What's with the uber maneuvers?

[Bosco123]

I think he knows that hes wrong on this one, and he has given up on this post. I havn't seen a post in more that 24 hours from him so..... guess we will never see the films.

[TequilaChaser]

I think he knows that hes wrong on this one, and he has given up on this post. I havn't seen a post in more that 24 hours from him so..... guess we will never see the films.

Bosco123, sometimes you think entirely wrong. You might want to read Ghosth's post  about "experience"

    
Ghosth's post Re: Fitting in?
« Reply #13 on: May 26, 2008, 09:36:17 AM »
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,237187.0.html


it has nothing to do about if someone is right or wrong.............. and you should know assuming/assumptions are the mother of all "F-UPs"

He is thinking there might be a quirk in the "coad" possibly.  If he is wrong in his thinking , he is classy enough to say he is......


to add: I think, the reason Agent360 is so polite & patient with Animl , is for the simple fact he knows who Animl is from past years and this is why he is offering to help Animl figure it out.......

[dedalos]

( you would classify Animl,to the likes of . . . . . . . .Badboy, ...etc...... in how he carried himself and . . . . . . . .

I am lost TC.  Are you saying he is or used to use HT paid accounts to hide behind a trainers badge while using shades to vulch in the DA and harass other players for his enjoyment? 

[Messiah]

Lol, this guy would **** himself if he saw that film where nath does a 180 in a split second and taters a zeke in the face.

[hubsonfire]

cobra ftw!

[Agent360]

Ok I have some films to show now.

The two AH2 films show the move stalling to the right and to the left.

There is a wmv file that shows what it looks like from the six of the 109. At the end when the nose is pointed down for a while u will see the 109 like fly off flat but is the viewer adjusting because the plane is flying strait at the viewer. The viewer goes into a loop or something but the plane is flying strait down. If you look at the AH2 films you can see it better.

When viewing the AH films the best way to see is to view in "fixed" and get behind the 109 as it goes up pull the right slider down and stay in the six of the 109 like you were pulling up after him. This way you can see how the 109 just flips around and comes strait down.

If you watch from a slight angle off from strait six you can get to where the 109 does the flip over onto the same vector. When viewing it from this perspective you see only one line....plane up then plane down. You dont see the angle of the flip because your looking at it sideways...like holding a piece of wire bent to a u shape. If you turn the wire sideways you only see one piece of wire.

So if your coming up at the right angle all you will see is the planes six and the stall at the top is masked and the next thing you see is the nose pointed strait at you.

Stalling it to the right or left depends on what oblique side the con is coming up from. If you initiate the move from a left and turn then you would stall left for example. When you start from a left turn and go up the con will pull up at an angle inside you therefor putting up at a slight left vert turn. So you stall left and as he is coming up he is actually starting to overshoot. Here when the nose is pointing down you get a front quarter or better shot before he goes by.

http://northwestflorida.com/aceshigh/sledge/film26_left.ahf

http://northwestflorida.com/aceshigh/sledge/film27_right.ahf

Video
http://northwestflorida.com/aceshigh/sledge/sledge_con_vis.wmv


Agent360

[moot]

Lol, this guy would **** himself if he saw that film where nath does a 180 in a split second and taters a zeke in the face.

No kidding.. One of the possible reasons that no film is posted yet, is that the night he refers to I was flying almost nothing but 152s, which if he had a clue he'd know does no useful unpredictable spins like he describes.  The only spins the 152 does that's unpredictably fast lasts 1-2 seconds at most, during which you're most likely in black or red out.  The other spins are slow and the pilot has 5% chance of landing a shot, 95% chance of being relatively sitting still in a downward tail-centered spin.
You can do a sort of slanted Cobra, but it's pretty hard to hold and time, and you're not flipping around, just hanging there while (with a lot of luck) the other guy overshoots and gets a tater if you manage to recover just right.

Other planes can do very fast reversals, which again if this guy really had a clue, are known all the way back to hblair's nearly instant vertical reverses in the G10... Nath did it in a bunch of planes, Agent does it in the K4..  There's no chance the films he's got show anything special in the 152.  The most extraordinary thing they'll have is some net lag on his end.  Or him running from fights and generaly dogfighting at a soporiphic rythm.. just a hunch based on the few seconds I noticed and recognized his pony that night.

[Adonai]

Animl, I was the 109 your talking about and got you on film, anyhow you were roped, and it wasn't 3 times as you mentioned it was
one time, basically your spitfire tried to climb to up me (in a 109g6) and i went straight up, you tried to follow which i dropped one notch
flaps and was nose down on you when you went to stall out and well lets just say no parts were left.

[Adonai]

Anyhow I didn't want to post on this since it was really stupid to begin with, plus the threats of "I was cheating and I should be banned" comment, either send your so called film to skuzzy or end it thanks.

[moot]

He actualy said that, "cheating and should be banned"?..

[Adonai]

Well when I first read this post I wanted to comment right away, I looked at his score card and realized he's either a shade
trying to get me banned for running my mouth or complete new guy I stayed away from it. I pulled same move I do in a corsair,
I dove down gaining speed to around 400+ and pulled straight up, him and a La7 climbed with me and I got him, Kazaa got
the La7. It wasn't anything special like an "f16" could pull, when I hit about 200 mph I dropped one notch flaps and winged over.
My nose was down on him and he was spraying tryin for a "ho" shot that he already stalled out from.

P.S I edited this post only because i wanted to say more about the "F16" move, but suggest reading the training forums about agent360,
because after reviewing his films you got nailed by the same move, except for me it worked on first try, everytime else NONE. sorry Agent <S>

[Animl]

wanna bet?  I bet we go to the DA and it will bother you how bad I slap you around that arena.

<wild giggle>

1) Chances are it won't bother me since you've been here longer and probably log more hours then me,..and I'm just smart enough to realize that, barely, maybe, it could happen. I've been flying by mouse until 3 weeks ago, I'm now one notch above handing it to you on a silver plater.

2) I wouldn't exactly under estimate me right off the bat. I never claim to be the superior brilliant complete pilot you are,..But, while I'm newish to AH and the FE and learning the interface, don't confuse that with me suddenly going brain dead and forgetting 14 years of ACM. I have a feeling you're gonna work for that kill. But then you wouldn't be my first BBQ either.

For all you're flamboyant ego bursting look-at-me high-heel boasting; (Pretty much  every time we cross paths, frankly because you're an idiot) If I beat you, I guarantee you, I will never ever let you live it down, even if it's the only time ever. Because it would just be that entertaining, that often.

Me, I expect to lose, I have a feeling you hope I do too.

[moot]

Prozac.

[Animl]

Good to see ya back around, Animl!

Agent360  had some great detailed posts,  dedalos and Shane on the 2nd page of this thread summed it up pretty good.......

Animl, find the films, if you want to have any credibility around here, since most think you are some new beginner.....

and anytime ya see me online, Animl, give me a shout and I'll go to the DA  or TA with ya to help you knock all that rust off......

fellow AH'ers  Animl is a Good Fella....he been in flight sims a lot longer than most and probably before 1/2 these players today were born ( joking )...he just been out of play for a good long while......  give him some time to adjust......

( don't forget...... post the films     )

( you would classify Animl,to the likes of Spatula, Dok, Brooke,  Fencer, Murdr, Hammer, Widewing, Badboy, Rolex...etc...... in how he carried himself and how much effort he put into helping the fellow flight sim community....... I think some misdjudged his opening post, and to add he may have exagerated a lil much about certian other game players ......it  all plays  )

TY Sir. <S>
TY for the compliments as well.
>GREAT!< to be back.

This will get cleared up. I have a few post to read, preferably Agent's
But I am going to use this reply to cover a few things. There is no way I will respond to dweebery.

I don't know if getting discoed while recording from sortie to sortie has anything to do with it, but basically 2 days of films seem to be MIA. Call me what you must, only the dweebs and seals would do it anyway. I have no hidden reason to ask about these things.

Which quite frankly the films seem irrelevant at this point as Agent (and others) knows EXACTLY what I am talking about without them. When some *demand* a film to prove what I see exist, even though it's *somewhat* common knowledge to some to exist, (or someone wouldn't be able to explain it like Agent), better yet, 90% of the people asking for the film use the maneuver on a regular basis.

I didn't realize you had to have a film to talk about anything and everything in here. If I were talking to HT or Pyro about it, it would never be without a film. If I thought it were that important or a KNEW for fact something was funky I would NOT have posted here, it would have been a nice silent email fired off with quiet films and names attached directly to HT, Pyro and Skuzzy. Why would I ask robbers if they robbed a bank?

Some, (Moot, Scotch, SkyRock and a few others) in here are trying to take two different situations and mix them into one for the masses, show and attension.

A dogfight and a post. They think I'm posting this because of who won a dogfight. Which is pure ego gone mad dog crazy. I think they are int e habit of harrassing people who give a .... The only thing it has to do with the Muppets is because they are best known to use the moves, yet stand here acting stupid about it. Even if there were no errors in the game, they don't want you to know how to use it on them. <wild giggle> Sad part is SkyRock wasn't even involved in any way. <G> He likes placing himself in the spotlight. <shrug>

*SkyRock*, (and Moot and Scotch) is a PRO at both moves, why doesn't he chime in with anything but fruitless threats to "own" me? I find that a little ironic. Why he (they)  doesn't comment on his favorite moves. You know how they respond when it's brought up to them, "where's the film". Ironic they need a film of themselves from someone else to know what they do all the time. They will talk about anything BUT. Denying it exist openly when you actually use it,.. maybe there's something there>? 


>>>SO that leaves us with, *exactly as you stated*. Is there something in the game itself that does not allow the chaser to see the flip in real time? If not my answer to my question is no.

I understand the flat snap stall (placing chaser as target), what I don't understand is how fast it restores E to do it yet again in the game, within a certain time frame. Is there a flaw in drag and\or stick response?

In the Rope,..If you have enough E and SEE the flip you still have the option to move out of his way. If you don't see it, you will *unknowingly* pose for the HO. Now IF said pile-it knows the chaser won't see him flip in real time, then I would call that a soft bug exploitation to the pile-it's advantage and score, and unduly detrimental to mine.

That said; I'm going to split hairs here...
While it may show up in film that is NO guarantee it will show up in *Real Time*. And I *am* speaking Real Time. A film can *easily* capture what you don't see, *especially* if it has to do with Lag or FPS (unless HT steps in and says I am wrong that's what I believe). I have NO issues with FPS, they scream,... Would I bet on losing a the same packets at the same point of of a specific move over and over? NO< not placing that bet.

I don't care if he can actually do it or not, I care if I can see it happen real time so it's MY decision to move or die, not his.

Now I will view Agents info and films since he's one of the few who responded intelligently.

If I am wrong I am wrong, (not sure how wrong is defined here), but I'm not going to be afraid to ask questions on the BB and be afraid of the attacking seals. <shrug>

Thanks again for the welcome.
<S>

[Rollins]

Now I will view Agents info and films since he's one of the few who responded intelligently.

Thanks again for the welcome.
<S>

Well put.  On the other hand, far be it from me to ever offer up an ACM question here.  Lesson learned.