Author Topic: Republican Debate last night  (Read 2518 times)

Offline Chairboy

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Republican Debate last night
« Reply #60 on: May 16, 2007, 04:38:29 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by ink
im sorry, but the truth hurts.
Yes, an inside job involving 19 middle eastern folks with airplanes and funds.  

Regarding your conspiracy theories, kindly sell crazy somewhere else.  We're all stocked up here. :aok
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Offline bsdaddict

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« Reply #61 on: May 16, 2007, 04:50:50 PM »
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Originally posted by Gunthr
with all due respect bsaddict, what policy shift? - combined with immediately pulling out of Iraq - are you suggesting?  and what would it acomplish?

a shift towards the "non-interventionist foreign policy" RP espouses.  

Ron Paul said "Noninterventionism is not isolationism. Nonintervention simply means America does not interfere militarily, financially, or covertly in the internal affairs of other nations. It does not mean that we isolate ourselves; on the contrary, our founders advocated open trade, travel, communication, and diplomacy with other nations.  

Thomas Jefferson summed up the noninterventionist foreign policy position perfectly in his 1801 inaugural address: "Peace, commerce, and honest friendship with all nations — entangling alliances with none."

Washington similarly urged that we must, "Act for ourselves and not for others," by forming an "American character wholly free of foreign attachments.""

what specifically does this mean policy-wise, aside from a timely and safe military withdrawl from the region(not just Iraq)?  Aside from addressing foreign aid (basically, stopping it) I'm not exactly sure.

Offline Tango

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« Reply #62 on: May 16, 2007, 05:06:23 PM »
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Originally posted by midnight Target
Did your teacher bring a TV into the 5th grade classroom?


Ah, yes. Lets resort to the kiddie insults. That shows how mature you are.

I'm probably old enough to be your Daddy or even Grandpa.
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Offline Toad

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« Reply #63 on: May 16, 2007, 05:13:54 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by ink
i dont know who in the government did the towers, but it was an inside job. im sorry, but the truth hurts.


Like all the tinfoils, you make the assumption that in this land where millions of dollars are instantly paid for the story that this could be kept a secret.

The WTC area was frequented by tens of thousands of people daily, but no one saw the secret agents wiring three buildings for demolition. A job that size would take a large number of secret agent men all skilled in demolition and it would take quite a long time. Not a one of those secret agent demolition men has tried to sell the story which, if proven, would bring absolute avalanches of money from guys like Soros who live to bring down the present admin.

The Goldberg editorial pretty much sums up the looney-toons in the Demo party that believe this stuff.

Go ahead, link us all to the true story... I'm due for a good laugh.
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Offline john9001

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« Reply #64 on: May 16, 2007, 05:27:03 PM »
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Originally posted by bsdaddict


Ron Paul said "Noninterventionism is not isolationism. Nonintervention simply means America does not interfere militarily, financially, or covertly in the internal affairs of other nations. It does not mean that we isolate ourselves; on the contrary, our founders advocated open trade, travel, communication, and diplomacy with other nations.  


so paul would not have invaded france in WW2, i agree, the invasion of france ,who was not at war with anyone at that time was a mistake. France was no threat to the USA.

oh, and bring our troops home from germany, 60 years of occupation is long enough.

Offline Shuckins

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« Reply #65 on: May 16, 2007, 05:31:02 PM »
Ink, you need to hang your hatred of Bush on another argument other than the "he allowed 9/11 to happen" bilge, for there isn't a sane person of any political stripe in the entire United States who believes it.  There is no concrete evidence of any sort to back up such vitriolic claims.



As to how the United States is perceived by radical Muslims in the Middle East, let me posit the following:  the U.S. didn't actually have to do anything of any consequence to provoke an attack by them, for they don't really need a reason to attack us.  They have despised the West since the Crusades, yet today they lack the military power to challenge any modern western nation.  While the average muslim might resent western intrusion into middle eastern affairs they're not willing to go to war because of it.  Other nations have been interfering in their affairs for hundreds of years, so an intrusion by the U.S. would not be anything out of the ordinary.

The radicals, however, are different.  As long as the Middle East remained poor, they were basically powerless to carry jihad into infidel nations.  The discovery of oil changed everything.  Oil money not only enriched the Persian Gulf nations, it filtered down into the hands of these undesireable factions.  They now had the resources to resume the spreading of their faith.  All they needed was a target, or a pretext, to galvanize their supporters and bolster their ability to recruit.

They needed an 800 pound gorilla;  a pretext for tweaking its nose would be fabricated as needed.  This has been the favored tactic of militant Islam for initiating conflict with infidel nations since the time of Muhammed.  The fact that much of the Middle East's new found wealth came from the US., or that the American government had devoted time and material toward protecting muslims from genocide in places such as Kosovo, mattered not one bit.

Offline Gunthr

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« Reply #66 on: May 16, 2007, 05:35:19 PM »
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what specifically does this mean policy-wise, aside from a timely and safe military withdrawl from the region(not just Iraq)? Aside from addressing foreign aid (basically, stopping it) I'm not exactly sure. -bsaddict


me neither.  does it mean that he would not want us to interfere with Iran if we knew they were developing nuclear weapons for example?


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Offline bsdaddict

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« Reply #67 on: May 16, 2007, 06:37:33 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Gunthr
does it mean that he would not want us to interfere with Iran if we knew they were developing nuclear weapons for example?

Depends what you mean by "interfere".  Going from his quote on non-interventionism above I'd say military, financial or covert interference would be a no-no.  Diplomatic options would be availed, but no regime changes, economic sanctions, invasions, etc.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2007, 06:55:01 PM by bsdaddict »

Offline Captain Virgil Hilts

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« Reply #68 on: May 16, 2007, 07:51:16 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by bsdaddict
Depends what you mean by "interfere".  Going from his quote on non-interventionism above I'd say military, financial or covert interference would be a no-no.  Diplomatic options would be availed, but no regime changes, economic sanctions, invasions, etc.


That's a foreign policy with no teeth. It will NEVER work.
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Offline Dadano

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« Reply #69 on: May 16, 2007, 07:57:27 PM »
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Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
That's a foreign policy with no teeth. It will NEVER work.

Exactly why it is needed. We don't need to "work" on other countries, we need work on our own.
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Offline bsdaddict

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« Reply #70 on: May 16, 2007, 08:10:41 PM »
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Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
That's a foreign policy with no teeth. It will NEVER work.

"teeth" is (partly) what got us here...

Offline john9001

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« Reply #71 on: May 16, 2007, 08:21:58 PM »
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Originally posted by bsdaddict
"teeth" is (partly) what got us here...


being weak willed is what "got us here", enemies know americans have no will to fight a long war, all they have to do is wait for the american people to lose the will to fight.  Recent history has proven america to be a paper tiger.

Offline Captain Virgil Hilts

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« Reply #72 on: May 16, 2007, 09:35:03 PM »
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Originally posted by Dadano
Exactly why it is needed. We don't need to "work" on other countries, we need work on our own.


Sure, that'll work. When Hell freezes over. Foreign relations will work great when we negotiate from a position of weakness and disadvantage. Absolutely.:rolleyes:
"I haven't seen Berlin yet, from the ground or the air, and I plan on doing both, BEFORE the war is over."

SaVaGe


Offline Dadano

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« Reply #73 on: May 16, 2007, 09:57:59 PM »
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Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
Sure, that'll work. When Hell freezes over. Foreign relations will work great when we negotiate from a position of weakness and disadvantage. Absolutely.:rolleyes:

Good attitude:aok
Dano
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Offline midnight Target

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« Reply #74 on: May 16, 2007, 10:36:14 PM »
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Originally posted by Tango
Ah, yes. Lets resort to the kiddie insults. That shows how mature you are.

I'm probably old enough to be your Daddy or even Grandpa.


That would make you older than dirt.