin put it "to sacrafice liberty for security"?

FuBaR · « **Reply #36 on:** January 15, 2006, 07:02:51 PM »

My mom got picked for inspection at the airport recently. I asked the guy what this was for and how people are chosen, he said it can be completly random, but can also have something to do with names. Anyone here work in airport security or anything related who has some more clear info for me?

Gunslinger · « **Reply #37 on:** January 15, 2006, 07:11:20 PM »

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Originally posted by BluKitty
Well when you have a place like Guantanamo Bay .. it certainly looks like Bush is bypassesing the judical branch.

Wrong, US Vrs Hamdi

Persons picked up as enemy combatents are held perfectly legal by the military.

That went to the SC and the SC ruled on it so I hardly think he's bypassing anything.

Vulcan · « **Reply #38 on:** January 15, 2006, 08:26:59 PM »

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Originally posted by FuBaR
My mom got picked for inspection at the airport recently. I asked the guy what this was for and how people are chosen, he said it can be completly random, but can also have something to do with names. Anyone here work in airport security or anything related who has some more clear info for me?

Is your mom a milf?

2Slow · « **Reply #39 on:** January 15, 2006, 11:10:03 PM »

Prior to 911 we had a executive department that was resposible for defense of the nation. The Department of Defense and the FBI.

Now we have a Department of Homeland Security. Does that send any chills down anyones necks. "Homeland", "Fatherland", "Motherland", where have we heard these terms before? USSR, NAZI Germany, Faciast Italy...? Get my point?

I have heard a rumor (probably in a friendly spam) that an internal passport is being worked on. Supposed to be used for interstate travel. Then probably intrastate travel. Then county. Next would be city/town. Then land sections. Perhaps down to quarter sections or acres.

I didn't try to confirm the spam rumor. I just didn't want to know!

Octavius · « **Reply #40 on:** January 15, 2006, 11:20:03 PM »

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Originally posted by FuBaR
My mom got picked for inspection at the airport recently. I asked the guy what this was for and how people are chosen, he said it can be completly random, but can also have something to do with names. Anyone here work in airport security or anything related who has some more clear info for me?

Some names stand out. I was picked randomly twice in the last few times I've flown. I was told certain tickets and boarding passes are marked for the small interview and more extensive search. One way tickets and tickets purchased only a few days before departure are more prone to selection. The last flight I took was one way and on standby, so it was almost a certainty I'd get the cavity search. I lubed before I left for the aiport.

AKS\/\/ulfe · « **Reply #41 on:** January 15, 2006, 11:56:17 PM »

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Originally posted by Gunslinger
Actually I hadn't either, some of the things he says are contradictory but good.

As in:

“This would be the best of all possible worlds, if there were no religion in it”

and

"The government of the United States is not in any sense founded upon the Christian religion”

and this

“There is no such thing as human wisdom; all is the providence of God”

I'm sorry to take you back to this point, but there is absolutely nothing contradictory here at all.

There absolutely can be no religion and yet a belief in God. There is also a God without the Christian religion. It may seem awkward, but I absolutely do believe in God but I subscribe to no religion. Faith is something you have in yourself and that you know.
-SW

Pei · « **Reply #42 on:** January 16, 2006, 01:28:50 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Hangtime
We've already slipped very far down the slope... to have the Executive just ignore and bypass the rule of law without consequence in the name of 'security' is very telling indeed as to what kind of government we have.. and what kind of citizens we've become... no scratch that...

...what kind of 'subjects' we've become.

To allow this president (or any other) to do this we have indeed forfeit the right to the honorific term of 'citizens'. We're just 'subjects'.

Safe happy subjects, secure in our knowledge that the government will not use these 'extreme measures' in any way that could be used by contracting corporations or even other government agencies like the IRS against our fellow americans. Oh, no, no no.. these measures are reasonable and correct for the times and are only used to identify and detain our enemies abroad.. it is after all a very unsafe world.

...and, once the 'terrorist war' (aka Forever War) is concluded, the government will of course, cease spying on us and restore our rights to privacy.

Chumps. Have we become a freakin nation of cowards and gullible chumps.. so willing; as Franklin put it "to sacrafice liberty for security"?

You dirty liberal democrat amerihater!

Pooh21 · « **Reply #43 on:** January 16, 2006, 02:09:43 AM »

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Originally posted by 2Slow

I have heard a rumor (probably in a friendly spam) that an internal passport is being worked on. Supposed to be used for interstate travel. Then probably intrastate travel. Then county. Next would be city/town. Then land sections. Perhaps down to quarter sections or acres.

I didn't try to confirm the spam rumor. I just didn't want to know!

its just a rumor, are you on moveon.orgs mailing list, would explain it.

Rolex · « **Reply #44 on:** January 16, 2006, 02:44:36 AM »

Some of you are awfully young to have lost the natural distrust of people who claim they have 'authority' over you.

"All bad precedents begin as justifiable measures."
- Julius Ceasar

Human nature hasn't changed much, even though over 2,000 years have passed since that statement. You defend your 2nd ammendment rights and rationalize away semantic twisting of your right to due process, life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness? Your right to bear arms was a symbol to keep politicans and governments in fear of the people.

No government, or those who portend to govern, are trustworthy. You can count on every government program and organization having some corruption, abuse and devious intentions by those who relish power and control. Count on it.

And those who want to keep that power and control rely on the inverse relationship between vocal volume and wisdom to squash resistance with, "If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear," and, "We have to do it for our security."

You're making your bed and your children are going to have to live with it. Best of luck to those of you who will be around to witness the next few generations.