AH strat

[Rich46yo]

Let me ask this? When was the last time you saw the city leveled and the starts systematically reduced? I spend almost all my free time in the game, in my bombers, and Ive never seen it. Sure Ive seen a city reduced, if its close enough to the front lines,. But a systematic bombing campaign???

                        Truth is there are very few of us willing to fly bombers in the MA after strat targets. Even when I fly in my squad its usually not in the late war MA, and even then its one target and out.

                       In the one arena now? I think the blue? , the one with the water? I flew against one strat since its been up. The enemies strats are a long way away for a Bish, are heavily defended with radar you cant get around, and have main airbases around them that are 5,000' or more in elevation. So why would I jump in heavies and spend 1&1/2 hour flying against targets that dont mean anything even if I can get thru to them?

                   Pity cause flying against strats is often thrilling and often pits you against the enemies best while a long, long way from home. When you fly long and high against strats you will probably run into some very accomplished sticks so when you take the target out, and live to tell about it, you've accomplished something.

                But with the targets meaningless? With all the radars, and dar bars, and target lights going off, providing a highway for intercept? Why bother? I know I dont much bother now and until some changes are made then only 10% of these maps will actually be used for fighting.

[Lusche]

Originally posted by SlapShot
So there is some assemblance of a "strat" attrition in place ... albeit old.

Problem is, I don't think that most people even know this information ... and/or ... the task of properly effecting the "strat" is too daunting/boring/hard to level the city(s) first before actually leveling a "strat".

Well, from the point of view of a true strategic / win-the-war player it's still a waste of "resources".
Assumed you are not a bomb'n'bailer, it takes 2-3 buff guys (to account for some combat attrition) to level a city. (You could do it all on your own, but only under favourable circumstances) Total mission time at least 30-45 minutes.
The same for a ack factory target.

So these three guys have already spend 60-90 minutes at least in the air before now porking individual fields. Let's say they have completed all their task's in about 2 hours.
But 3 guys with that determination, patience and skill would have wreaked much more havoc when tactially supporting their team's landgrab efforts over the course of 2 hours.

[dedalos]

Originally posted by Rich46yo

                       In the one arena now? I think the blue? , the one with the water? I flew against one strat since its been up. The enemies strats are a long way away for a Bish, are heavily defended with radar you cant get around, and have main airbases around them that are 5,000' or more in elevation. So why would I jump in heavies and spend 1&1/2 hour flying against targets that dont mean anything even if I can get thru to them?

Well, that is a question only you can answer.  Why do you do it?

                   Pity cause flying against strats is often thrilling and often pits you against the enemies best while a long, long way from home. When you fly long and high against strats you will probably run into some very accomplished sticks so when you take the target out, and live to tell about it, you've accomplished something.

No, no and nop

[Nimrod45]

Originally posted by FiLtH
Its the biggest disappointment of the game for me. Id prefer just 2 arenas in here. A combat arena where there are no strats or captures, just a big FT and some GV bases, and a war arena where all the strats work to strangle an enemy, where certain vehicles become unavailable thru attrition or strat bombing and people lose...and enjoy it.

This sounds pretty cool, though I am afraid the war arena would be pretty unpopulated.

[Rich46yo]

Originally posted by dedalos
Well, that is a question only you can answer.  Why do you do it?

 
No, no and nop

                            Try reading my entire post. I did answer it.

[SlapShot]

Originally posted by Lusche
Well, from the point of view of a true strategic / win-the-war player it's still a waste of "resources".
Assumed you are not a bomb'n'bailer, it takes 2-3 buff guys (to account for some combat attrition) to level a city. (You could do it all on your own, but only under favourable circumstances) Total mission time at least 30-45 minutes.
The same for a ack factory target.

So these three guys have already spend 60-90 minutes at least in the air before now porking individual fields. Let's say they have completed all their task's in about 2 hours.
But 3 guys with that determination, patience and skill would have wreaked much more havoc when tactially supporting their team's landgrab efforts over the course of 2 hours.

Well ... at least it is still in place and does offer, to those who want to do it, a goal.

I remember back in the day, bomber squad(s) and a fighter squad(s) would get together to this. Bombers and fighters would launch to take out the city(s) and when that was completed, another wing of bombers and fighters would lift to take out the "strats" (HQ being one of them). Then, with that completed, other base taking squads would then reek havoc on the fields and take advantage of efforts of the "strike" team.

But ... that is not the case anymore. People just don't have the patience to do that kind of stuff ... or they don't have the coordination/cooperation to pull it off ... or that type of "mission/effort" would runing their score/rank.

I am not saying that the existing strat system is great, but there is a system there that can be exploited ... if they choose to exploit it.

[Patches1]

Current conditions require a Strat Target to be taken below 50% before its effects are felt.

Thus if City strat is at 60%...it is still not a choke point for all other strats.

If other strats are still above 50% and city strat is still at 60%...no change.

Take strats below 50%...the change occurs.

Keep the strats below 50% and you will feel the effect.

Can a single Bomber with Drones take a strat below 50%? I suppose that is up to the skill of the Bomber Pilots and their selected Bombers.

Can single JABO Aircraft, alone, get Strat below 50%? Perhaps not...but in my Corsair with 2x1Ks and 8 Rockets I've been able to get strats down to 80% in one run. With three, or more Corsairs...easy to get below 50% in a single run.

Strats do affect gameplay...if you understand how the strats work.

If Bomber Pilots wish to target airfields and take out fighter hangars, radar, bomber hangars and ordnance, instead of Strat Targets, then the effect of Strat will not be felt.

Somehow...the job of JABOs got confused with the job of Bombers. JABOs now need 2800 lbs of ords to take out a single VH (in real Life...a 250, or 500 lber may have done the job of taking out ANY single hangar), but 3,000 pounds of ordnance can take out 80% of a City?

Well, no matter, I fly a Corsair! I can fly high enough to kill the bombers, and low enough to bomb Strats, or Airfields, or Towns, and mix it up with the fighters.

Strat works! I'm just wondering about the Bomber vs JABO role?

[Tiger]

Take away the pin-point sight we have now and bring back the old calibration and you will see more strat andless field targets being hit by bombers.  

Much easier to carpet bomb a strat than pick off single hangers with the old calibrated bomb sight.

[Tilt]

I think the strat/capture/war model is just plain old.............

I would like to think there is even a mid to long term plan to re visit just how the frontline moves and what has to be done to move it and how it affects AC & V fields and the game play derived there of

[Rich46yo]

[/QUOTE]Can a single Bomber with Drones take a strat below 50%? I suppose that is up to the skill of the Bomber Pilots and their selected Bombers.

                           The short answer is "no". Ive done it in Lancs from very low but its involved turning around and bombing a 2nd, or even 3rd, time. I consider a good run in 17s or 24s when I can take out 30% to 40% of the target. I dont care how much skill you have you only have so many bombs. Some strats are different then others. Ive taken out all the fuel containers at a refinery and still only shut down 35% of the target.

                       So whats left for bomber sticks? Flying against front line airfields I guess. If your lucky, in your 280 mph bomber, you might even survive to get to your target. Not that your going to be able to stick your nose in the bomb-site anyways cause your going to be fighting off 10 enemy fighters.

                      I cant tell you how many times Ive signed on and seen that everyone's strats are at 100%. While "everyone" is flying at two or three front line flash points. It doesn't look to me like the current strat system is working. It looks to me like its totally useless.

[Snubby]

I dont know how many times ive gone on a milk run, in lancs at around 20k and attacked 3 different strat targets way behind the lines, and have been confronted by maybe 1 fighter or none at all..

I get my perk points and all.. but also get the distinct feeling that what I am doing is utterly pointless..

the enemy obviousley doesent seem to care..

you also see all the time on the country channel.

"something is over our city/refinery.. etc"

and the only reply is:

"prolly some milk runner at 30K"

and nobody bothers to do anything..




it strat had a direct and immediate effect this would not be the case..

if you could go level the grunt training strat and as a result disable troops at all the fields..   i would think the "oh well" attitude would change pretty quick.

[The Fugitive]

Originally posted by Snubby
..............

it strat had a direct and immediate effect this would not be the case..

if you could go level the grunt training strat and as a result disable troops at all the fields..   i would think the "oh well" attitude would change pretty quick.

This why you most likely will never see anything like this. Can you imagine the whines you'd get if taking out a grunt factor disabled troops over the whole map??

This is a game. People want action NOW! Nobody has the time to climb for 20-30 minutes and circle a strat target till it was time to rtb for fuel just so the troops don't get porked. Take away the "fun", and you loose the customers, I really doubt HTC would want that.

I don't how to fix strat, but yes its totally ineffective as it is. Very few people will run supplies to fix a porked base.... tho many will yell for others to do it ..... Covering a strat target, or resupply it will take people away from the things they want to do.

[SlapShot]

Originally posted by Snubby
I dont know how many times ive gone on a milk run, in lancs at around 20k and attacked 3 different strat targets way behind the lines, and have been confronted by maybe 1 fighter or none at all..

I get my perk points and all.. but also get the distinct feeling that what I am doing is utterly pointless..

the enemy obviousley doesent seem to care..

you also see all the time on the country channel.

"something is over our city/refinery.. etc"

and the only reply is:

"prolly some milk runner at 30K"

and nobody bothers to do anything..




it strat had a direct and immediate effect this would not be the case..

if you could go level the grunt training strat and as a result disable troops at all the fields..   i would think the "oh well" attitude would change pretty quick.

The key is ... you have to level the city(s) first ... City(s) supply strats ... take out the City(s) and the strats won't be resupplied.

Then when you level the grunt strat ... any troops that are disabled on airfields for that country are rendered useless for up to 2 hours.

It has three tiers to make it effective ...

City -> Strat -> Airfield strat.

If they are leveled in that order ... you have made a difference and if you keep the City(s) leveled, it will continue to make a difference ... and then you will get noticed and you would probably see all sorts of "bomber" killers in the air.

Just leveling a strat (such as Grunts), for all intents and purposes, does nothing ... except help your "rank" and that is the only reason why people spend as much time as they do leveling those places. Their intent is not to hurt the enemy ... it's to bolster their l337 rank.

[thndregg]

Originally posted by storch
you may dismiss the EW and MW resets as frauds they are typically done by the 5th SFD SOAR squad or The Hired Guns squad and they do so when everyone else is sleeping.  the reason it's not one per day is that if even one defender ups they are completely impotent to take a base.

Storch, I hear ya' on this one. EW is just plain silly as far as capture/reset goes.

[thndregg]

Originally posted by FiLtH
Its the biggest disappointment of the game for me. Id prefer just 2 arenas in here. A combat arena where there are no strats or captures, just a big FT and some GV bases, and a war arena where all the strats work to strangle an enemy, where certain vehicles become unavailable thru attrition or strat bombing and people lose...and enjoy it.

I like your idea, Filth, and as far as someone earlier saying that the War Arena would be sparsely populated, I would have to disagree. I think that both venues, combat and war alike would even out fairly well.