Author Topic: B29 Superfortress and a thought from a squaddie (Read 6383 times)

Motherland · « **Reply #60 on:** October 17, 2007, 03:03:06 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by MajIssue
I have one thank you... Significant? NO! up to UK/US/German standards for fighter aircraft? NO again. D 520 had a top speed of around 320 mph... mincemeat for a 190 a5 or 109 G or a 51B or 38G! 'Nuff said about the French "airforce in WW2!

Except it's an early war plane. 320 is average compared to a 109E, Hurricane 1, A6M, P40, etc...

Airscrew · « **Reply #61 on:** October 17, 2007, 03:42:42 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by MajIssue
I have one thank you... Significant? NO! up to UK/US/German standards for fighter aircraft? NO again. D 520 had a top speed of around 320 mph... mincemeat for a 190 a5 or 109 G or a 51B or 38G! 'Nuff said about the French "airforce in WW2!

Good, you got a library card... use it.. Motherland is close, They were significant aircraft, the same or better than other countries in 1940. The failing in the French airforce wasnt its equipment or men but in its goverment and its leadership.

so use your library card and read some books (dont just look at the pretty pictures)...

HAFhr · « **Reply #62 on:** October 18, 2007, 02:08:53 AM »

I agree, as any knows, that the B-29 should be added. What's more, with the exclusion of the Germans in the early war, it is the American bombers which flooded the airspace along with the Lancasters, which is already in the game. So it is accurate to have the US bomber fleet greatly outnumber that of the British. Additional bombers, such as the HE111, would be a joke for game play and score potato fodder. I would like to see such things as fire and skip bombs added to the British arsenal though, and night fighters would be nice.

Hien · « **Reply #63 on:** October 18, 2007, 03:09:53 AM »

I seem to remember someone, somewhere saying that odd bombs (Parafrags, things of that nature) would be the last kind of things added to the game, if at all. I could be horibly wrong though.

And as for Night Fighters, I just don't see it happening. Night time is gone. Heck, it was gone when I got here in the summer of 06' as Balefire. I doubt it'll come back. Ever. As most of the older Aces High players are a tad older, and don't have perfect eyesight.

Besides, I was here last Christmas. Night Time solved by simply turning up Gamma. Night Fighters would be even meat in the day, or night time.

Personally I think the B-29 should be the last, or near the last thing Aces High ever gets. For a few quick reasons. All my personal ones, atleast.

A) Just so we can get these endless threads about people wanting them, so much joy.

B) Maybe HTC will go crazy and give me a P-26 first (I'm not even sure if they're a possiblity, I know they saw combat. But I am unsure of the Squadron level, anybody got info on this? D: )

And C) There are other forces that need bombers more than the US. The Pe-3, the Tu-2, Pe-8, and a few other VVS Bombers to name. Heck, we could use a G4M Betty just for Historic reasons, alongside the He-111. They're planes that played a important part in history. Mind you, so did the B-29, I'm not saying it didn't. But the US Planeset is huge. Lets get something else.

MajIssue · « **Reply #64 on:** October 18, 2007, 01:25:52 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Motherland
Except it's an early war plane. 320 is average compared to a 109E, Hurricane 1, A6M, P40, etc...

Point taken... Being occupied had a serious effect of late war French designs!:aok

MajIssue · « **Reply #65 on:** October 18, 2007, 01:41:16 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Airscrew
Good, you got a library card... use it.. Motherland is close, They were significant aircraft, the same or better than other countries in 1940. The failing in the French airforce wasnt its equipment or men but in its goverment and its leadership.

so use your library card and read some books (dont just look at the pretty pictures)...

Before you call someone stupid for having an opinion you should at least ask them how they came to that conclusion...

Here's a homework assingment for you Airscrew: The Fall of the Third Republic by William L. Shirer...

A accurate depiction of the failures of the French Government and Military leadership that led to the debacle of1940.

I agree that the rank and file pilots of the French airforce in early 1940 were on par with the other allied powers and the equipment of their most modern squadrons was up to snuff, but the policies of the high command (who were always ready to fight the last war) hampered any serious effort to modernize the French air force before the onslaut of the NAZIs. There was in fact serious resistance from some in the government (to procurement of more modern types of aircraft) who thought that an invasion from the East (Germany) was impossible because of the Maginot Line. The Spanish civil war should have been a wakeup call but the govermant failed to obtain additional modern types for the Air Force. The D520s in the invenatory prior to the invasion were too few too late. By 1940 the Luftwaffe had LOTS of 109s HE111s JU88s and other modern types that were able to destroy Frances vaunted D520s on the ground rendering the Air Force useless...

I expect a full report by this time next week... class dismissed

VonKost · « **Reply #66 on:** October 18, 2007, 01:47:26 PM »

The B-29 was the most powerful, complex and important bomber built during the war. It's actions and abilities set the stage for the next 50 years of history. (SAC etc..) It was very much a marvel of it's time and had a very significant contribution to the war and it's subsequent history.

No non-American or British multi-engine strategic bombers really contributed to changing the course of the war. The Battle of Britian era German bombers did not change the course of the war, (the spits and hurricanes sure did) the Russian multi-engine birds did not really hit thier stride until the arms race after the war. (When they interned the B-29)

The B-29 was important and revolutionary and that is why it should be included as opposed to any of the French craft and any of the other bombers. It's blaringly obvious when you have late model planes that the B-29 is missing.

The only other things that could possibly be considered near as important would be the V2 strategic rockets and the Jets. We already have the Jets, bring on the Superforts!

Von

(edited for spelling)

Larry · « **Reply #67 on:** October 18, 2007, 01:54:00 PM »

I see school didnt make all the squeakers go away.

MajIssue · « **Reply #68 on:** October 18, 2007, 01:58:21 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Hien
I seem to remember someone, somewhere saying that odd bombs (Parafrags, things of that nature) would be the last kind of things added to the game, if at all. I could be horibly wrong though.

And as for Night Fighters, I just don't see it happening. Night time is gone. Heck, it was gone when I got here in the summer of 06' as Balefire. I doubt it'll come back. Ever. As most of the older Aces High players are a tad older, and don't have perfect eyesight.

Besides, I was here last Christmas. Night Time solved by simply turning up Gamma. Night Fighters would be even meat in the day, or night time.

Personally I think the B-29 should be the last, or near the last thing Aces High ever gets. For a few quick reasons. All my personal ones, atleast.

A) Just so we can get these endless threads about people wanting them, so much joy.

B) Maybe HTC will go crazy and give me a P-26 first (I'm not even sure if they're a possiblity, I know they saw combat. But I am unsure of the Squadron level, anybody got info on this? D: )

And C) There are other forces that need bombers more than the US. The Pe-3, the Tu-2, Pe-8, and a few other VVS Bombers to name. Heck, we could use a G4M Betty just for Historic reasons, alongside the He-111. They're planes that played a important part in history. Mind you, so did the B-29, I'm not saying it didn't. But the US Planeset is huge. Lets get something else.

How many Pe3/Tu2 (Wasnt that an EXACT B29 copy?) pe 8/HE111/G4ms were produced?

Who cares what country's aircraft were represented... What WORKS is all I care about.

P 26... Please let me see one in my 190A8. I'd rather see them add a P 39... More made and more saw combat.

This game isn't about historic reinactmant (except in the scenarios) its about air/ground and sea combat in WW2 equipment

The B29 played a critical role in the Pacific Theatre (without dropping Nukes which I agree should never be introduced in AH except maybe for 1,000,000 perckies

) The planeset of US bombers is big because there were more of em in WW2 and they were the most effective in the war. The same isn't true in fighter/attack planesets where there are far more non American aircraft "represented". Show me one type that can rival the B29s capabilities...

Airscrew · « **Reply #69 on:** October 18, 2007, 01:58:26 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Larry
I see school didnt make all the squeakers go away.

nope

Airscrew · « **Reply #70 on:** October 18, 2007, 02:04:27 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by MajIssue
Before you call someone stupid for having an opinion you should at least ask them how they came to that conclusion... ,snip.....
By 1940 the Luftwaffe had LOTS of 109s HE111s JU88s and other modern types that were able to destroy Frances vaunted D520s on the ground rendering the Air Force useless...

I expect a full report by this time next week... class dismissed

Ok, before I reply and tell you where to put your homework assignment

is this your OPINION or do you believe this to be a FACT.

Rino · « **Reply #71 on:** October 18, 2007, 02:28:06 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by VonKost
The B-29 was the most powerful, complex and important bomber built during the war. It's actions and abilities set the stage for the next 50 years of history. (SAC etc..) It was very much a marvel of it's time and had a very significant contribution to the war and it's subsequent history.

No non-American or British multi-engine strategic bombers really contributed to changing the course of the war. The Battle of Britian era German bombers did not change the course of the war, (the spits and hurricanes sure did) the Russian multi-engine birds did not really hit thier stride until the arms race after the war. (When they interned the B-29)

The B-29 was important and revolutionary and that is why it should be included as opposed to any of the French craft and any of the other bombers. It's blaringly obvious when you have late model planes that the B-29 is missing.

The only other things that could possibly be considered near as important would be the V2 strategic rockets and the Jets. We already have the Jets, bring on the Superforts!

Von

(edited for spelling)

Disagree strongly..both the US and UK bombers hitting fuel and
transportation targets very definitely influenced the course of the war.

VonKost · « **Reply #72 on:** October 18, 2007, 02:43:15 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Rino
Disagree strongly..both the US and UK bombers hitting fuel and
transportation targets very definitely influenced the course of the war.

I agree, that's why I excluded them in the second paragraph.

Hien · « **Reply #73 on:** October 18, 2007, 04:09:52 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by MajIssue
How many Pe3/Tu2 (Wasnt that an EXACT B29 copy?) pe 8/HE111/G4ms were produced?

Who cares what country's aircraft were represented... What WORKS is all I care about.

P 26... Please let me see one in my 190A8. I'd rather see them add a P 39... More made and more saw combat.

This game isn't about historic reinactmant (except in the scenarios) its about air/ground and sea combat in WW2 equipment

The B29 played a critical role in the Pacific Theatre (without dropping Nukes which I agree should never be introduced in AH except maybe for 1,000,000 perckies ) The planeset of US bombers is big because there were more of em in WW2 and they were the most effective in the war. The same isn't true in fighter/attack planesets where there are far more non American aircraft "represented". Show me one type that can rival the B29s capabilities...

I'll agree it isn't about reinactment, if anything it's about having fun, to me atleast. I tend to fly aircraft I find fun (or just like), D3As, Spit I, I don't mind if I get shot down. As long as I put up a good fight.

But for numbers... Lemme see if I can find a few of the VVS Bombers...(for those of you who can, please add to this list

)
Pe-2, Pe-3, Pe-8, Tu-2, SB-2, Ar-2 (Sb-2 Dive bomber, Archangel), Db-3, Il-4, Il-6, Yak-2, and the Yak-4.

Looking over the Wikipedia data, I'd love to see the Yak-4, 358mph in level flight is pretty good for a bomber. Though I do not know what alt. that is achived at. But if you want to get technical that's a MPH faster than a B-29, yet again I doubt it was at that high of an altitude though.

Personally I love the earlier war VVS bombers, the Sb-2, Ar-2, and DB-3. Some of my favorite bombers of all time. Yes, they got slaughtered by Me-109s and thier ilk, and they don't have great bomb loads (alot of LW fighters can do better) but on the subject of 'work' they do work. But then, everything works when used properly.

For Fighters I agree Russia needs a voice early war. The LaGGs, MiG-1/3s, Yak-1, 1B, 7, and a few others come to mind. The Yaks seem to have alot of little variants, and I don't feel like listing them all here. Especially as some might be field Modifications (and are thusly moot.

)

I feel like noting it was the Tu-4 that was the Soviet B-29.
Edit:Whoop, found another one.

MajIssue · « **Reply #74 on:** October 19, 2007, 10:25:34 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Hien
I'll agree it isn't about reinactment, if anything it's about having fun, to me atleast. I tend to fly aircraft I find fun (or just like), D3As, Spit I, I don't mind if I get shot down. As long as I put up a good fight.

But for numbers... Lemme see if I can find a few of the VVS Bombers...(for those of you who can, please add to this list )
Pe-2, Pe-3, Pe-8, Tu-2, SB-2, Ar-2 (Sb-2 Dive bomber, Archangel), Db-3, Il-4, Il-6, Yak-2, and the Yak-4.

Looking over the Wikipedia data, I'd love to see the Yak-4, 358mph in level flight is pretty good for a bomber. Though I do not know what alt. that is achived at. But if you want to get technical that's a MPH faster than a B-29, yet again I doubt it was at that high of an altitude though.

Personally I love the earlier war VVS bombers, the Sb-2, Ar-2, and DB-3. Some of my favorite bombers of all time. Yes, they got slaughtered by Me-109s and thier ilk, and they don't have great bomb loads (alot of LW fighters can do better) but on the subject of 'work' they do work. But then, everything works when used properly.

For Fighters I agree Russia needs a voice early war. The LaGGs, MiG-1/3s, Yak-1, 1B, 7, and a few others come to mind. The Yaks seem to have alot of little variants, and I don't feel like listing them all here. Especially as some might be field Modifications (and are thusly moot. )

I feel like noting it was the Tu-4 that was the Soviet B-29.
Edit:Whoop, found another one.

I looked it up and YES you're right and I'm wrong The TU-4 was an exact copy (including patched battle damage) of a B-29 forced to land in Russa after a raid on Japan.

I see your point, but most of the EW types would get mualed badly in LW arenas. Since the EW arena earely has more that 10-20 players, what would be the benifit of including light bombers that would rarely be flown and instantly get killed whan thay made contact? Here is an illistration of my point: I was flying a 190 A8 as wing with a good stick Monday to improve my fighter skills in the MA, We stumbled across a raid of 10 Stukas on rhe deck. Result: 10 stukas downed.