Editorial... (or not)

[Hornet33]

Originally posted by shamroc
The Ar234 is only a hangar queen because the bombsite is broken.

No it's not, but maybe the pilot is.

[Kurt]

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
Just because you need a late war plane to survive in the LWA, doesn't mean everyone needs to fly a late war bird to survive in the LWA.


ack-ack

My favorite part of this thread has been how since I disagree about the P39 I am a uber plane flying LW N00b.  Who doesn't do scenarios etc.

The assumptions that get tossed around in here are never ending entertainment.

I've been here since 2002, I have participated actively in FSO ever since I first subscribed, and I primarily fly (heaven forfend) the Spit9 - which is a 1940 airframe with a 1942 engine... A good plane no doubt, but Uber??  Come now, lets un-wad our panties girls.

Anyhow, I want to thank the few people who gave a straight answer rather than an obcessive rant, its been a wonderful read and I've been happy I could stir you guys up so much..

Now if you'll excuse me, I need to eat dinner and get ready for FSO which I don't know anything about and what-not.

[bj229r]

Originally posted by Widewing
The P-39Q was about 30 mph faster than the P-40E (385 vs 355) at best altitude. It also has a lower drag coefficient than any fighter, save the P-51. That means it will hold E very well. With 1,420 hp available in WEP at sea level, its power loading is lowest of all US fighters (5.5 lb/hp). That should equate to very good acceleration. Based upon its lift coefficient and wing loading, I calculate turning ability to be somewhere in between the FM-2 and F6F-5.

If we end up getting the P-39Q (probably with the P-39D too), I believe that it will more than hold its own the the late war arenas.

Either way, I'm the type who goes hunting La-7s and Mustangs with a TBM or Boston III. Flying the P-39 will be a luxury.

My regards,

Widewing

Then why was it meat for Jap planes? Alt limitations?

[Rollins]

Originally posted by Kurt
That wasn't a question.

Sticking a question mark on the end of a sentence doesn't automatically make it a question.

 

Uuhhh...yes it does.

[Kurt]

Originally posted by EndofSilence
Uuhhh...yes it does.

Uh, no, it doesn't.

If there is no query to answer, then it is not a question.  It's subtle, yes?

If we fritter and waste our lives answering every time there is a question mark rather than waiting for someone to ask a substantive question, then what do we have?

I would rather get the clarification, but if you prefer to go off half-cocked, hey, I'm not your mom?

[Soulyss]

Originally posted by bj229r
Then why was it meat for Jap planes? Alt limitations?

I think a combination of factors have given the P39 a bad reputation.  Part of the problem was situational the other was probably tactics.  In the early part of the war most the fighter groups were flying defensive sorties, with primitive or no radar gave precious little time for the fighters to scramble to intercept.  Rate of climb combined with no superchargers in the engines made it very difficult for the P39's to reach altitude before they were pounced on my the Zero escorts.  The USAAF was also coming to grips with the Zero at this point in the war and other than knowing that they were generally outclassed in performance there wasn't any sort of doctrine to deal with it (like the navy's thach weave).  Later when the allies started mounting more and more offensive operations the short range of the P-39 was a real limiting factor in the pacific theater.

[Widewing]

Originally posted by bj229r
Then why was it meat for Jap planes? Alt limitations?

Several factors were present.

First, only a handful of P-39s were available during the Guadalcanal campaign. These were mostly D models. The balance were P-400 export versions, which had no oxygen equipment. The biggest issue was that they simply could not get up to the Japanese bombers. When they tried, they were bounced by the enemy fighters. Down low, with their superior speed, the P-39s were more than a match for the Zeros and Oscars. Provided that is, they adhered to the doctrine of avoiding turning with the enemy.

Later, around Port Moresby, the P-39s were largely confined to ground support and short range patrols. Their range was insufficient to take the war to the Japanese. However, they performed well against the Japanese raids when they could reach the enemy. All of the Airacobra squadrons were hoping to get into P-38s as the P-39s were not offering much air combat. Eventually, they all received the Lightning.

In North Africa and Italy, the P-39s did an excellent job supporting the ground forces and held their own against the Luftwaffe.

The P-39Q was a significantly better fighter than the D models and the P-400s.

My regards,

Widewing

[Zanth]

Maybe I am alone in this, but I think we should get them all.  

I wouldn't mind the new mission oriented game being put off a year or two if we could get back to receiving new planes in this game on a regular basis - whatever models they might be.

So we only getting one, at least it is a start.  The P39 was fun enough in Warbirds, so I can't see any reason why it wouldn't be fun in AH too.  (The B25, if it arrives, won't do what some people think it will.  That big cannon sound interesting, but this game has a much more effective anti-air vehicle and air field defenses.)

[macleod01]

Originally posted by Guppy35
Seems to me i see guys flying P40s in latewar, or 109Fs, Zekes or what have you.

Heck, Ive been ho'ed by 109e, turnfought with a Hurri1 and been BNZed by a spit1!

But I agree with the other Sentiments. Why is it only Late war!? Just saying 'Ive been HO'ed by a 109E' shows that Early war planes feature in the LWA. Lets not JUST add LW planes. I haven't voted for the 39, simply because I dont want it and Im pretty sure its going to get in without my vote, but I agree with the statement that it wont be a hanger queen. It will still get kills, probarbly a lot because will underestimate it, as you so kindly have shown. If its not going to revolutionise the LW, kindly tell me why we have such planes as the Zeke, 109E, Hurri 1, Spitty 1, 88's Heck, the list could go on! Because their major planes in WW2? So? They dont revolutonise the LW, so we dont need them! Im a EW pilot in lw, and I can tell you, they ALL do very well in that arena. The 39 will win plenty of fights it gets into. Lets not nock and underdog. And as Rocky Balboa showed, everybody loves an Underdog!

Also Kurt, Humble is one of the most informed pilots I know (Granted I dont know ALL the pilots here, but I know a fare few). I would Value his opinion and notes rather than just nock them aside.

[Rollins]

Kurt, not gonna hijack this thread so I'll post up a grammar thread later in the O Club and we can discuss how a question mark works.  (Over a glass of Sudzu)

[Lunger]

Originally posted by humble
tell ya what, once we have the P-39 you feel free to bring whatever you feel like and look for the folks in the p-39's. Once you get your clock cleaned a few times you'll feel better.

I cant wait to see how many people abandon this thought when their stats fall through the floor. Its just a matter of, how long will their pride keep getting them killed in a P39 before they admit they made a mistake, and wasted a vote.

[Bronk]

Originally posted by Lunger
I cant wait to see how many people abandon this thought when their stats fall through the floor. Its just a matter of, how long will their pride keep getting them killed in a P39 before they admit they made a mistake, and wasted a vote.

The people who get kills in the 205, fm2, ect.. ect.
Will get kills in the P-39, it's the pilot not the plane.

Bronk

[culero]

Originally posted by Kurt
snip
Why did you steal our chance to add a good M.A. plane to the game?

[eskimo2]

Originally posted by Lunger
I cant wait to see how many people abandon this thought when their stats fall through the floor. Its just a matter of, how long will their pride keep getting them killed in a P39 before they admit they made a mistake, and wasted a vote.

Yea, you�re right.  We should have voted in a good plane!
We should have voted in the P-51.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the Me-109.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the A6M.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the F4U.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the Spitfire.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the B-17.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the FW-190.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the P-147.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the P-47.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the B-26.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the LA-7.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the Lancaster.  Well, then we should have voted in the Yak-9.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the P-38.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the Me-262.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the Hurricane.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the Ju-88.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the Typhoon.  Oh wait, we already have that.  We should have voted in the C 205.  Well, then we should have voted in the A-20.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the SBD.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the N1K.  Oh wait, we already have that.  Well, then we should have voted in the LA-5.  Oh wait, we already have that.

[Lunger]

Originally posted by Bronk
The people who get kills in the 205, fm2, ect.. ect.
Will get kills in the P-39, it's the pilot not the plane.

Bronk

 Dont get me wrong, I enjoy early war planes. However the time frame it was used has no bearing in its calibur. I fly the P-40 more in the LWA more than most I know but that means little in the case of the P39. I'm not debating its ability in the war, I am debating its usefullness in the LWA. It will go the way of the Spit I.
 The P39 will have a place in the EWA and the FSO. I just tend to agree with those who would liked to have seen a more usefull plane added to the game.