Mosquito defensive maneuvers

[Karnak]

Kurt,

I have never lost a Mossie to a Bf110, yet I have killed many Bf110s in close fights, a couple of times with just the .303s.

You, as a Luftlover, have nothing of value to say here.  Take your "Everything German is better" crap and stuff it.



As to the Mossie, it is a hard aircraft to succeed with in the AH MA for a few reasons.

1) It is going up against hordes of the best fighters of all the combatants, and though it is a fighter, it is a heavy fighter.

2) It is a 1943 version of the Mossie in a 1945 arena.

3) It has flame dampers which were only on about one third of FB.Mk VIs, those used for night ops.  FB.Mk VIs used for day ops had ejector stubs and were about 15mph faster, which in 1943 meant they could flat out outrun any German fighter on the deck.  As the AH MA is a daytime environment we really need the 355mph on the deck Mossie VI.

4) The Mossie had a reputation for being a very durable aircraft  that would get home with heavy damage.  In Ah it is regarded as fragile.  This is a disconnect from the historical reputation.

There has been a lot said in this thread that is not true.  The Mossie bombers did not run in at low altitude unless they were Pathfinders.  Mossie Fighter-Bombers did, but those were used for different missions.  Mossie bombers and PR Mossies were so hard to intercept because they cruised at 300mph while the Bf109's scrambling to intercept them would only do 170ish at best climb speed.  If the Mossies gunned it there was no chance for the Bf109s to climb and then catch the Mossies.  The only way to catch them, and an alert Mossie crew could foil it, was to have the Bf109s already at altitude and in position for the intercept.  This was not a "before 1942" thing as very, very few Mossies even operated before 1942.  This was an "until the advent of the Me262" thing, and given the scarcity of Me262s, Mossie Bombers were rarely intercepted through the whole of the war.


Hopefully when the Mossie is redone we get a couple of bombers, the B.Mk IV and B.Mk XVI (perked), and the flame dampers taken off the Mossie VI.

You can be successful in it.  My best kill streak was 31 kills.  It ended when I collided with an enemy Spitfire over enemy territory.  I almost pulled the gun solution on his planeform, but I took too much of a risk.  I should have gone vertical and come back for another go at him.


One note about fighter vs fighter results for the Mossie in the daylight.  I know of one account of Mossie VI's, like in AH, running into a like number of Fw190s after a mission was aborted.  Both sides went for it and the end result was 8 Mossies lost for 4 Fw190s.  A definate German victory, but not a wholesale slaughter of aircraft that couldn't fight back at all.

[SFCHONDO]

Yeah, Mossies suck, never fear them, they won't turn fight or anything.
They just pork fields and die. Would never catch me in one.

[bozon]

Dont listen to the people saying you to leave it in the hangar. Fly it because it's beautiful, fly it because it's a challange, fly it because it's fun.

Unless you are score whoring that is. I would not take any other plane for JABO work and I fly the P47 mainly.

The last patches of AH added faster planes like the Spits 8/16 and ki84. This pushed up the average speed of the common planes and birds like Mossie and Jugs that were considered "middle speed" have shifted to "below average" class (I'm talking low altitude). The only common plane you will outrun is the niki and seafire.

In dive category mossies are very good in the early stages of the dive. However, terminal dive speed is slower than most planes. Pull too hard on the exit and you break the plane. Zoom is great. Climb is suprisingly good even when heavy with ord. Always take less than 50% (sometimes 25% is enough) and you can climb like a true fighter. Better than my jug anyway. Turn performance is decent and when you get real slow or over the top flaps can help.

The last issue is the nasty stall. I have to check it again after the 2.07 FM changes.

The optimistic view of the plane say that in AH fighter are mainly guns with wings. The gunpackage you have is the best you can ask for in a fighter (I'd take 4 nose hispanos over the 110 combo). Anything you hit - dies. Even the 303 have some limited use since the are neatly packed. Add to that the ability to look well over the nose for those hard tracking shots.

So, as a fighter (and I'm not talking BnZ tardness) it is a plane that require some dedication and specialization, but it is far from helpless.

Bozon

[thrila]

Heya batfink.  

I'm coming home for easter for 3 weeks so i should be flying in the MA in a week or so.  I'm debating whether to take my pedals and stick with me or just use my twisty stick at home, it depends how much things i need to take with me.

I've got a lecture in 5 mins so i can't chat, so i'll make a longer post later.  I'll also post some films when i'm back home in plymouth.

[Kazaa]

Got to love this kid.

~S~ Karnak.

P.S: I too have had many battles against thrila in A Mossi, boy was he dam hot in one.

[Kurt]

Originally posted by Karnak
Kurt,
You, as a Luftlover, have nothing of value to say here.  Take your "Everything German is better" crap and stuff it.
 

Not what I said, but a beautiful example of an immature flameout.  The newbies will learn much from you.

Everything german... Yeah, whatever.  I mentioned one specific plane in one specific role.  And if you disagree, thats wonderful.  Most days you'll find me flying one of those fine German spit9's, or the very famous Focke Wulf B-17.

[dedalos]

In the MA there are only 2 deffencive moves they can do.  Go for the HO and run.  As far as survivability in it, just do what every one that drives the does.  Come in for the vulch or HO.  Extend 6K or more and repeat until you receive your WTFGs for flying one and landing 10 kills in it.

[Pooface]

Originally posted by dedalos
In the MA there are only 2 deffencive moves they can do.  Go for the HO and run.  As far as survivability in it, just do what every one that drives the does.  Come in for the vulch or HO.  Extend 6K or more and repeat until you receive your WTFGs for flying one and landing 10 kills in it.

not true, although skillless dweebs do do that. a decent pilot can fly a mossie like a spit. it takes very fine control cause the fat bastage spins out real easy, but it is a great plane.

just gotta know how to use it

[Karnak]

Originally posted by dedalos
In the MA there are only 2 deffencive moves they can do.  Go for the HO and run.  As far as survivability in it, just do what every one that drives the does.  Come in for the vulch or HO.  Extend 6K or more and repeat until you receive your WTFGs for flying one and landing 10 kills in it.

Or maybe you could learn that there are actually defensive and offesive moves that work in it.

Maybe.

Or maybe not.

Your choice.

[B@tfinkV]

oh no what have i done? Thrilla coming to get us all!

[dedalos]

Any of you two want to show me how to fly the M as a Spit let me know.  Three years I have been playing this game.  I have yet to see a M try to fight intentionaly.  Only if they see they can't get away and the two or three reverses for the HO failed.  Only use I have seen is vulch, run, repeat, wait for the WTFGs.

But hey, anytime you want to teach me some offensive or deffensive moves let me know.  My choice is made.  I want to learn.  Should we try Spit vs Mossie first since they can be flown the same way?

[Karnak]

We didn't say it could do the same things as a Spit, and the newer, faster Spits are vastly better then the Spits I had to deal with.

That said, I always prefered air-to-air combat.  I certainly didn't rely on vulching and the HO is iffy as a tactic.

If you get outnumbered in the Mossie you are probably dead.  I have won free of some of those, but rarely.  If you just want the best and easist fighter, stay away from the Mossie.

If you want a challenge that can get you killed, but can also win the fight the Mossie can be a fun choice.

1) Always be aware of your situation.  Of particular threat are La-7s, Ki-84s, Spitfire Mk VIIIs and Spitfire Mk XVIs.  When I was playing only the La-7 was in the game.  The Mossie's job has gotten a lot harder.

2)  Come in with an altitude advantage.  The Mossie is mostly a BnZ fighter.

3) Take any shot you can generate.  The guns can kill instantly and are comparitively easy to hit with.  I recommend avoiding the HO if you think you have a chance of winning without using it as the Mossie is large and fragile, which more than offsets its firepower in the HO.

4) Defensively your best bet is speed, keep some altitude so you can dive to speed if you need to.  Against fighters that are faster and more agile I had best luck in generate a blackout turn and then killing them before they figured out where I was.

5) Offensively use high yoyos or lag turns to cut the corner on better turning fighters.

6) Keep a feel for your E state and know when you need to pull out to reposition.  The Mossie has gobs of fuel, so you have plenty of time to work.

[bozon]

I just checked the mosquito in the TA. Nasty stall and nose pitch of the combat trim is still there even though 2.07 patch notes say:

Due to this change, the table that controls combat trim had to be redone for all planes.

This and the tail forward slides after stalls give the feeling of a center of gravity too far aft. For the time it should be flow with C.T. turned off as the pitch up will tend to push you over the edge when slow turning.

To get out of a deep stall (tail forward fall after stalling): full stick forward and right + full right rudder, till the nose comes down. Keep throttle open.

To get out of high speed spin: stick forward + stick and rudder opposite to the roll direction. It's possible to get into a normal dive in less than 2 revolutions.

Bozon

[Higgins]

Just a little input on the mossie.  I fly it almost exclusively as I like to Jabo and fight fighters in it.  It is a great plane for this as its ammo loadout is high, and the guns being central in the nose makes hitting anything a snap.  That combined with the good view over the nose as others have stated as well.  One advantage that I didn't see anyone mention is its turning ability.  

Basic rule others state is correct.  Stay fast and with a little altitude to dive away if things get hairy.  Turn slowly in it as it bleeds energy tremendously.  What I tend to do if I get caught low and can't outrun the enemy is sucker them in at an angle off my 6.  (meaning slowly turn angular before they get in gun range).  Then pull full stick either at the same turnrate upward or opposite depending on con angle approach.  This is dangerous as the mossie is a big target, but what I find is most people tend to get excited and come in too fast to correct in time.  The energy scrubbing that is usually a disadvantage to the mossie can be used as an advantage as you can take any altitude gained in the vertical to roll over on opponent if he overshot immediately, or if he turns into you, scissor him, releasing one notch of flap and banking each direction until he does overshoot you.  I find that scissoring manuevers in the mossie to work about 70% of the time.  The issue you will run into is that your are not low and slow and if any other cons are inbound it makes it tough.  Nikis give me the most trouble as they seem uber with energy retension.  If also had them out accelerate my Tepest at over 300MPH in a dive.  I usually HO any other inbounds into a slow fight while turn fighting the orignal con.  People don't realize the mossie will turn slow as much as it does.  You have to becareful with the nasty stall but practice makes perfect in it.  Check my stats if you doubt that you can be successfull in the Mossie.  It can be a great plane.  Plus, after you fly it for a while, when you take an actually figher up it feels like cheating...hehehe.

Warmest Regards,

Higgins

[SirLoin]

Ya but for something made largely of balsa,it should turn better.

my 2cents