Author Topic: A US puppet govt wont be tolerated (Read 2279 times)

Elfie · « **Reply #15 on:** April 21, 2007, 08:32:26 PM »

That is reasonable in regards to the AK-47, not so sure about the T-72's and MiG's though

SirLoin · « **Reply #16 on:** April 21, 2007, 08:33:22 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Elfie
I fail to see how the US armed Saddam. When you look at the weapons his army used, AK-47's, T-72 tanks etc. (And the MiGs his Air Force used) it sure looks like the USSR armed him.

Once Saddamn started using chemical weapons against Iran, the whole world knew shortly thereafter.

The US supplied dozens of shipments of chemical weapons to "The Iraq Atomic Commision"..I think the mailing address is rather ironic don't you?..Within 4 years Iraq was the leader in WMD in the Middle East.

The US flew AWACS planes in the gulf to guide Iraqi warplanes for pinpoint strikes inside Iran.

At the same time Oliver North strikes a deal with the Iranians to swap hostages for weapons/supplies...In effect supplying weapons to both sides of the Iran/Iraq war.

Oliver North is tape recorded in a hotel room in Europe..saying to senior Iranian diplomats.."We want Iraq to be our #1 enemy"

Meanwhile irrefutable evidence surfaces that Iraq used chemical weapons on both the Kurds and the Iranians...Are the WMD chemical weapons shipments stopped?...No..They continued as well as other weapons shipments.

Did the US even look into the the reports of Saddam's use of WMD?

Nooooooo..it was totally ignored and swept under the rug until it became convenient to use this as a justification to invade under GWB's administration.

Elfie · « **Reply #17 on:** April 21, 2007, 08:36:49 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by SirLoin
The US supplied dozens of shipments of chemical weapons to "The Iraq Atomic Commision"..I think the mailing address is rather ironic don't you?

The US flew AWACS planes in the gulf to guide Iraqi warplanes for pinpoint strikes inside Iran.

At the same time Oliver North strikes a deal with the Iranians to swap hostages for weapons/supplies...In effect supplying weapons to both sides of the Iran/Iraq war.

Oliver North is tape recorded in a hotel room in Europe..saying to senior Iranian diplomats.."We want Iraq to be our #1 enemy"

Meanwhile irrefutable evidence surfaces that Iraq used chemical weapons on both the Kurds and the Iranians...Are the WMD chemical wapons shipments stopped?...No..They continued as well as other weapons shipments.

Did the US even look into the the reports of Saddam's use of WMD?

Nooooooo..it was totally ignored and swept under the rug until it became convenient to use this as a justification to invade under GWB's administration.

Show me links and proof that the US supplied chemical weapons. All I have seen is the sales of dual use chemicals that stopped immediately as soon as it was verified that Saddam was using chemical weapons.

SirLoin · « **Reply #18 on:** April 21, 2007, 08:42:58 PM »

http://traprockpeace.org/rieglereportexports.pdf

Here the the Senate report on the shippments..Note the chemicals were NOT attenuated in any way and were intended to help Iraq manufacture WMD.

john9001 · « **Reply #19 on:** April 21, 2007, 08:59:16 PM »

ohnoes, all canadian knos secret US plans to capture whole world and steal oil.

this US bashing gets sooo old.

Elfie · « **Reply #20 on:** April 21, 2007, 09:20:37 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by SirLoin
http://traprockpeace.org/rieglereportexports.pdf

Here the the Senate report on the shippments..Note the chemicals were NOT attenuated in any way and were intended to help Iraq manufacture WMD.

Those are all biological components no? I knew we shipped anthrax spores to Iraq for use in making vaccines and for research purposes. I didn't know the US shipped all those other biological components. I have to ask, how many of those biological agents are solely used in the production of biological weapons?

Also, I haven't heard any reports of bio weapons being used against Iran, only chemical munitions.

Slash27 · « **Reply #21 on:** April 21, 2007, 09:37:37 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by john9001

this US bashing gets sooo old.

Helps some of these people get through their day.

Elfie · « **Reply #22 on:** April 21, 2007, 09:49:52 PM »

I don't have time right now, but I will later this evening. Then I will look up each of those components in that report to see what uses each one has.

FrodeMk3 · « **Reply #23 on:** April 22, 2007, 02:14:34 AM »

I don't know if this will help, Elfie, but this was an interesting, and somewhat pertinent lead:

It doesn't give much insight to where it came from, but how much was made.http:///www.fas.org/nuke/guide/iraq/cw/program.htm

Dadano · « **Reply #24 on:** April 22, 2007, 02:28:47 AM »

Some info regarding our Country's foreign policy in the region.

A good audio interview with a US Ambassador under Regan, regarding the Kurdish Genocide.

Some info regarding the Kurdish genocide (played down by Regan, used by our current President.)

From Iran's perspective.

A great read by William Blum. Endorsed by Chomsky and Vidal. Highly recommended to anyone who wants to know anything about US foreign policy since WWII.

Interesting stuff!

Elfie · « **Reply #25 on:** April 22, 2007, 02:51:57 AM »

Well crud, I accidentally did a google search with this tab up and now have to start typing all over.

First let me say that I have never studied the field of bacteria, germs...whatever. So many of the terms used in that field I have no knowledge of and I don't have the time to look up every term I am unfamiliar with. As I go through the list in your link Sirloin I will be using the search term *uses of * and I will try to avoid using Wikipedia as a source whenever possible due to the recent scandal.

Feel free to explain and correct something that I err on due to my ignorance of a lot of the terms used in some of these sources.

Bacillus Anthracis - biological component. Uses, biological weapons and vaccines. I'm using Wikipedia as a source because it generally uses laymens terms and other references I've looked at back up what it says about weapon usage and usage for vaccines.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthrax

Clostridium Botulinum - biological component. Uses, biological weapons and medicines including treatment for over active muscles (muscle spasms).

http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/full/320/7228/161

Histoplasma Capsulatum - biological component. Uses, biological weapons and appears to be some sort of antibody research. Holy smokes on the terminology on this one!!

http://jcm.asm.org/cgi/content/full/37/7/2387

Brucella Melitensis - biological component. Uses, biological weapons, vaccine research.

http://iai.asm.org/cgi/content/abstract/67/11/5877

Clostridium Perfringens - biological component. This one is so far over my head.

I'm thinking it's safe to assume that it has some sort of use for biological weapons since it was included in your source. The only source I found that I even came close to being able to comprehend talked about some kind of research. Soooo I'm going with research as a dual use on this one. Added a Wikipedia source for readability, not much info there though.

http://mmbr.asm.org/cgi/content/abstract/55/4/621

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clostridium_perfringens

Esherichia Coli - biological component. biological weapons, vaccine and molecular microbiology research. Using Wikipedia again just because of laymen terms.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Escherichia_coli

Ustilago Nuda - biological component. Practically no free information on this one. Even online .pdf files need to be purchased.

continued...................

*edit* Don't reply yet!! Let me finish please.

Yeager · « **Reply #26 on:** April 22, 2007, 03:00:27 AM »

Didn't Socrates address this issue previously?

MrRiplEy[H] · « **Reply #27 on:** April 22, 2007, 03:37:51 AM »

And the saddest part is that when the politicians mess everything up down there, you the good regular folks of US have to suffer because of it.

I'm constantly dumbfounded by many peoples anti-american stance. It seems that your foreign policies have upset many people seriously and/or the local media has published anti-american articles much the same way how every other american now hates France due to the media pushing opinnions that way.

One example was 9/11 when I called everyone I knew to make sure they saw the happenings. One person I called was commenting like 'yeah good they deserve it, they had it coming for years' etc. I was screaming red-faced in the phone not believing what I heard. (The person was not finnish btw)

Granted the person changed her stance when she saw the tower collapse herself - but this showed some unimaginable hatred toward your countrymen. Are people so stupid not to see persons from nationality?

FrodeMk3 · « **Reply #28 on:** April 22, 2007, 03:41:56 AM »

Srry for the bad link guys:mad:

I'll try to get it right next time.

Elfie · « **Reply #29 on:** April 22, 2007, 03:42:29 AM »

Bacillus Subtilis - Biological component, uses biological weapons and pesticides.

http://www.epa.gov/pesticides/biopesticides/ingredients/factsheets/factsheet_006480.htm

Fransicella tularensis var. tularensis Olsufiev. Number 6 on your list, explanation given there but I'll repeat it here for those to lazy to view your source

. A virulent suitable for diagnostic antigens. Interesting, is also used in Japanese and Korean food production. It seems the biohazard associated with this one is contested.

From Wikipedia:

Quote

B. subtilis is used as a soil inoculant in horticulture and agriculture. B. subtilis has been used for a biowarfare simulant during Project SHAD (aka Project 112).[1] B. subtilis hazard status is under dispute.[2]

Enzymes produced by B. subtilis and B. licheniformis are widely used as additives in laundry detergents.

Its other uses include the following:
-a model organism for laboratory studies
-a strain of B. subtilis formerly known as Bacillus natto is used in the commercial production of the Japanese delicacy natto as well as the similar Korean food cheonggukjang
-B. subtilis strain QST 713 (marketed as QST 713 or Serenade™) has a natural fungicidal activity, and is employed as a biological control agent
-can convert nuclear waste and explosives into harmless compounds of nitrogen, carbon dioxide, and water
-plays a role in safe radionuclide waste [e.g. Thorium (IV) and Plutonium (IV)] disposal with the proton binding properties of its surfaces
-recombinants Bacillus subtilis str. pBE2C1 and Bacillus subtilis str. pBE2C1AB were used in production of polyhydroxyalkanoates (PHA) and that they could use malt waste as carbon source for lower cost of PHA production

Clostridium tetani - biological component. I guess you could use this as a biological weapon if the intent was to cause a slow painful death with Tetanus. Also used in the manufacture of vaccines. Wikipedia was the only *readable* source I could find in the limited amount of time I have.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clostridium_tetani

Clostridium Megaterium - Biological component, uses....I didn't even see a link for Wikipedia on this one. Very sparse information, however some of the information associated with the links brought up by google suggest research uses and industrial uses.

Brucella Abortus - Biological component. Uses, biological weapons and for making tests to determine the prescence of the bacteria. Giving a Wikipedia reference as well because it talks about the bio-weapons history of this bacteria.

http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=269028

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brucellosis

Saccharomyces Cerevesaie - This one is a yeast, briefly mentioned here as being used in research by a biochemist. Second link is also a source on it being used in research.

http://depts.washington.edu/biowww/faculty/teller.html

http://www.genome.org/cgi/content/full/7/12/1169

Continued, again, please let me finish.

*edit* whoops, I somehow managed to copy/paste the same information twice.