Author Topic: On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.  (Read 3225 times)

Offline A8TOOL

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Re: Re: Re: On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.
« Reply #30 on: October 28, 2007, 02:16:27 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Lusche


However, if you hang in the air over my own vehicle base and spot GV's for your friends, or you bail over your own maproom for obvious reasons, I'll give you 10 seconds to type ".ef" - after that you go "splat". And that's not a matter of hatred.



LOL Lusche, understandably so.

Offline Vad

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On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.
« Reply #31 on: October 28, 2007, 03:55:44 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by trigger2
The HO was NOT done in Real Life.  


It was not only widely used in RL it was directly recommended in some cases. Recommendations for La-5 pilots directly advised to use HO against 109s. You  would have 90 to 10 percents chances to win.

Offline pluck

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On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.
« Reply #32 on: October 28, 2007, 09:02:43 PM »
great, a HO and chute all rolled into one!

HO, ya, it was used it real life...though usually when other options where less viable.....fortunately this game is not real life.

Than again, I believe a chute or 2 where shot in real life too......also, thankfully this game is not real life.


But it seems reasonable to apply real life situations during war, to a game, and to the characters that plays the a game :rolleyes: makes perfect sense.
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Offline Stang

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On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.
« Reply #33 on: October 29, 2007, 01:05:11 AM »
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Originally posted by Bronk
I lost a good furby film or I'd post it.:t
Junnt was his name.

:t

Offline trigger2

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On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.
« Reply #34 on: October 29, 2007, 01:31:41 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Helm
Quote
Originally posted by trigger2
The HO was NOT done in Real Life.


I have read many many accounts of head on passes in the War


as I said, through pilot descriptions of this, they were done with a large number of planes and it was like playing chicken. Which is exactly what they called it...
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Offline SEseph

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On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.
« Reply #35 on: October 29, 2007, 02:01:49 AM »
I think this is a good idea, and gives the community a good place to talk about these things. I have not read every post, and instead just wanted to write what I thought.

It comes down to those who play this in true WWII style, and those who want to kill such and such as fast as possible without real skill because it doesn't matter what happens to them.

HO's are real, but HO's happen here like 50-60% of the time, while in WWII, most pilots would avoid a HO simpley because they wish to ensure they live. They wouldn't turn away from it if they could win and all that, but it was used WAY less. Also, alot of pilots in AH don't care about landing, there is even a squad based on this. They jump sides and just want to rake in kills, and bailing the moment they need ammo/fuel. Alot of pilots regulate thier fuel so they can make it home, a real part of war.

The RAM was used in kamikazi attacks with great effect, but those pilots never refined the skill, nor did they regularly use it on fighters, why? THEY DIED. Now, the Germans rammed too at the end of the war, but they did it to Bombers 99% of the time, and were trained to bail. One try, none of this ram, turn, ram, turn ram, you die, they live even having rammed you 3 times (I have a video of someone doing this, and staying airborn long enough to kill me again then land, he hasn't been on since I sent HT the video) But the idea remains. It was a one shot deal, and the bombers went down more often than not, but the pilot died about 60% of the time too, and 100% of the time lost his plane.

Spies were a normal practice in WWII, but they also had the ability to counter act the practices. In AH, I can PM the other side and tell them what's going on, and if the other end is a close friend, NO ONE would ever know, and this creates a problem. In War, a spy is caught and killed, here, we can't even catch them. Not because we're dumb, but because we do not have the means to do such, IE this gives an unfair advantage, and should be a bannable offense for all parties. And as much as I know I'll get flak, I think PM's between sides should be stopped. you can tune to 200 or switch sides IMO.

Vulching is one of those problems no one should whine about. Why? If you're dumb enough to up on a capped, or even semi capped feild and get vulched.. well, too bad, shouldn't have done that. It's like saying: I'm immune to  your cap so I can break it here instead of having to come from another base to reinforce. Deal with the vulch.

The most unethical of all though IMO is the graphics turn down with GV's. I have many videos of people blatently using this as a tactical advantage, that can't be counter-acted. Here's why: I'm in a forest 3.5k from base. Enemy GV is on base. Because I am in the trees, even if I had graphics turned down, I can't see dude because I'm so close to the trees, they won't vanish, but dude can see me. The very thing I'm trying to use as cover has become my worst enemy. Now, this game requires two things with GV's a faster finger and a good ranger.. it no longer requires hiding, placement and the like, or to a minimal extent. I have a very nice and fast computer, I want to see the graphics, and I want to use trees like they did in WWII, as cover, not as a target on me saying kill me. With this, it's actually more benificial to have a slow crappy computer. This happens to be the only game I've ever played that gives advantage to crappy computers and punishes good ones.

With that said, I'lll remind you all of one last tidbit. Ramming, while not nice, isn';t always the players fault. Remember, each of us is in our own world in the game, and because of slight lag, we each exist in a slightly diffrent location than we see. That is how you get the one sided collisions 99% of the time. The others come from stupid people running into you in stalls, as they try to rip you up, or HO you (remember, HOing is a form of chicken, and few on AH are willing to turn because they don't care if they die). So, next time you whine about ramming, ask yourself: how did it happen, before you tell someone they suck because they ram you (now if they were stupid, came in at 450, fired and rammed into you, yeah, they are salamanders, but if it was a HO or something like that..l. whatcha gonna do)
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Offline Sloehand

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On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.
« Reply #36 on: October 29, 2007, 03:05:51 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by trigger2
The HO was NOT done in Real Life. Maybe on one or two accounts it would be done, but in RL they saw the risks of it. Usually both planes would go down. Usually wasn't such small numbers as we see in AHII so after you shoot down one or two, you can't come over your area vox and say your goin home, you gotta stay and fight till they either head for the hills or are all dead. (Persoanlly I wouldn't care much for fighting a A6m in a p38 [US's main primary fighter] with missing aeilrons, elevators, fuel hits, wing chunks missing etc...) If I were to engage zekes or KI's or something, I'd wanna STAY in my prime, not risk it for an easy kill/death. The HO was usually done widespread (20-50 guys lined up on each side) the few times it was done when it was, all the pilots regarded it as "Playing chicken" or "seeing which one would pull out of it first"
In other words, none wanted to do it. It's cheap, takes minimal skill, and WASN'T done in RL. It was not apart of the AF's for any country (even Germany's and they had ramming 109's, so, in all truth, you can argue that a 109 ramming a bomber is historically accurate)

But try not to confuse a HO for a HM (Hot Merge)
I love when your in a stall fight (usually my corsair) and on the merge, you pull the trigger and you get accused of a HO. HO's aren't in my bag of tricks (unless i'm in the 1c and they initiate it, then I let the 20mm's do the talking :] )
HM's and HO's are two different things with similar outcomes.


You don't know what you're talking about.  There are many, many accounts of pilots purposely going for and staying in an HO merge to get a kill.  The AVG did it often against the lighter armed and armored Japanese army planes as did the Navy and Marines when necessary.

Don't even get started on what the Russians were willing to do.  I'm guessing to them, the HO was probably one of the least dangerous tactics they employed regularly.  LOL

The Germans had a RamKommando Elbe group not for HO, but to ram and clip off the tail of bombers.  They too have their accounts of HO engagements.

It happened all the time in RL.  Learn some history.
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Offline Yknurd

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On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.
« Reply #37 on: October 29, 2007, 12:13:12 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by A8TOOL
Shooting chutes used to be considered one of the worst offenses someone could make against you in the game. It was a show of total lack of respect and hatred toward a player. There was no worse personal statement that could be made in Air Warrior to early Aces high.


My Chute-Shooting Whine-O-Meter™ just went off.

Remember, shooting chutes isn't personal, it's just good clean fun!

Unless you don't like the person, then it's good clean fun with personal hatred for good measure!
« Last Edit: October 29, 2007, 12:15:18 PM by Yknurd »
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Offline Dead Man Flying

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On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.
« Reply #38 on: October 29, 2007, 12:25:52 PM »
heh, I was gonna say, Drunky.  I dunno what AW A8TOOL flew, but it surely wasn't the chute-bustingly hilarious one I did.

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Offline Carwash

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On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.
« Reply #39 on: October 29, 2007, 12:42:17 PM »
Nice set of polls.  People here whine about everything, even polls they don't have to participate in.  Don't listen to them.

Offline Tiger

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On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.
« Reply #40 on: October 29, 2007, 01:03:00 PM »
I like the idea of these polls... let's you know how the community feels without having to read all teh whines.


You need to add 2 questions:

1) Should the LA-7 be perked?
2) Should we have the B-29


Just to finish out all the major trends of the boards.

Offline Lusche

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On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.
« Reply #41 on: October 29, 2007, 01:11:57 PM »
And who not add a collision poll? :t

- collisions should be disabled
- both should go down, they do in real life
- collision model is fine


I think the poll result could really make me laugh :D
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Offline 5PointOh

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On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.
« Reply #42 on: October 29, 2007, 01:33:11 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Lusche
And who not add a collision poll? :t

- collisions should be disabled
- both should go down, they do in real life
- collision model is fine


I think the poll result could really make me laugh :D


I'd like to pick-both should go down, they do in real life.  Not that it will happen, but thats my choice.
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Offline MajIssue

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On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.
« Reply #43 on: October 29, 2007, 02:08:17 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Meatwad
Is spamming with crybaby polls ethical?


NO - 100% (Eleventymillion votes)


Sorry, you lose.

Also: Is being a jerk and flaming a new guy who is only trying to find out what is and isn't acceptable in the MAs ethical?
Sorry you're a looser
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Offline Scca

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On ethics – The HO, The RAM, The SPY – an informal poll.
« Reply #44 on: October 29, 2007, 03:28:51 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by MajIssue
Also: Is being a jerk and flaming a new guy who is only trying to find out what is and isn't acceptable in the MAs ethical?
Sorry you're a looser
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