New arena format Part 2 - Use this thread, don't open duplicates

[hubsonfire]

Originally posted by Waffle BAS
Seriously Mangina - I'm gonna kick your arse. Edbert will probably help to.

I took too long finding that pic. It was in response to Donzo's clever post.
Go back to the buffet and be still.

[rshubert]

most of the BoPs to get back into this discussion, because I really wanted to give this new setup a chance to work.  Unfortunately, we all seem to agree (but for different reasons) that it DOES NOT WORK.

Hitech, I make my living rolling out various types of control, product tracking, and automation systems.  I would venture to guess that, in the last 25 years or so, I have led or been a team member on more system rollouts than you have game versions, including all the games you have been involved with.  I have seen implementations fail, and I have seen them succeed.  Technically, this implementation is a success.  Politically, however...

You have screwed the pooch on this one.  Here's how:

You failed to secure the most important part of any new system rollout, CUSTOMER BUYIN.  Hell, you didn't even announce it--you just did it.

You failed to plan the rollout.  The lack of the cross-arena features on startup shows that.  The retention and continued problems with the ENY system shows that.

You didn't SELL the idea.  Your vague references to "health of the community" issues don't hold water, without some detail and explanation.  People don't like it when you blow smoke.

I understand that moving people out of their comfort zone is always difficult.  What you did may even be needed.  The way you did it was, to use a term I have used before, arrogant.  I hope it doesn't pull the rug out from under the community, because the community's loyalty is your only real company asset.

[aerosaber]

I know it's a game. It's a military/ semi-historical simulation. I prefer to stay with one country. I'm a Rook, I started as a Rook and will stay a Rook. I think that games like these are also about comrads, honor, and loyalty. I liked flying with people I know, even if our paths crossed on limited occasions.

Common folks, tell me it aint fun to see a freindly icon on the ground or in the air? To Pass along greetings, then fly together. Thats called a community, thats what we had, thats what we need to get back. The new setup is not that bad. I really like the mid-war arena.

I'm sure HT will work this out. I also think we have a rocky road ahead.

[999000]

Viper215, Hitech plays this game very little.. maybe 30 hours in the last year? put his name in the pilot score see what you find....He might not be as familiar with the community as you might think. I've assumed many things in life and been wrong.
999000

[Kev367th]

Getting back to the nitty gritty -

The problems isn't the arenas themselves, it's the caps, especially on the LW arenas that the overwhelming majority play.

Prime example -

LW1 - One side badly outnumbered.
LW2 - They have the overwhelming numbers.

Combine them, pretty much even.
Happens regularly.

So instead of making things more even, it has made them worse.

Min cap for LW1 needs to be around 350-400, if there is to be a cap of any kind.
I'm also pretty sure that sort of setup would more than likely satisfy EVERYONE.
Leave low caps on the MW / EW if needed. (do they ever get full?)

Apart from that the different arena idea is fine, it's just the implementation that is slightly flawed.

[Grits]

Originally posted by 999000
Viper215, Hitech plays this game very little.. maybe 30 hours in the last year? put his name in the pilot score see what you find....He might not be as familiar with the community as you might think. I've assumed many things in life and been wrong.
999000

Just a thought, but, maybe they fly under different names (shadez) so they can watch what goes on without being noticed? How much do you think they could observe when they are being bombarded with a thousand stoopid questions about "can I have my perk points back if I disco in a 262?". Think about it, its not a stretch.

If you think HT and Pyro dont know what is going on in their game you are kidding yourself.

[4510]

Originally posted by FALCONWING
kite777 (6 years together)
bushlt
fungi987 (3 years)
hotdogmn (3+ years)
shubie      (3+ years)
thundregg
flaydone
airjer      (since awc)
camador
solar10
mctoast
viper215  (too long)
sullie
banshee  (since my first day in air warrior classic) was ban69
usranger
red420
reverand
pops949
rain000
flyy            (since awc rre4 circa 1995)
tcfkas
gary6
mailbox
talonII
POW        (. 3years)
choperen
badcarma
JollyFe
Goaly
99mecinf
UFO
Beagle
2old2fly
Monti       (since awc as well)
Jpeg
Ink
Locochal
Donzo
Cablemender
Bayonet
Worid1
waldo

okay im sure i left otu a bunch but wanted to do this quickly

Good response !

[Mugzeee]

Originally posted by Dead Man Flying
Interesting.  The actual quote on the Blue Knights homepage states:

The Blue Knights came into being in April of 1992.
This squad has no ranks, no chain of command, no officers, nor do we have a squad night.  We don't fly missions, we don't drop bombs, we don't take bases.

We fight.
We're good at it.

But improperly paraphrasing it to suit you works too I suppose.

-- Todd/Leviathn

  Actually the BK's squad persona is played out more on the BBS than anywhere else.

  I kinda think of the BK's as the AH Forums squad.

[Mugzeee]

Originally posted by Kev367th
Getting back to the nitty gritty -

The problems isn't the arenas themselves, it's the caps, especially on the LW arenas that the overwhelming majority play.

Prime example -

LW1 - One side badly outnumbered.
LW2 - They have the overwhelming numbers.

Combine them, pretty much even.
Happens regularly.

So instead of making things more even, it has made them worse.

Min cap for LW1 needs to be around 350-400, if there is to be a cap of any kind.
I'm also pretty sure that sort of setup would more than likely satisfy EVERYONE.
Leave low caps on the MW / EW if needed. (do they ever get full?)

Apart from that the different arena idea is fine, it's just the implementation that is slightly flawed.

 Thats it kev...keep it on task.  
  EW has been maxed a few times..MW i think never.
PS..currently unemployed lets me keep an eye on the Arena counts constantly. Those that know me know i never sleep!  LOL

  I think you are on the money as far as what would satisfy most of the players feeling the brunt of the change.

[FALCONWING]

Originally posted by Stang
Oh please Falc, I didn't expect this kind of drivel from you.  You know better.

sorry stang...you know i love you!!!

guess being confronted by hitech when he lets your squaddies spew venom right and left got me flustered...

[FALCONWING]

oh and a quick note...i am not planning on quitting...

i may get banned but im not quitting...BoPs will adapt...we always have..

Logged on to main arena to "did you hear Falc quit?"  from nonsquad guys...

"Reports of my demise have been greatly exaggerated"

[MIShill]

Not to reiterate the point- I am though- another night of two sides ganging up on one. This functionally turns it into an offense- gang- bang side of 70% vs. a defense side of 30%. I know you can "always switch sides" but that only exascerbates the problem because everyone gets tired of 100% defense after a while so nobody switches to the defense side.
-MI-

[Grits]

Originally posted by FALCONWING
im not quitting...BoPs will adapt...we always have..

I'm glad to hear that (seriously). With respect though, that should have been your attitude from the begining. If you guys are a tight as you say, and I have no reason to doubt you, you will find ways to get the squad together.

[Ack-Ack]

There's a reason why MMO games always put "game play may change without notice" in their EULA.  

For those of you that are huffing and puffing trying to blow the house down while crying the sky is falling and quit AH, can I have your stuff?  Figure I can sell all the knock off flight gear on eBay for some beer money.


ack-ack

[Mugzeee]

Originally posted by Grits
I'm glad to hear that (seriously). With respect though, that should have been your attitude from the begining. If you guys are a tight as you say, and I have no reason to doubt you, you will find ways to get the squad together.

  Actually i havent read that Falc was quiting anywhere.

Originally posted by FALCONWING
Well i have stayed off the boards for about 4 days and the same guys are insulting in here..let me address some concepts here....


1)  Hordes are "safety nets"

Large squads are not safety nets...they are groups of guys who like each other and like to hang out...flying with a purpose is not a bad thing..in fact it adds to some folks' gameplay.

2)  Furballing is superior to basetaking

Im sorry but neither are great or realistic...they are both arcade...no ww2 fiter pilot lived if he insisted on slow turnfiting multiple enemy aircraft...and i dont know of any air force base capture mission ever.  so both are artificial non-historical ways to have fun.   i.e. noone wins this argument...even if you type longer or insult better...they are both gamey and there are tricks to both that can be easily taught and used.

3) your just mad because you can't fly the la7

Here is the secret from playing long before there were la7s....THERE IS ALWAYS A BETTER PLANE....and that better plane will always be denigrated for being better and frustrating others....already in EW arena you can see this and the NEW insults...HOicane...Picking 190a5...Porking ju88's...in airwarrior with a similar planes set there were constant insults between "B-n-Zers" and "Turnfiters"...

so what i boils down too for me is this...i play to hang out with my friends (many guys i have flown with for over 4 years)...i have known more about their day to day lives then i have some of my real life friends...hell we have had 3 members die and that was hard as well...

my squad has grown large not by design but by the fact that we laugh and joke and goof around and dont take ourselves too seriously..but mainly because we sincerely like each other...Hitech created this large arena concept..we just grew within it.

But on Sept 13th the game completely changed...i compare it to playing everquest and havign it switched to world of warcraft...my main reason for flying as much as i did has been compromised.  That is why i am angry..i could care less if they did away with base takes or la7s...im upset because they created a barrier to seeing all my friends...i think anyone even in smaller squads knows what i mean...

I have flown less in the last week then i have flown in 9 years...and that was not a purposeful statement on my part..its a sincere lack of interest...what made this game great was the comraderie...this game will never and can never compete with xbox graphics or stand alone RPGs...what it does offer is the opportunity for true friendships.

Originally posted by FALCONWING
kite777 (6 years together)
bushlt
fungi987 (3 years)
hotdogmn (3+ years)
shubie      (3+ years)
thundregg
flaydone
airjer      (since awc)
camador
solar10
mctoast
viper215  (too long)
sullie
banshee  (since my first day in air warrior classic) was ban69
usranger
red420
reverand
pops949
rain000
flyy            (since awc rre4 circa 1995)
tcfkas
gary6
mailbox
talonII
POW        (. 3years)
choperen
badcarma
JollyFe
Goaly
99mecinf
UFO
Beagle
2old2fly
Monti       (since awc as well)
Jpeg
Ink
Locochal
Donzo
Cablemender
Bayonet
Worid1
waldo

okay im sure i left otu a bunch but wanted to do this quickly

Originally posted by FALCONWING
oops forgot dog398 who is also slycer

beagle if if orgot him onother list

also some new bops i forgot would be gghost and phenom

jpeg too if i forgot him
thrila..miss spork...but he has been MIA


Want to do this with how many bishops i can name?

Originally posted by FALCONWING
HITECH:  boy are you insulting...not even to me really

I can assure any BoPs whose CPID i didnt name in the 2 minutes i had to respond quickly after HT challenge that i value their friendship as well....

A little secret for hitech before he breaks his arm slapping himself on the back....about 30 names on the roster have not been active for several months and about 10 are guys who changed cpids and rejoined under their new ones.  There are also about 5 guys who are brand new to the squad since the arena split and i didnt know to name them (dstyve for example)  I am actually closer to 80% in the number of names i produced of BoPs.

I wonder how many players who dont post on the BBS YOU could have named HITECH???  (no looking at your income tables first please)

Well played sir Hitech..you confirm that the community is the last thing you care about...i hope your pursuit of what is financially most rewarding brings you the success you need...

Mugz and simaril and others...thank you for understanding what BoPs under my leadership tried to provide...i have felt i kept many folks in the game who would have left and trained many fantastic pilots who continue to help others.  (would the BKs please let me know which newbies they have trained recently?)  There are so many x-bops still in the game who are awesome peeps..some running great squads modeled after the fun we have...

All good things have to end however...i think insulting my devotion to friendship has been a shock to me...i never asked for recognition...but similarly i never expected derision.

Originally posted by FALCONWING
Are you serious waffle?  I thought the turkey farm comment was curious...but that would be hard to swallow:confused:

Originally posted by FALCONWING
sorry stang...you know i love you!!!

guess being confronted by hitech when he lets your squaddies spew venom right and left got me flustered...

Originally posted by FALCONWING
oh and a quick note...i am not planning on quitting...

i may get banned but im not quitting...BoPs will adapt...we always have..

Logged on to main arena to "did you hear Falc quit?"  from nonsquad guys...

"Reports of my demise have been greatly exaggerated"

Yep...im sure of it.

Hubs. Maybe if you spent less time trying to be provoking, insulting, flame baiting, flame trolling and ridiculing. You might actually be an asset to the issues at hand.

I for one wish you would just shut your keyboard/mouth if all you can do is  provoke people to anger.

It is very obvious that you have nothing more to offer on the subject than an attempt to get a rise out of anyone that you can.


 A "Glad to hear it Falcn" woulda done nicely.