Author Topic: A little poem a friend sent me guys  (Read 2287 times)

Offline john9001

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« Reply #45 on: June 20, 2006, 10:34:33 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by uvwpvW
How brave of you.

If the Iraqis didn't fight for their freedom why should anyone else? The Iraqis deserved their government. As do we all.

Nash makes some excellent points, and before any of you "I wanted to serve but never did" armchair-generals asks for my "credentials" - yes I'm a vet.



over the years, many Iraqs have died trying to overthrow saddam, they needed a little help, just like the colonies needed help from the french when the colonies had their little "disagreement" with England in 1776.

did you forget about the massacres of the Kurds and she-its after gulf war 1?

former Marine

Offline Yeager

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« Reply #46 on: June 20, 2006, 10:39:46 AM »
How brave of you.
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Thanks, but the real credit goes to those in harms way.

If the Iraqis didn't fight for their freedom why should anyone else? The Iraqis deserved their government. As do we all.
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The Iraqi people have been trying to rid Iraq of Hussein since he savaged his way into power.  Hundreds of thousands of Iraqis opposed to Hussein have died over the last 30+ years as a result of that opposition.

Nash makes some excellent points
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thats a matter of opinion.

yes I'm a vet.
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Thanks for your service.
"If someone flips you the bird and you don't know it, does it still count?" - SLIMpkns

Offline beet1e

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« Reply #47 on: June 20, 2006, 10:53:18 AM »
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Originally posted by Yeager
Based on my knowledge on this subject I would say it is time to get Mugabe out of there.  Yes.......I assign this mission to the UK Spain Italy and Germany while we finish up in Iraq.  Deal?
Nicely side stepped!

Offline Yeager

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« Reply #48 on: June 20, 2006, 10:54:58 AM »
Its just a step to the left........
"If someone flips you the bird and you don't know it, does it still count?" - SLIMpkns

Offline Thud

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« Reply #49 on: June 20, 2006, 10:57:08 AM »
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Originally posted by Yeager
directly via phone or email, maybe even a letter to the local newspaper editor.  But I will not prance up and down the street of my city holding signs and beating drums, looking foolish like some others and giving aid and comfort to those who prefer to kill us....these people that protest tend to be people I would rather not associate with.  Leftest radicals, socialists and communists.


Well, the makeup of the crowd will depend on the issue at hand, right?

Offline uvwpvW

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« Reply #50 on: June 20, 2006, 10:59:29 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by john9001
over the years, many Iraqs have died trying to overthrow saddam, they needed a little help, just like the colonies needed help from the french when the colonies had their little "disagreement" with England in 1776.

did you forget about the massacres of the Kurds and she-its after gulf war 1?

former Marine


Have you forgotten that Iraq had a conscript army? An army of the people. Hussein ruled Iraq with the help of his people. The Kurds were not Hussein’s people. Two thirds of the Iraqi population is Shi’ite, but how many actually stood up to fight? Those who did were brave, but unfortunately the vast majority of Iraqis are complaisant cowards who’d rather whine and complain to the west instead of standing up to fight for their own freedom.

I have no respect for the Iraqi people, and if one non-Iraqi die to help them it is one too many.

It was the American people that rebelled against England. True, France helped, but it wasn’t a French invasion to free the Americans from a tyranny they accepted. Do you really want to give the French all the credit? No, I didn’t think so.

Offline red26

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« Reply #51 on: June 20, 2006, 11:22:14 AM »
I served with the 1st Infantry Div. In Iraq in Operation Danger. I know what it's like to see one of your buddys tore apart by a IED Ive seen my buddys take a round in the chest. Ive been there when we ship the bodys home with flags draped across there coffins. And ya know yall say that we are not fighting a huge 'Axis Power' but in some since we are if we just sat back ant let them rant and rave it would take no time for them to try something stupid like try to bring the fight here. Its funny you say that there is no axis well your kinda right for they dont want you to see there full body of there army. They would rather hide and fight like ***ches they hide in hospitals, churches come on they dont even put on a uniform. So the public dosent know about there army  the public cant see them and since they dont were a uniform the public dosent think that there is a thret. And as far as being called a "baby killer" it still happens today and yes it happend to me at the mall . Ya know in WWII the troops were backed no matter what they did its called caring for thouse that are willng to DIE just so the people back home do have to worrie. Thats one of the reasons I joined up in the first place. Some of yall dont see US the troops being treated like crap because you havent wore the uniform and for some people since your not the ones beeing treated like crap it dosent matter to you. As long as you have your nice car and nice house your big job with AC you dont care about thouse guys in Iraq getting wasted. Who cares if a Marine dies Who cares if Soldier dies as long as you have your nice car and nice house and big job WHO CARES and for some they might not have anything but they dont care as long as its not them. SO you dont have to support the war but dont treat the guys that come back like CRAP.:furious
US ARMY LEAD THE WAY

Offline ChickenHawk

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« Reply #52 on: June 20, 2006, 11:32:50 AM »
We've all seen the pictures of the radical hippies that make fools of themselves and are of such low mental stock that they blame soldiers for doing their duty.  But I think this is such a small percentage of the population that they should not even deserve a footnote in our history.  I know a lot of people against the war but I have never heard even one of them say the least disrespectful thing against any soldier.  I think this is much ado about little.

I think most people for the war are of the opinion that if anyone is against it, they must be against the troops fighting it.  Nothing could be farther from the truth.  But that sentiment is so common that Thud even asked outright if it was the norm.  Yeager said the ratio is 40/60 but from my experience I think it's actually closer to 1/99.  Take any anti war rally early in the war and count the people in the rally against all the other people in that city and I dare say you would come in at way less than one percent of the population.  Today you would find even less of a fraction than that.

On this board we've had maybe one or two radicals who would stoop so low as to criticize someone serving their country, but I haven’t seen that for quite a while now.  The vocal anti-war personalities in this very thread like Nash, Beet & MT, have never to my knowledge said anything in the least disrespectful of any soldier.

Where does all this hostility come from?  Is it left over from the Vietnam era?  That era is over, lets move on.  Anti-war does not equal anti-soldier anymore.
Do not attribute to malice what can be easily explained by incompetence, fear, ignorance or stupidity, because there are millions more garden variety idiots walking around in the world than there are blackhearted Machiavellis.

Offline Maverick

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« Reply #53 on: June 20, 2006, 01:22:01 PM »
Goomba and Red26, well said.
DEFINITION OF A VETERAN
A Veteran - whether active duty, retired, national guard or reserve - is someone who, at one point in their life, wrote a check made payable to "The United States of America", for an amount of "up to and including my life."
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Offline lazs2

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« Reply #54 on: June 20, 2006, 02:23:00 PM »
You guys claiming all our problems with the sadman had to do with WMD possibilities are oversimplifying..

Are we forgeting that he invaded his neighbor and took their country and that Kuwait asked us for help?  Not to mention that the UN asked us to do something...

Then... the UN sent in the inspectrors and the UN did the sanctions and the UN had it's inspectors thrown out.  

The sadman had used WMD's and was known to seek them out... He may or may not have had them but... He kicked out the inspectors and was "sanctioned" (read had to bribe them).

We had no idea apparently if he had em or not... he had em in the past and probly had some when we warned him and durring the inspections and after we warned him...

If he were still in power he would be seeking them out right now.    He sanctioned terrorism against our allies...

He was a bad man.   He was also a dangerous and bad man.   We as a country and a world are better off without him.   He was 100 times more of a threat to us and the world than any spear chucking african dictator.

lazs

Offline FiLtH

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« Reply #55 on: June 20, 2006, 02:38:20 PM »
Until men are drafted they should except the risks of the job they chose, and complain among themselves. My brother is about to deploy there a third time. He says it sucks over there, but doesnt feel he is wronged for being sent there.

  Im sure some places in the US have their nests of folk who love to chant baby-killer, and pretend they are in the 60s, but much of the nation is behind their troops, even if they dont agree with the administration's behavior.

~AoM~

Offline Shuckins

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« Reply #56 on: June 20, 2006, 04:12:57 PM »
The great majority of Iraqi's were not "Saddam's people."  He was sustained by the support of the Sunni's and the Baathist party.

There was always resistance to his rule.  The 400,000 bodies that have been uncovered prove that.  The vast majority of these victims are Kurds and Shi-ites.  

To imply that the Iraqi's got the government they deserved because they were too cowardly to resist is to use a base and foolish argument.  The Shi'ites and Kurds are no more, or less, cowardly than any other ethnic group.

Offline uvwpvW

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« Reply #57 on: June 20, 2006, 04:36:44 PM »
Then why didn’t they remove Hussein from power themselves? The only alternative must be that most Iraqis didn’t want him removed. Why couldn’t the Iraqis win their own freedom?

The Americans did it.

The Russians did it twice.

The Romanians did it.

Basically the entire Eastern Europe did it.

The French did it.

The Afghans did it at least twice.

The Indies did it.

The South Africans did it.

The IRANIANS did it.

Why couldn’t the Iraqis do it?

Why is the Iraqi’s freedom worth the lives of Americans and others?

It is not.

Offline Yeager

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« Reply #58 on: June 20, 2006, 04:48:27 PM »
Why couldn�t the Iraqis win their own freedom?
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Dude check this site out.  Its just the tip of the google iceberg but I think you deserve to at least check some things out here before carrying on.  No doubt you and maybe some others will cast doubts towards the particular source but there are hundreds of sites out there all pretty much confirming that Hussein brutalized the entire Iraqi nation.

http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/27000.htm

"Over one million Iraqis are believed to be missing in Iraq as a result of executions, wars and defections, of whom hundreds of thousands are thought to be in mass graves."
"If someone flips you the bird and you don't know it, does it still count?" - SLIMpkns

Offline uvwpvW

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« Reply #59 on: June 20, 2006, 04:53:27 PM »
How could Hussein “brutalize” his people if they didn’t cowardly allow him to do so? Dictators don’t take power. They’re given power by the people.

No one deserves freedom if they’re not willing to die for it. Do you think their freedom is worth American lives? If so why?