Are American opinions easliy molded by the Media?

[Fury]

The sucky part about political campaigns is that your past will *always* come back to haunt you.

I can't imagine any candidate starting a campaign by airing his own dirty laundry.  It would certainly be interesting to see though.

It's not like I walk through life telling people of my own past miseries...if it comes up, I have no problem talking about it.  If I apply for a job, or meet new people, I don't say "Hey you know, I did so-and-so a few years ago".  Most people just are not ready to deal with stuff like that.

Anyways, my initial point was how the public would react to something that happened so long ago, when Mr. Bush has admitted he no longer does stuff like that.  Should be an interesting few days.

Fury

[RAM]

 

Originally posted by Fury:
The sucky part about political campaigns is that your past will *always* come back to haunt you.

I can't imagine any candidate starting a campaign by airing his own dirty laundry.  It would certainly be interesting to see though

well, the past will come back to haunt you unless you start saying "Look gentlemen I did this, this this and that. I regret it, and changed by ways, now I am a new man".

THAT is integrity. Not to wait for someone to find the garbage on your past and spreading it to the 4 winds.

And if he had done that, I am sure that Bush's credibility would be way better than it is now. Instead of playing the "caught-in-the-cheat-morale-king" he would be playing the "I-did-wrong-but-now-am-a-good-man"

Again, noone answered me to THIS question (and this is the quid of all the matter):


You REALLY think that if a "no I didnt" would've costed Bush less votes than a "yes" he would've admitted it?...


The lack of direct answer to this question, says a lot about Bush's credibility ,IMO...

[mrfish]

 

Originally posted by Shamus:

As for Clintons double speak, the first time I heard his "I didnt inhale" comment, my first impression was, how can I vote for someone who is so stupid that he cant even figure out how to smoke dope properly.

Shamus

amen brother shamus-

[Gunthr]

 

Not to wait for someone to find the garbage on your past and spreading it to the 4 winds.

Ram, I'm trying to explain the finer points of American politics to you...

Bush's political enemies have known about his DUI conviction all along, as have many other people. It is a matter of public record. It was only a question of when they would use it.

Bush has always said that he had made some mistakes in his past. He hasn't attempted to conceal it, he just hasn't shouted it from the rooftops. I don't think we should have expected that from him.

Again, for myself and many other voters, this is just a minor blip in Bush's campaign for President. The conservative platform is what I'm voting for (along with my own pet issue, Education).

BTW, does the rain in Spain still fall mainly on the plain?

  Gunthr

[Eagler]

 

Originally posted by RAM:
well, the past will come back to haunt you unless you start saying "Look gentlemen I did this, this this and that. I regret it, and changed by ways, now I am a new man".

THAT is integrity. Not to wait for someone to find the garbage on your past and spreading it to the 4 winds.

Hey Ram
We're waiting, go ahead with your dirty laundry.. LOL.. Hate for it to be spread to the 4 winds. Let's see this integrity in action you preach above..

I didn't think so..........

Eagler

[Ripsnort]

 

Ram:You REALLY think that if a "no I didnt" would've costed Bush less votes than a "yes" he would've admitted it?...

No, I don't, I think the majority have already made their minds up on who they will elect, and this won't change anything, as I stated in my original post.

 

St.Santa:"Read cnn that Gore officials didn't comment on it. Would be dumb of them to do so, since the election ain't about what
           happened 24 years ago, unless you elect for personality.

They can't comment on it since theres too much black residue on the kettle to call the stove black!

[Yeager]

I don't know the man, I don't know if he has changed. But what he did was pretty damned horrible.
========
Huh?

Did he rape half a dozen women?  Did he leave his place in line to run from a war where his brothers and sisters were dying?  Did he drive his car off a bridge and leave a young pregnant woman to drown inside a submerged vehicle waiting SEVERAL HOURS before reporting it?  I could go on and on......

Horrible?  

Yeager


[This message has been edited by Yeager (edited 11-03-2000).]

[Maverick]

I think this could backfire on the Democrats. It is very close to the election. I don't think that anyone has any doubts it was a purely political move on Gores campaign that this came out now.

Bush stepped up and took personal responsibility for it. That is such a refreshing change from the last 8 years it is incredible. That would never have happened under the current administration. The last 8 years have been nothing but sidestepping denials and outright lies until undeniable proof was delivered. After the proof was delivered there was a center ring circus of "lawyer" (liar) speek that will go  down as a classic study in obfuscation.

Clinton / Gore have made lawyer jokes more truth than fantasy with their activities, IMHO. Both clinton's are a true shining example of the law profession.

Mav

[NATEDOG]

One little side note. Bush's blood/alcohol level was AT the legal limit, not past the legal limit. He just didn't pass the field soberiety test. Have you ever tried to take one of those? Those are hard completely sober. Standing with your right foot 6 inches off the ground, out in front of you, legs straight, arms extended straight out to your side, palms up, looking straight up, saying your ABC's backwards. I don't think so! My point is: if this would have been Gore, he would have brought up all those facts, and defended himself on those grounds.......... Bush just said, I did it.

------------------
Nathan "NATEDOG" Mathieu
Art Director
HiTech Creations
-=HELLFIRE SQUAD=-

".... And on the eighth day, God created beer. "

[LJK Raubvogel]

It is refreshing to see a candidate admit a wrong-doing without hesitation. Hell, Clinton lied under oath, and with conviction. I would much rather have someone who can make a mistake and not be afraid to admit it than someone who feels like they have to lie under oath to cover it up. Making mistakes is going to happen, no one is perfect. It's how you deal with that mistake that displays your character. Lying about it is a cowardly act no matter how you slice it. It takes a far bigger man to admit wrong-doing.

And btw, Bush had my vote as soon as he called that reporter a "major-league amazinhunk." I like a guy who calls it like he sees it.

------------------
LJK_Raubvogel
LuftJägerKorps

[RAM]

 

Originally posted by NATEDOG:
Have you ever tried to take one of those?

LOL! never...know why?...because when I blow on the alcohol machine I always give "0" on the alcohol rating, I neved drink when I am going to drive...and hear, I like beer,Vodka and Whiskey as much as anyone here can like it  


 

Originally posted by Eagler:
Hey Ram
We're waiting, go ahead with your dirty laundry.. LOL.. Hate for it to be spread to the 4 winds. Let's see this integrity in action you preach above..

I didn't think so..........

Eagler

Eagler ,I will never try to be president of my country, and less using my moral integrity as a shield  

But if you ask me, I've never driven drunk, I've never tasted drugs and I've never have extramatrimonial relationships  

So, guess that it makes me better than bush?   naaaahhh...past is past, and we agree on that. I haven't personal sympathy for a governor who has sent several convicts to the death refusing to change their death penalties...but I have to admit that USA and Spain are different countries and we have different points of view on many things.

I am just saying that, when you use moral integrity and honesty as your campaign's flag, and you are caught on a thing like this...

Its not a good signal   nothing else.


[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 11-03-2000).]

[LJK Raubvogel]

 

Originally posted by RAM:
 
I am just saying that, when you use moral integrity and honesty as your campaign's flag, and you are caught on a thing like this...

Its not a good signal     nothing else.

RAM- moral character and integrity does not mean that you have to share every little detail of your life with the entire world. The fact that he readily admitted it shows his integrity. A man of low moral character would have tried to cover it up, or tried to justify it. Being a politician does not mean you have to invite the whole world to examine every detail of your life. I am much more concerned with what a candidate plans on doing in the present than what he did over 2 decades ago.


------------------
LJK_Raubvogel
LuftJägerKorps

[Yeager]

I neved drink when I am going to drive...and hear, I like beer,Vodka and Whiskey as much as anyone here can like it.
====
Yes RAM but in your little country you can walk from one side to the other without crossing a road let alone get in a car!

JK  

Yeager

[RAM]

 

Originally posted by LJK Raubvogel:
RAM- moral character and integrity does not mean that you have to share every little detail of your life with the entire world. The fact that he readily admitted it shows his integrity. A man of low moral character would have tried to cover it up, or tried to justify it. Being a politician does not mean you have to invite the whole world to examine every detail of your life. I am much more concerned with what a candidate plans on doing in the present than what he did over 2 decades ago.

Raub I can agree with you-to an extent.

I agree that he has admited it, and taken the responsability for it...but, then again, he had NO other option, if he still wants to sit down in the W.H.

What could he do? Deny it? only to see how the police archives confirm the story?...

Start some kind of "evasive" explanation? only to see his attacks on Clinton and Gore applied over himself?

He did the ONLY thing possible, I dont say that he hasnt changed, or that he doesnt taste alcohol since his forties. I say that he had NO other exit for it...

--AND THAT HE COULD HAVE AVOIDED THIS SITUATION--...if he knew that this info would be published sooner or later...then why not use it to show that he has nothing to hide?...

Being as it is, now we see a candidate who has used integrity as flag and signal for his campaign, in a quite bad situation. He had no other choice than to do what he did.

His declarations doesnt show his honesty, only shows he has very very good image assessors, and that he is smart enough to follow their suggestions.

BUt I dont see any proof on his honesty here, to be true.


[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 11-03-2000).]

[Eagler]

 

Originally posted by RAM:
 

But if you ask me, I've never driven drunk, I've never tasted drugs and I've never have extramarital relationships    

<S>


I haven't personal sympathy for a governor who has sent several convicts to the death refusing to change their death penalties...[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 11-03-2000).]

This is the hardest thing a governor has to do if his state enforces the death penalty. They do not take it light heartedly. My grandfather, my namesake, had 1st hand experience in this matter. Governor of Ohio, 1959-63. His book "Power of Life and Death" is an excellent read concerning the issue.
 http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0404624111/qid%3D973283153/104-1194710-9399160

Eagler