190 blackouts...

[cav58d]

Well this is applicable for all aircraft, but the 190 series really sticks out.  How many times have you been behind someone, about to move in for a kill, and they stick stir. (Pull back on stick, full aileron and rudder deflection in same direction).  Some of these insane spins, snaprolls, whatever you want to call them would be damn near impossible to recover from in RL, yet in here guys can just fly away.

How about adding a disorientation effect, or making the pilot immediately black out when he pulls one of these BS maneuvers?

[Bronk]

Originally posted by cav58d
Well this is applicable for all aircraft, but the 190 series really sticks out.  How many times have you been behind someone, about to move in for a kill, and they stick stir. (Pull back on stick, full aileron and rudder deflection in same direction).  Some of these insane spins, snaprolls, whatever you want to call them would be damn near impossible to recover from in RL, yet in here guys can just fly away.

How about adding a disorientation effect, or making the pilot immediately black out when he pulls one of these BS maneuvers?

Ermmm

Cav no need to use aileron.
Mash full left rudder pull back on stick.
Its called snap roll.

I don't think it's bs, desperate,but not bs. All thats need to get out of it is opposite stick and rudder input.

Bronk

[Krusty]

I see it a lot on p51s for some reason. That and negative-G outside barrel roll bs.

It gets very annoying. I open fire earlier now, helps cut down on it. I've also seen it so much I can still estimate where to shoot and hit them while they do this. Sometimes.

[cav58d]

Fine...Maybe the maneuver is easy to recover from, but the pilot disorientation isn't unless your sean tucker.

[Kweassa]

Fine...Maybe the maneuver is easy to recover from, but the pilot disorientation isn't unless your sean tucker.

 Works both ways cav.

 What about the insane amount of Gs some of the pilots pull? They rocket down from directly above your head 5k high, reaching 500mph, squirt a few rounds, and then pull stick on the border of blackout, maintaining 5Gs for many seconds and then rinse and repeat. Spitfires entering a high speed chase, with the pilot pulling 3G to left, changing 4G to right, entering -3G maneuvering and then pulling back for +5Gs again and again and again ad nauseum.

 So if pilot fatigue ro disorientation in maneuvering should be done, then it should be done to all planes at a same rate.  Currently, all our AH pilots are the ideal superman, can pull up to 50pounds stick pressure at any given length of time, with any amount of frequency, on and on and on. Now imagine that's gone suddenly.

 That would not only cut down on the numbers of the stick stirring folk, but it will also impact a lot of the planes in a very fundamental way.

 Personally, I'm all for it. But you might get to hear a lot of whine on how the Spits or Las or Nikis can't maneuver anymore, because their pilots get to tired while pullig high-G turns.

[cav58d]

I guess its a double edged sword.

Another new arena for another day, right.

[Saxman]

Actually, snaprolls are pretty nice for evading the HO, and not as a desperation move, either.

[bozon]

Originally posted by Krusty
I see it a lot on p51s for some reason. That and negative-G outside barrel roll bs.

Implement the dust and rubbish from the cockpit floor floating up into their eyes.

[Debonair]

Originally posted by cav58d
Fine...Maybe the maneuver is easy to recover from, but the pilot disorientation isn't unless your sean tucker.

i'd have to wager trained combat pilots got more aerobatic & upset recovery practice than the lazy8s & chandelles you did for your CPL.  
in all the books i've read by pilots nowhere have i seen "after those two evasive manuvers, i was ready for a nap"

[Oleg]

Originally posted by cav58d
Well this is applicable for all aircraft, but the 190 series really sticks out.  How many times have you been behind someone, about to move in for a kill, and they stick stir. (Pull back on stick, full aileron and rudder deflection in same direction).  Some of these insane spins, snaprolls, whatever you want to call them would be damn near impossible to recover from in RL, yet in here guys can just fly away.

Dont played in Warbirds, didnt you? Image 190 with worst connection you ever see stirring his stick like mad and you will know how regular 190 with good connection flew in Warbirds. I mean, AH network code is quite good.

But i tend to agree, some improvements in stirring prevention would be welcome. It becomes far more common practice than before.

[Old Sport]

Originally posted by Debonair
i'd have to wager trained combat pilots got more aerobatic & upset recovery practice than the lazy8s & chandelles you did for your CPL.  
in all the books i've read by pilots nowhere have i seen "after those two evasive manuvers, i was ready for a nap"

Factor in also that if they lose they die and there is further motivation to struggle beyond the normal limits of an aerobatic pilot. Adrenaline can do wonders. But there are stories of exhausted pilots having to be helped out of the cockpit after missions.

[Charge]

What does it mean "190 blackouts"? Are the stick stirrers a special problem to you when flying a 190 or what? Stick stirrers in 190s maybe?

-C+

[DblTrubl]

Any plane with a sufficiently high roll rate can look warpy to an adversary when it (the high roll rate) is used to maximum. 190s have the highest roll rate through a pretty wide speed range so these are the ones that get noticed the most. You don't have to "stick stir" for this to happen.

[Bronk]

Originally posted by Kweassa
Works both ways cav.

 What about the insane amount of Gs some of the pilots pull? They rocket down from directly above your head 5k high, reaching 500mph, squirt a few rounds, and then pull stick on the border of blackout, maintaining 5Gs for many seconds and then rinse and repeat. Spitfires entering a high speed chase, with the pilot pulling 3G to left, changing 4G to right, entering -3G maneuvering and then pulling back for +5Gs again and again and again ad nauseum.

 So if pilot fatigue ro disorientation in maneuvering should be done, then it should be done to all planes at a same rate.  Currently, all our AH pilots are the ideal superman, can pull up to 50pounds stick pressure at any given length of time, with any amount of frequency, on and on and on. Now imagine that's gone suddenly.

 That would not only cut down on the numbers of the stick stirring folk, but it will also impact a lot of the planes in a very fundamental way.

 Personally, I'm all for it. But you might get to hear a lot of whine on how the Spits or Las or Nikis can't maneuver anymore, because their pilots get to tired while pullig high-G turns.

I have found once you enter black out conditions a few times in a fight.  They start happening with less g and last longer.
So I'll say fatigue is modeled in, to some extent.

Bronk

[Tilt]

Factor in the circumstances of high rate of change of G? not only positive to negative but side to side.

How about POV buffet

If G increases faster than (eg) 1 g per sec then the POV head point moves to the extreme of that point..............roll left and the POV hits the right window........ roll right and the POV hits the left window...........

Upon impact stars appear before pilots eyes and these fade after 3 secs when the POV returns to normal......................