Author Topic: Changes to come.  (Read 37069 times)

Offline hubsonfire

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« Reply #435 on: December 12, 2006, 03:27:35 PM »
Look through some of Warchief's posts from September on. I get the impression that he thinks HTC is really trying to force all squads to disband and quit. At least that's the point of his posts for the last few months.
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Offline Masherbrum

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« Reply #436 on: December 12, 2006, 03:29:32 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by hubsonfire
Look through some of Warchief's posts from September on. I get the impression that he thinks HTC is really trying to force all squads to disband and quit. At least that's the point of his posts for the last few months.


I noticed that.  But, "we're the whiners" and the "evil empire that has started the demise of AH Skuads":noid
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Offline Warchief

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« Reply #437 on: December 12, 2006, 03:30:53 PM »
Edbert dont fly under the ID Warchief anymore look up Chief31.

As far the other points go.
So as far as the squad goes. If my squad my country is flying for is getting the rook or knits butts. The rooks and knit log off because they are losing and try to log in I must fight my own squaddies and friends. As stated before how about stopping people from Logging off because they are losing. Which seems to be the newest tactic. Well were losing time to log off in mass and wait for them to logg due to ENY pissing them off then we can come back when we have the numbers to win.

Airscrew most other games have a spawn delay system depending on the amoung of people on at a time. But it is rare to see a game tell who or what you can do as far as logging into an arena.

Offline KTM520guy

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« Reply #438 on: December 12, 2006, 03:32:31 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by SkyRock
Don't think the side balancing changes had kicked in as of tonight, at least in LWblue.  Bish 129, Knights 119, and rooks 80! :aok
 I got my 40 kills over 7 sorties though! :D



If all sides were equal the bish would get totally slammed. It takes 3 bish to equal 1 rook. Even at the above numbers the bish have the short end of the stick.
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Offline Donzo

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« Reply #439 on: December 12, 2006, 03:33:21 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by hitech
john9001:  

Do not believe I have ever said that.

What I have said is more along the lines of it is not a simulation of WWII.

HiTech



Maybe it's a simulation of what WWIII might be like should that ever happen.



Question:
Let's say that the objective of having balanced sides is achieved (numberwise).  Would next step be to evaluate the skill level of each side and rearrange people dynamically to make it more fair?

Offline Airscrew

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« Reply #440 on: December 12, 2006, 03:39:49 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Warchief
Airscrew most other games have a spawn delay system depending on the amoung of people on at a time. But it is rare to see a game tell who or what you can do as far as logging into an arena.

Yep they sure do,  so theres an idea for ya.  Next time you die, you set in the lobby and wait for a fellow country man to die before you can rejoin the game :aok  oh but you're about the 5 guy in line so it might be a few minutes, :t   In the meantime, here you can watch everybody else play...

Offline Warchief

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« Reply #441 on: December 12, 2006, 03:41:40 PM »
Well Hubsonfire that is some of the post made not all of them.

But the reason I think is that seems to where this is all going. First the arena splits that limit the amount of people can fly in them. Well your squad is in this arean and sinc eit is full you cant fly with them. And that is being more re-enforced with the latest changes. OD I think HiTech is delibrately setting out to kill squads? NO!! But I do think that will be the end results. Squads and Guild or whatever you may call them are a group of people who fly for this or that side. Now you cant do that as much as you would before.

I have been flying since AH1 days. At first I hated all the changes made. But then sat back and said ok I see HiTechs point but it really doesnt effect my gameplay or who I can fly with with the exception to ENY. Then this is thrown into it. Cant fly with my squaddies because the Bish as this many people and unless I want to fly as I want I have to switch countrys. Sorry nto me. I am a loyal to a chess piece? Nope think again. Then why dont I switch sides. I have flown with Bish since I came into AH. Join the 31st FG and have been a mainstay of the Bish side. Hvae lots of friends there and just dont want to fly with rook or knits dont see the point in switching all the time.

One other thing I forgot. ANother reason for the imbalance is this. When one side is winning not only do people logg off because they dont want to lose some will switch sides so they cant say look mommy I won or get those ever precious perks. And that is why I dont switch sides. If the Bish win they win. If the Bish lose they lose. I take the wins with the loses.

Offline Masherbrum

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« Reply #442 on: December 12, 2006, 03:42:16 PM »
See Rule #4 (please refrain from the personal attacks)
« Last Edit: December 12, 2006, 03:46:16 PM by Skuzzy »
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Offline Kweassa

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« Reply #443 on: December 12, 2006, 03:42:42 PM »
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OK I didnt read the rest of the post on this topic. Half are kissing HiTech rear-end to the point of disbelieve the other half not liking the changes,


 For someone who didn't read the stuff, you sure are hasty to arrive to a conclusion that all yay-sayers are a bunch of prettythang-kissers. As if we didn't have our own reasons, right?



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HiTech I am going to put this to you straight and forwartd. Dont call theses changes call them the death of squads changes. Instead of people forming squads as one of your selling points in your TV commercials it should say you can form a squad but cant fly with them when you want to.


 Squads are a part of the game - it is subject to change with the game if the game itself ever changes. Being in a large squad and having one's own identity as a part of a bigger group can be fun, but that doesn't make any squad's opinion entitled to more than any of what the individual, lone gamer has to say about it. Originally the squads started out small, a way of people of common interest to group together to make the game more enjoyable, not to become the leviathan of an entity it has become that hampers and objects every change to the game in regards to its own interest.



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As far as the balance issue. Well when you created mutliple arenas YOU opened a can of worms. Now when people are getting the butts handed to them they switch areans which in turn cause the side imbalance.


 Flawed analogy.

 The imbalance in numbers is due to a low arena cap vs. the high demand. Why the demand is so high for the Late-era arena is pretty much evident and obvious, so I won't discuss it any further unless required to do so.



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So are you going to make changes so people who are losing have to face and deal with that fact instead of logging off. Come on you can do it. You already taken away our ability to fly with squaddies and friends and restriced as form flying in the arena of our choice.


 Just how important it is to fly with people you'll probably never meet offline is not so clear to me. But this sense of friendship and loyalty can be only permitted as far as it doesn't disrupt the fun for other people. Unfortunately, the recent tendencies of the MA has led HT to certain measures which were highly unpopular to the gigantic squads.

 When changes happen, not all of it happens for the better for everyone. However, if it will ultimately benefit more people, instead of just making only the mega squads happy, is that not a good thing?



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I am sick of hearing the same lame answers. If we dont like the changes then yes we could leave. But if you didnt like the game before you should have left along time ago.


 I'm sure the others are as much sick of giving answers to lame questions.



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Hitech I went form enjoying the gameplay and having fun to sitting here waiting to fly with squaddies in an arena to be told you cant fly with your squad because I dont think it is fair you outnumber the other guys. Well HiTech stated once more take away peoples choice of logging off because they dont want to lose.


 Just what is this with the squads anyway? Is every member blood-related? Is having to change sides or move to other arenas really such a bad thing? Does your relationship with other gamers exist only exclusively with squad members alone?

 Just what the heck is this implied "loyalty" to a non-real, fantasy organization within a game?



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s Far as people complaining about the Horde. The funny part is you watch one side complain about the horde whilt he people complaining about it are attacking the same country the horde is. The Horde is easy to stop. Shot em down and pork there fields. Bingo Horde Stopped.


 The point is to make the horde fight the horde. Stop the horde by crushing them with comparable number of forces. Fight the other guy and beat him down to achieve what you want.

 However, the old MA was unable to do that. Mobilization and deployment followed a chaotic pattern of whim. People flock to their friends while avoiding the enemies. Gaining grounds in territorial combat, trying to "win" without fighting any of the actual threats.

 Now, if this was a real-war, that would be something worthy of praise. "Winning the war without fighting" - Sun Tzu's ultimate ideal. However, in retrospect, this is also a game. A format of competition. Therefore, people should contend in the air, and must actually fight each other before any amount of victory is achieved, instead of finding some nefarious method of marching into unprotected enemy lands like the Armageddon locust.

 If AH2 gave the impression that creating the horde and just barging into a one gigantic milk-run was something to be considered "fun", then I believe that is clearly not what HT had in mind - therefore, he is changing it.



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Yes I know dont let my rear end hit the door on the way out. But the sad part of this HiTech and Skuzzy. You are giving up on a Customer Base that has kept you in Business for years and you turned your back on them. Truely Sad. I can leave with the changes made before these. But even these are making me wonder if you had a nervous breakdown or are listneing to people who need to be lined up and shot for there stupidity.


 Then are those who object to your opinions and support HT's idea not also a customer base? What are we then, chopped liver? What of the numerous number of veterans who have become sick and tired of the mindless land-grabbing hordes, disappointed at how degenrate the MA has become?

 In a sense, AH is trying to go back to its origins without shrinking the game to the small community it was. There are bound to be changes, some good, some bad. Some will work, others will fail, and this cycle will go on until HT finally comes up with a new paradigm to work with the MA. Getting worked up on every change along the way is not gonna help anyone.



ps) The grand irony of all this is that I'm not even a furball guy. I'm a squad-oriented, strat/tactics lovin', roleplaying geek who wants to see the MA run according to realistic warring conditions such as economy, logistics, and attrition rates.

 However, despite all that there is no justifying the old MA and how it was. It was neither strategic nor tactical. It deprived the very essence of air combat, and motivated the dweebs to a gigantic land-grab competition by every horde storming into each other's empty back yard.

 I like strat and I like cooperation. But that doesn't mean I can't tell the difference between active tactical cooperation and instinctive animal herds. There's a clear line of difference between people who organize themselves to win a war, and sheep who flock to each other to avoid the wolves.

 Anyone who calls that stampede of sheep "cooperation" is clearly out of his mind, because that ain't no "cooperation".
« Last Edit: December 12, 2006, 03:56:52 PM by Kweassa »

Offline Donzo

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« Reply #444 on: December 12, 2006, 03:46:07 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Masherbrum
[BNow you're gonna whine about "not being able to fly with your squad"?   I call BS on every point you bring to the table.   [/B]



What is wrong with wanting to fly with your squad?

Offline Kweassa

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« Reply #445 on: December 12, 2006, 04:01:05 PM »
Quote
What is wrong with wanting to fly with your squad?


 Nothing - as long as the loyalty towards the "squad" does not outweigh the balance of numbers, to make the game enjoyable for everyone in the arena, not just the squadsfolk in the largest numbering country.

 However, if being a part of a fantasy country and fantasy squad is more important than stopping the game from becoming a lop-sided gangbang, then there's something wrong with that.

Offline MachNix

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« Reply #446 on: December 12, 2006, 04:14:30 PM »
Hitech,

I don’t think balancing number is going to get you what you are looking for.  There are basically three types of players: the Gamer who sees Aces High as a combat simulator; the War-Fighter who sees Aces High as a war simulator; and the Newbie who doesn’t know what Aces High is about.

The Gamer generally doesn’t care about the strategic elements of the game, likes to fight one-on-one, and does not have any deep loyalty to a country.  He flies alone even when flying in a group of others.  He may give and expect check-six calls but does not apply any team tactics.  Kills are nice but out-flying the opponent is more important.  Gamers can usually handle a War-Fighter one-on-one.  Gamers generally don’t capture bases but will at times put an ad-hoc mission together.

The War-Fighter enjoys the strategic elements of the game, expects the fights to be many-on-many, and can be fiercely loyal to a country and squad.  Always flies as a team or in support of a goal even when flying a single-ship mission.  War-Fighters will corner and kill Gamers.  Some War-Fighters are pure fighter types that wing up with others to gain air superiority in a sector. (It is not always about the capture.)  Since the War-Fighters are generally the ones capturing the bases, they alter the look of the map, and thus have the greatest impact on the game.

The Newbie basically doesn’t know what he wants to be when he grows up.  He is not sure what to do or even what is possible.  He will follow a group of dots that look like they are going somewhere.  Usually the group of dots is War-Fighters and the newbies makes the group looks like a horde.  The Newbie will at times bomb the base after it has been captured.  He is usually meat on the plate for both Gamers and War-Fighters and is generally left to learn the game on his own.

Even if you are able to get the numbers to balance, there is no guarantee that you will have an even mix of individuals.  I have been frustrated when I see my country has numbers but is losing fields on every front.  The other countries have War-Fighters that are organized and they are kicking our unorganized horde right off the map.  I would think the War-Fighter is who you should want playing your game.  They are the ones that are trying to use the elements you engineered in the game to their fullest.  And yet the changes you have been making only inhibit/hurt the War-Fighters.  You really want to convert the Newbies and Gamers into War-Fighters.  But how?  

Get some of your CM Staff into the country with the low numbers, put some missions together and get the 50 or so individuals organized.  Joining a mission is of course optional but the Gamer just might see the advantages of winging with someone else.  The War-Fighters would join if not already doing their own thing.  And the Newbies would join (once they are shown how to join a mission) so they can be part of something and learn the game.  Whole squads might even join.  But these missions can’t be the usual amateuristic, brute-strength-and-awkwardness missions.  These missions need to be put together by professionals who can incorporate all the aspects – fighters, bombers, GVs, etc. – into them so there is something for everyone.

I guarantee* that if you, Hitec, put up a mission, people would jump countries to join.

MachNix

*Void where prohibited.  Discontinue use if a rash develops.  Not responsible for lost or stolen items.

Offline Donzo

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« Reply #447 on: December 12, 2006, 04:18:07 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Kweassa
Nothing - as long as the loyalty towards the "squad" does not outweigh the balance of numbers, to make the game enjoyable for everyone in the arena, not just the squadsfolk in the largest numbering country.

 However, if being a part of a fantasy country and fantasy squad is more important than stopping the game from becoming a lop-sided gangbang, then there's something wrong with that.


I understand and respect your response.  But I now do not have the choice to fly with my squad when I want to if they are all in a country that has superior numbers.  The only choice I have at that point is to wait or go do something else.  Either way I am not permitted to fly with my squad.  Just a point.

Offline JB88

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« Reply #448 on: December 12, 2006, 04:19:59 PM »
i am giving HTC a free two week trial starting today.

if they like my participation and subscription they can keep it.  if they don't, they are under no obligation to continue on with it and ill just have to be happy to take my 180 clams a year and go elsewhere.  i am a person of my word so i will do it.

see, i just want to fly.  i love the game, i love all of you guys.  (except ball, hes a poof and i wouldnt want to give him the wrong idea about things) but i am afraid that i am just at the point of frustration over these constant changes and stresses that are getting put on the arenas.  

should i support a company that feels that it is OKAY to serve me a product that i did not buy rather than the one that i actually did.

(and yes, yes, i know, there are those of you who will say "what a whiner."...but hey, sorry, but i don't like paying for a product and having it suddenly change...so sue me. its my dime...and yes, it is yours too.)

logged on today at lunch.  had a half hour to fly.  got stuck in a que (in the only arena that had any people in it).  i logged off and made up my mind right then and there.  

no more beta testing or no more me.  

i am assuming that this post will be deleted like my thread on the subject and that i may even get banned for saying this, but it is the truth as i see it and it is how many of us feel and if you feel that you need to delete this than you may as well delete my subscription and then proceed to delete everyone elses who actually cares enough to tell you that enough is enough.


why not just make a new game and let people choose to get into it rather than this constant irritation?...why not just create another generation?

in this birds opinion the old way was far better than the "gee what are the rules today?" approach that we have now.  

ive had enough.


all

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word.

Offline Oldman731

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« Reply #449 on: December 12, 2006, 04:20:23 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by MachNix
Since the War-Fighters are generally the ones capturing the bases, they alter the look of the map, and thus have the greatest impact on the game.

Was very much with you up until this point.  But I see no correlation between altering the look of the map and having the greatest impact on the game.  In fact, I would go so far as to say that one of the greatest negative impacts on the game is caused  by the War-Fighters swarming to capture bases.

Was a great explanation of different styles up until that point, though!

- oldman