For you law enforcement supporters

[SteveBailey]

I think the teaching position is more underpaid than cops. If grade and high school teachers were paid higher salaries, I believe we would attract people who would be better educators.  

I'm not knocking my police brethren, their pay is too low.  It's not just the risk of life and limb they must deal with day to day. Many cops also have the psychological stress of dealing with the worst quality of civilization on an almost daily basis. Many of us wouldn't be able to be a cop for long for this reason alone.  To remain stoic and detached from the slime of humanity after seeing the abuse they heap  upon others, including cops, is harder than you might think. There is an pyscholigical price to pay for being a cop as well. I think one must consider this as well when debating whether or not cops are paid commensurately with their job duties.  Mav, Rich, don't you think this is a reasonable assessment?


Steve

[DREDIOCK]

Laz,

I thought insurance companies for roofing contractors have started requiring they mount anchor points to the ridge line

If they are I sure wish they'd leave them there after the job is completed. a few points on he way up wouldn't be a half bad idea either

Someone (like ME) might actually have to go back up there at some point to perform some maintenance on some of these screwball architectural designs.
Sure would be nice to have something to tie off onto rather then having to count on your memory of childhood learned prayers asking for divine intervention to keep one from sliding down the side of a rood then then dropping 40-60 feet down to the ground.

[Elfie]

If they are I sure wish they'd leave them there after the job is completed. a few points on he way up wouldn't be a half bad idea either

On new homes they do leave the anchor points because they can't exactly remove them since they are bolted to the trusses.

[rpm]

I think Lazs is pretty spot on with his comments. I wonder what the number of convenience store workers killed was last year? Most don't make $10.50 a year or get bennies.

[vorticon]

A whole two days? LMAO

remember. not all roofs are created equal
I can show you a few roofs I probably couldnt come up with enough money to pay you to get you to walk on. Let alone work on.

i dont doubt that at all

it was directly in response to that qoute of lazs, nothing more, nothing less, and in regards to shingling the damn things...2 days aint much, but its enough to know the guys putting shingles on a low pitch roof on a hot day aren't suffering a whole lot more than the boys stripping forms off a foundation on that hot day...

i might be convinced to get on a 7/12 pitch...opportunity hasn't arisen yet, and the only two we've done in the past year and a half that were that steep we built on the ground.

[CAP1]

I think the teaching position is more underpaid than cops. If grade and high school teachers were paid higher salaries, I believe we would attract people who would be better educators.  

I'm not knocking my police brethren, their pay is too low. It's not just the risk of life and limb they must deal with day to day. Many cops also have the psychological stress of dealing with the worst quality of civilization on an almost daily basis. Many of us wouldn't be able to be a cop for long for this reason alone. To remain stoic and detached from the slime of humanity after seeing the abuse they heap  upon others, including cops, is harder than you might think. There is an pyscholigical price to pay for being a cop as well. I think one must consider this as well when debating whether or not cops are paid commensurately with their job duties.  Mav, Rich, don't you think this is a reasonable assessment?


Steve

well....i don't think there's really anything wrong with the teachers...although i could be wrong.
I'd say that more of the problem in schools comes from lack of respect from the kids. we all used to be some sort of bad in school, but when a teacher said something, we all did it. now, they cannot do anything. the kids don't listen, and the parents back their kids, rather than teach them any respect. then you have kids attacking teachers in some places....so..the problem there is more parents than kids. i know some teachers make piss poor pay....but some make killer good pay too.

[Elfie]

2 days aint much, but its enough to know the guys putting shingles on a low pitch roof on a hot day aren't suffering a whole lot more than the boys stripping forms off a foundation on that hot day.

It's a whole lot hotter on that roof than it is in the foundation pit. Those boys stripping forms in the foundation pit don't have to worry about falling and breaking their necks either.

[Elfie]

o yea..there's as much chance of that as a skilled roofer falling off of a roof.

All it takes is one misstep for a roofer.....just one. Or to step on a piece of plywood that has the wrong side up w/o noticing it. Yes, there is a wrong side to be up for plywood. One side is rough, the other side is very slick. Step on the slick side and if you don't have a safety harness you will go splat on the ground. I personally almost bit it one time because of that.

You have almost zero chance of that hydraulic lift giving out.

[myelo]

<S!> Roofers

[myelo]

,

[lazs2]

rich..  I am not a roofer.   I have done it in the past for a roof here and there.

I don't know what you get at retirement.   I know that if you are on 3% at 50 it is possible for you to get 90% of your pay at age 50.. that is... a 50 year old man getting 90% of a pretty good salary.   I know that in most cities.. health and safety (cops and fire) get a much better package than every other public employee.

It would be very difficult for me to be a cop...  It is too political.. too military and not enough freedom for me but.. if I was gonna pick a job... cop, late night 7 eleven clerk or roofer.. I would go with the cop every time.   Why get shot for ten bucks an hour tho.. not as a cop or as a clerk.

Police and fire get take all the way up to 80% of a cities general fund.. what would be "fair" to you guys?    90%?   100%?   

Police in small towns don't get compensated too well but.. who does?  what public employee in that town makes more besides the federal ones like postmaster?

If you are a cop you can make 100k a year and 3% at 50 retirement in big cities in a lot of places.   you can choose to work there or in a less dangerous place that pays less.

lazs

[CAP1]

All it takes is one misstep for a roofer.....just one. Or to step on a piece of plywood that has the wrong side up w/o noticing it. Yes, there is a wrong side to be up for plywood. One side is rough, the other side is very slick. Step on the slick side and if you don't have a safety harness you will go splat on the ground. I personally almost bit it one time because of that.

You have almost zero chance of that hydraulic lift giving out.

i'd agree with ya on the above ground lifts....not the 30 year old inground units though.

 that whol rant wasn't aimed at putting roofewrs down though..

[SteveBailey]

well....i don't think there's really anything wrong with the teachers...although i could be wrong.

You are

but some make killer good pay too

not  any grade school or high school teachers you don't, and this is specifically whom I mentioned.

[Maverick]

Steve,

You are correct in regards to some of the BS we had / have to deal with. Everything from simple verbal abuse because we pulled over someone who believes they are entitled to drive any way they want to having to fight for your life when you walk into a situation that you had no prior knowledge about before you got there. There are tons of calls that tell you to expect one thing and it turns out to be something entirely different. Kind of like going to a loud party call and finding out it's a major fight with weapons when you get there.

To date I have yet to see any roofer complain that the roof attacked them, assaulted them, threatened them or sued them. There has yet to be an arrest of a roof for premeditated homicide to my knowledge. I also have not heard of a roof actually stalking or planning an ambush of a roofer. Kind or like apples and pea gravel analogy IMO.

I also haven't seen any roofer going into a burning building to rescue a truss or support beam much less give it CPR.

Laz,

You keep mentioning this mythical 90% pension. Please provide the name of the department. I'd like to contact them and ask about the retirement you are talking about. I've already explained how ours works in AZ. so I am really curious how you can get a retirement that is not capped at a max benefit percentage. So far I have never heard of one that exceeds 75% and that's after 32 years. You might work longer but the retirement percentage does not go up.

[SmokinLoon]

First of all... please keep in mind that ANY law enforcement agency and/or officer is REACTIONARY.  If you rely on the police/sheriff for protection... you are only fooling yourself.  Have on hand on your gun and the other free to dial 911.