Originally posted by Viking
That’s a fallacy my friend as the purpose of these threads of yours is to test the actual environment we will be playing in CT. The Allied fighters should be tested at 75% fuel or more (most allied fighters were still flying on drop tanks over Germany), and the LW at 50% without drop tanks, and 75% or more if drop tanks have been used.
Another factor you’ve not taken into consideration is the 109K’s superiority at MIL power, and the 109 has twice the P-47’s WEP. At MIL power the 109 is faster than the 47N at 30K.
You stated, "If the ETO gets to 1945 the LW will have the 109K which outperforms the P-47N in all regimes of flight at and below 25k."
I responded by posting data that showed that this was untrue. I compared max performance based and eliminated a variable, thus establishing greater accuracy.
Had P-47Ns been deployed to the ETO, they could have flown from Britain to Berlin WITHOUT drop tanks and still have a 45 minute reserve. Being a 1945 fighter, they would have been based in eastern France or Belgium. Thus, they would rarely fly with more than 350 gallons (full internal fuel is 556 gallons). Therefore, I would argue that you would likely never encounter a P-47N with more than 50% fuel. Indeed, the P-47N could fly 1,700 miles on internal fuel, including warm-up, climb-out to 25k, cruise to target, 5 minutes in WEP, 15 minutes at MIL power, cruise back and still have 30 minutes of reserve fuel. It could fly over 400 miles on 25% fuel, or from Berlin to Manston. So, you could certainly encounter a P-47N over Germany with much less than 50% fuel.
As to speed, you are incorrect. The P-47N can attain 434 mph in MIL power at 30k. That's faster than the 109K can manage in WEP. At MIL power, the 109K can do 421 mph at 30k. Test both yourself, I have no corner on the testing market. Anyone with the software can confirm my data.
Oh, by the way, the P-47D-40 is also faster than the 109K using just MIL power (431 mph) and faster yet in WEP (436 mph) and with 50% fuel is its equal in climb rate up there. All of the P-47s are faster than the 109K at 30k.
If you wish, come to the TA one evening and we can compare the two in combat. You may be shocked to discover that the P-47D-40 actually has a smaller turn radius at 30k than the 109K (about dead equal to the 109G-6). Up that high, the 109K has no advantage in climb and is slightly slower. It falls way behind in acceleration as well. Plus, the P-47s can start getting flaps out at 400 mph.
Within the context of Combat Tour, I hope that the mission generator air spawns the Luftwaffe fighters high enough to allow them a reasonable chance to carry some speed into the fight. While the 109K-4 is reasonably competitive with the Allied fighters, the Dora is at best marginal (410 mph @ 30k, with a climb rate of just 1,050 fpm) and the rest of the 109s and 190s are outclassed in terms of speed. Without some altitude to trade for speed, the lesser fighters will be bounced continuously.
If you watched Wmaker's films, you saw that the P-47D was much faster than the 109G-6. To the extent that I could have simply BnZ'd the 109 all day. But, it was far more fun to follow the 109 down and mix it up. The Jug lost equality down low when it ran out of WEP.
Another interesting thing about combat at 25k to 30k is that a turn radius that measures 700 feet at sea level, exceeds 2,000 feet up high. Thus, you will not see the close dogfights you see on the deck. Up high, excess power is what ultimately determines agility.
My regards,
Widewing
