Author Topic: Red light cameras as a trojan horse  (Read 1138 times)

Offline Chairboy

  • Probation
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8221
      • hallert.net
Red light cameras as a trojan horse
« on: July 30, 2007, 04:59:18 PM »
http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/18/1886.asp

Berkeley is preparing to modify their laws so that their red light cameras can be used as general surveillance devices.  I pshawed this specific threat a few years ago in another thread because I assumed the red light cams were only active when taking pictures of an offender, but I submit that I was mistaken.

This is a trojan horse of sorts, because it's part of setting a precedent that can be copied nationally by other cities to do the same thing.  There is a rich history of evidence that backs the assertion that expanded government powers, no matter how originally well intentioned, are eventually abused and or used to strip liberties from citizens.

I understand the argument that "there is no expectation of privacy in public", but I feel the centralization by technology has lowered the bar for what this entails.  An officer on the beat, walking down the street seeing what's happening is different from an officer that can watch 10 streets at once while a computer scans all license plates for warrants, expired tags, etc.  Technology is gradually making the idea of a police state easier, and making it so that many fewer officers are required.

Is the direction we're heading as a society in-line with what our founding fathers would have wanted?  If not, is it in-line with what we as citizens want?  I think the long term consequences are at odds with life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
"When fascism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross." - Sinclair Lewis

Offline DREDIOCK

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 17775
Red light cameras as a trojan horse
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2007, 05:18:18 PM »
Again.
Why people dont simply snipe these thnigs is beyond me.

Fill a  paintball wiht BIN Shellac based primer and snipe em.
Once that stuff dries they aint getting it clean again
« Last Edit: July 30, 2007, 06:35:53 PM by DREDIOCK »
Death is no easy answer
For those who wish to know
Ask those who have been before you
What fate the future holds
It ain't pretty

storch

  • Guest
Red light cameras as a trojan horse
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2007, 05:26:56 PM »
they have been in use in broward county for some time.  they don't seem to work though.

Offline Russian

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2992
Red light cameras as a trojan horse
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2007, 05:30:30 PM »
Why to be so scared of just a little camera? Brits have those on every corner.

Think if that camera has this technology build in.... now thats something else

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENGY1CD9y_4


(That technology has been used in Russia on major highways into major cities for a long time.....while brave gistapo cops of road police detained me, I got to watch it in action...)

Offline Fulmar

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3936
      • Aces High Movie Database
Red light cameras as a trojan horse
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2007, 05:51:30 PM »
Hi.
In game callsign: not currently flying
Flying off and on since Warbirds
Aces High Movies available at www.derstuhl.net/ahmd2 - no longer aceshighmovies.com - not updated either

Offline tedrbr

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1813
Red light cameras as a trojan horse
« Reply #5 on: July 30, 2007, 08:39:37 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Fulmar
Hi.

You just made "the list" Fulmar.  Government agents will be along shortly.  They are there to help you.

Offline Mickey1992

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3362
Red light cameras as a trojan horse
« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2007, 08:10:53 AM »
Wow, what a nice unbiased website.  Every single article talks about the evils of red light cameras and I was unable to find a single article that talks about how the cameras in many cases reduce the number of accidents (as they do here in Columbus).

It's funny how a stationary, well-marked red light camera suddenly is described as a "spy camera".

Offline lazs2

  • Radioactive Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 24886
Red light cameras as a trojan horse
« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2007, 08:19:03 AM »
The blue people in their blue cities are getting what they want and deserve.

ya all buckle up now ya heah?

lazs

Offline Sox62

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1159
Red light cameras as a trojan horse
« Reply #8 on: July 31, 2007, 11:29:35 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Mickey1992
Wow, what a nice unbiased website.  Every single article talks about the evils of red light cameras and I was unable to find a single article that talks about how the cameras in many cases reduce the number of accidents (as they do here in Columbus).

It's funny how a stationary, well-marked red light camera suddenly is described as a "spy camera".


You can use spray that will defeat them.

Better yet,just drive slower than the speed limit when you run the light.They don't trip unless you do.

I don't like em' for two reasons.I don't like to run red lights,but I will for;1-Somebody way too close behind me and I'm worried about getting hit;2-the light starts to change at the last second and the road is bad from heavy rain,etc.

Offline Jackal1

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 9092
Red light cameras as a trojan horse
« Reply #9 on: July 31, 2007, 11:32:04 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Mickey1992
Wow, what a nice unbiased website.  Every single article talks about the evils of red light cameras and I was unable to find a single article that talks about how the cameras in many cases reduce the number of accidents (as they do here in Columbus).

It's funny how a stationary, well-marked red light camera suddenly is described as a "spy camera".


The naive will rule the earth.....for 2 days. At that time it will be taken over by government and laws that the naive have allowed to be put in place.
Democracy is two wolves deciding on what to eat. Freedom is a well armed sheep protesting the vote.
------------------------------------------------------------------

Offline Mickey1992

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3362
Red light cameras as a trojan horse
« Reply #10 on: July 31, 2007, 11:48:41 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Sox62
Better yet,just drive slower than the speed limit when you run the light.They don't trip unless you do.


The sensors in the road determine if you are going to enter the intersection after the light turns red.  It has nothing to do with the speed limit.

Offline rogerdee

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2286
      • http://rogerdee.co.uk
Red light cameras as a trojan horse
« Reply #11 on: July 31, 2007, 12:52:39 PM »
when you said red light cameras i thought you ment they were going to start filming the local brothals:confused:
490th battling bulldogs
www.rogerdee.co.uk

it does what it says on the tin

Offline rpm

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 15661
Red light cameras as a trojan horse
« Reply #12 on: July 31, 2007, 12:57:17 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Sox62
You can use spray that will defeat them.
...and the Klingons have a neat cloaking device...
My mind is a raging torrent, flooded with rivulets of thought cascading into a waterfall of creative alternatives.
Stay thirsty my friends.

Offline Thrawn

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6972
Red light cameras as a trojan horse
« Reply #13 on: July 31, 2007, 12:58:46 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Mickey1992
Wow, what a nice unbiased website.  Every single article talks about the evils of red light cameras and I was unable to find a single article that talks about how the cameras in many cases reduce the number of accidents (as they do here in Columbus).

It's funny how a stationary, well-marked red light camera suddenly is described as a "spy camera".



And alot of places have seen no reduction in accidents, or even an increase in accidents.

They are nothing more than a revenue generation scheme by local governments....oh wait, now they are also a way for them to watch the cattle.

Offline wooley

  • Copper Member
  • **
  • Posts: 293
Red light cameras as a trojan horse
« Reply #14 on: July 31, 2007, 02:57:06 PM »
Just wait to governments here catch on to the revenue generating potential of speed cameras, or as we Brits like to call them - piggy banks.

These things were originally only meant to be deployed in accident black-spots or near schools, but somehow we forgot to adequately define what 'near' means with the result that the bloody thing are now everywhere. Anyone who objects is instantly branded a speed-crazed child killer and insurance companies are having a field day with something like 60% of motorists now carrying a current speeding conviction.

America 'aint seen nothing yet.