Author Topic: Pilots: how did the "left turn" on approach (Read 653 times)

Waffle · « **on:** April 23, 2006, 11:08:55 AM »

how did the "left turn" on approach come about?

Bronk · « **Reply #1 on:** April 23, 2006, 11:12:02 AM »

They were all NASCAR fans and wanted to emulate them.

Bronk

Blooz · « **Reply #2 on:** April 23, 2006, 11:19:57 AM »

My guess would be that back in the days of rotary engines it would be much easier to turn left than right due to the spin of the engine.

Saxman · « **Reply #3 on:** April 23, 2006, 11:20:48 AM »

If I'm thinking about what you are, I THINK it has to do with the Royal Navy figuring out how to land a Corsair on a carrier. The long nose made it impossible to see the deck on approach, so instead the Brits approached out of a turn. USN/MC Corsair squadrons adopted it.

I suppose it must have spread from there and became common practice.

Hajo · « **Reply #4 on:** April 23, 2006, 11:24:49 AM »

I think it's attributed to the fact that most people are right handed and a left turn is more comfortable.

Donzo · « **Reply #5 on:** April 23, 2006, 11:33:30 AM »

The pilot in command sits on the left side.
This being the case, he has better visibility during a left turn.

Kev367th · « **Reply #6 on:** April 23, 2006, 12:21:36 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Donzo
The pilot in command sits on the left side.
This being the case, he has better visibility during a left turn.

Depends, rotary wing, right hand seat is the 'boss'. At least in the UK they are.

DAVENRINO · « **Reply #7 on:** April 23, 2006, 01:24:19 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Kev367th
Depends, rotary wing, right hand seat is the 'boss'. At least in the UK they are.

I believe this is a function seat config and where the collective is located rather than which country you are in. A Bell 206 is made in the USA and is flown from the right seat. It has 2 seats up front so it is easier for the pilot to get in and out from the right seat without climbing over the collective. The MD 500 is also made in the USA but is flown from the left because it is supposed to have room for 3 up front. You have to take out the center seat in order to install the collective for the right seat.

Golfer · « **Reply #8 on:** April 23, 2006, 01:28:14 PM »

I think someone just decided that you need to have "standard" turns.

How we went from a standard traffic pattern to the left and standard turns in a hold to the right is what I want to know!

I'd have to think it dates to old school maritime rules. Airplanes have the same nav and position light rules as ships. Red on the port, green on the starboard and white on the tail. The idea behind that is right-of-way. If you're flying along and you see a green light merging with you, you have the right of way. Green for go and you're right of course. If you're flying along and you see a red light...Red/Stop/Give way. He's to your right and he has the right-of-way.

Still...standard traffic pattern and holding turns going in two different directions. Why god, why!!!!

Waffle · « **Reply #9 on:** April 23, 2006, 01:35:17 PM »

Some folks are on the right track....

Port and Starbord did come from nautical use, but the equestrian terms "nearside" and "offside" were used, but never adopted....the nautical terms seemed to come into use during/after ww1, and then just sort of became standard.

So now we play the blame game....lol

So, who was responsible for the decision or influenced the pilots of yesterday and today to make a standard left hand approach?

Darkish · « **Reply #10 on:** April 23, 2006, 01:50:34 PM »

Could it have anything to do with engine torque?

I may be wrong but don't Brit props spin anticlockwise as seen from the cockpit. So if you need to add a bit of power the torque will straighten you out rather than increase the bank.

At slow speeds it might just be safer turning left than right.

oops just saw Blooz's post

Golfer · « **Reply #11 on:** April 23, 2006, 02:16:06 PM »

Watch out now. I am a licensed boater. Class of 2:30am a few summers ago when bored one night.

You can do anything online these days

Mace2004 · « **Reply #12 on:** April 23, 2006, 06:53:40 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Hajo
I think it's attributed to the fact that most people are right handed and a left turn is more comfortable.

Right handed pilots plus torque gives the most correct answer. It's just easier to turn that way. There's less force on the stick (and right handed pilots are pushing on the stick instead of pulling) and less rudder required for a coordinated turn so it's easier and less tiring. Also, if you jump someone that doesn't see u until you're right on his six, the majority of the time the guy will break left. If you see old films of approaches on the USS Langley you'll see they flew a left hand pattern even though the ship had a clean deck with no island. Navy then built their CV's with the island on the right to keep it (and it's turbulance) out of the left-hand pattern. You gun the engine on a wave-off and the airplane wants to go left...kinda sucks when they're a 7 story steel building in the way. Japanese tried putting the island on the left...didn't work out, think they only had one or two CV's built that way. Multiplace planes put the PIC on the left because of the left turns. Interestingly enough, Navy helos at a CV will fly a right hand pattern on the ship's starboard side...keeps them away from the fixed wing and it's more comfortable for them.

Mace

Waffle · « **Reply #13 on:** April 24, 2006, 12:15:39 AM »

Well, here's why....and some other fun info.

The Wright canard biplane - 2 seats side by side with primary control being a wing-warping and rudder lever. This was located in between the 2 seats. There were seperate control levers for the nose elevator, one on each outer side of the seats. So the pilot sitting in the left had seat would have main control in his right hand, and secondary in his left hand. The Wrights deliberitly trained instructor pilots to fly from the right hand seat, and had pupils in the left. These pupils learned how to fly"right handed". This enventually became the standard as to pilot posistions.

As far as the left hand approach...

Since most folks were flying right handed, and due to tremendous torque and the gyroscopic effects of radial engines ... Pilots found it easier to lean out the left hand side of their aircraft, getting an unobstructed view from the oil spray, center guns, wiring/struts ect.........

But - a side note - Wilbur Wright, when able to mantain steerable flight - made a left handed circut.

So I guess Wilbur Wright is the one blame for making the left handed approach standard today.

SMIDSY · « **Reply #14 on:** April 24, 2006, 03:28:54 AM »

it has everything to do with the fact that most pilots are right handed, so they have a tendency to turn left when in trouble on approach. the japanese lost many a pilot as a result of their fielding several carriers with the island on the port side.