Author Topic: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang  (Read 5150 times)

Offline Hornet33

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Re: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang
« Reply #120 on: July 31, 2008, 02:45:58 PM »
You're just along for the ride based on some social dynamics gut feeling Hornet.  .. You mean like 50 M$ and counting?  Where are the hydrinos?

The hydrinos will be in the new prototype plant in Delaware next year. You know an actual working power plant tied to the electrical grid. They are way past the theory on paper stage, they are at 50kw bench test units and scalling up for full production of a commercial unit.

Not some gut feeling here, they have backed up all their claims and theories with real results. The ONLY folks that don't agree with it have nothing but a theory to counter Blacklights physical, documented, and proven results, so who is going with the gut feeling?

Also who do you know in the buisness world who would invest $60 million based solely on someones theory? They wouldn't unless that person had something solid to back it up.
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Offline Bones

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Re: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang
« Reply #121 on: July 31, 2008, 02:53:49 PM »
The investors for the particular Internet appliance put $40M into it based on a theory.  The theory being that people would be happy to allow thier Internet purchasing activities to be watched if they could get a discount on thier purchases.  Course you had to buy the product as well.

$40M was poured into that black hole.

Offline moot

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Re: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang
« Reply #122 on: July 31, 2008, 03:02:17 PM »
No Hornet, why haven't they been seen by a single astronomer? Some guy that can't make sense theoreticaly, and despite this claims to unify pretty much the biggest rift in physics today... will somehow revolutionize everything with an energy process he might not understand himself, and theory that doesn't even make sense?    If I were on flamewarriors.net I'd say you're caught in the same inspiration that's gotten you building your hydroxy booster :P.
Do you really think there's no precedent for incorrect science to get funding?  Even if we recognize that his spectral lines are funky, he doesn't come up with anything to explain them that makes sense.  The best explanation for all this at this point is that Mills is the proverbial pig fumbling onto an acorn.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2008, 03:04:01 PM by moot »
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Offline Hornet33

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Re: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang
« Reply #123 on: July 31, 2008, 03:17:52 PM »
Are we even talking about the same thing?? An astronomer? We're talking sub atomic particals here, so how is an astronomer going to see that? Yeah let me use the hubble to look inside a hydrogen atom. That requires a mass spectrometer which they have used and have documented their results which prove the exsistance of hydrinos and how they are created. It was a partical physicist that works for Blacklight Power that discovered them, and then had his information corroborated by third party studies also documented, not an astronomer with his telescope.

Were did you learn your science? Astronomer.....really???
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Offline Bones

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Re: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang
« Reply #124 on: July 31, 2008, 03:31:30 PM »
I agree it is investor quality data, but I also agree with moot on that there is far too much 'pie in the sky' in that data.  Armed with patents, they should have no problem discussing in detail the discovery and process.  I see a very vague description of both.  At least, vague to me.  I cannot get passed the contridictions as well.

Offline moot

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Re: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang
« Reply #125 on: July 31, 2008, 04:30:17 PM »
Hydrogen spectra in deep space (21cm right?) is from electrons going from higher to lower states, isn't it?  Wouldn't conversions between Mills' particle and regular H radiate differently?  No mass spectrometer needed there.  Where did you learn your science Hornet? Even on earth, why hasn't a single scientist working on H plasma or gas or playing around with particles detected this?    Where have you been hiding under for the last few dozen years to miss all the crackpots attracting tons of investor cash? DId you read the paper I linked to?  Did you see this part?
Quote
Most importantly, we found that CQM does not predict the existence of hydrino states!
or
Quote
Hence CQM lacks important features of quantum mechanics and does not
describe known physics properly.

All I'm sure of is that the guy you're insisting will change the world has been caught making mistakes on the order of fundamental inconsistencies in his math and physics, or of copying others' previous scientific research into his papers word for word.  I'm saying this guy, if he's really discovered something new, doesn't know how to explain it. 

My gut feeling is that Mills is full of poop and is milking his little anomaly (if not hoax).  The trials ought to bear the truth sooner or later, and so far even NASA back in the 90s (when BLP was "HydroCatalysis" ) failed to get the hydrino stuff to work.  My gut feeling is that he's found something funky like the cold fusion people did, and that the phenomenon isn't going to produce anything anywhere near extraordinary or world changing. Not in his hands anyway.

Yep.. I remembered right, here you go Hornet:
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/quantum/h21.html#c1
« Last Edit: July 31, 2008, 05:25:08 PM by moot »
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Offline soda72

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Re: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang
« Reply #126 on: July 31, 2008, 05:52:22 PM »
Tesla production model #6 has crashed...

Well that didn't take long..

http://blog.wired.com/cars/2008/07/worlds-first-fo.html

 :cry

Offline Hornet33

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Re: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang
« Reply #127 on: July 31, 2008, 07:16:54 PM »
Hydrogen spectra in deep space (21cm right?) is from electrons going from higher to lower states, isn't it?  Wouldn't conversions between Mills' particle and regular H radiate differently?  No mass spectrometer needed there.  Where did you learn your science Hornet? Even on earth, why hasn't a single scientist working on H plasma or gas or playing around with particles detected this?    Where have you been hiding under for the last few dozen years to miss all the crackpots attracting tons of investor cash? DId you read the paper I linked to?  Did you see this part?or
All I'm sure of is that the guy you're insisting will change the world has been caught making mistakes on the order of fundamental inconsistencies in his math and physics, or of copying others' previous scientific research into his papers word for word.  I'm saying this guy, if he's really discovered something new, doesn't know how to explain it. 

My gut feeling is that Mills is full of poop and is milking his little anomaly (if not hoax).  The trials ought to bear the truth sooner or later, and so far even NASA back in the 90s (when BLP was "HydroCatalysis" ) failed to get the hydrino stuff to work.  My gut feeling is that he's found something funky like the cold fusion people did, and that the phenomenon isn't going to produce anything anywhere near extraordinary or world changing. Not in his hands anyway.

Yep.. I remembered right, here you go Hornet:
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/quantum/h21.html#c1

And yet again you are baseing everything off of the current accepted theories. Mills has said that what he and his team have found doesn't conform to those theories, yet they have at present a working hydrogen based power cell that once started can sustain itself and by using the heat generated from the reaction to boil water to steam and pipe that through a steam turbine generator and produce 50kw of power out the back end, and that's just the small one in the lab. The design is able to be scalled up for commercial applications and that's what they are doing right now. That's why Delaware Lectric has partnered with them to install the system into one of their power plants this year.

Everyone is trying to shoot the idea down using mathmatical formulas and what not, yet the physical equipement is there and it works just like he said it would. How do you explain that? He's had scientists and engineers come into to look at his design and none of them deny that it works, they just can't explain how.

I don't pretend to understand all the math involved in this because I don't. Partical physics is not my field, but it is theirs. I'm an electronic technician. I deal with hardware and software and I know how to read engineering schematics. I've also been reading alot about hydrogen power systems to learn as much as I can about them. That's how I stumbled across Darklight Power Inc. These guys aren't working out of their garage in their spare time, they are a full time research and engineering firm that has developed a whole new way to generate large amounts electrical power cheaper, and cleaner than anything else on the planet and they have the data to prove it. Not to mention the backing of a bunch of scientists, engineers, and major corporations. They have patents pending on all their equipment, and are preparing to go into full scale production.

So I'll ask you again. HOW can they do that if the damn thing doesn't actually work? If this guy is such an idiot, then how has he fooled the scientists and engineers that have seen his device in operation?
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Offline moot

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Re: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang
« Reply #128 on: July 31, 2008, 08:21:48 PM »
HOW? The same way every other scam went as far as it did.. Remember cold fusion Hornet?  What if the BLP gadget works for some reason other than what Mills pretends?  Don't you think something's amiss when his papers had parts taken verbatim off other papers?  When the theory he pretends explains his extraordinary claims neither makes sense on its own, nor actualy backs up the claims, and isn't even backed up by reality?  When after so many man-hours (people all over the world for this past century at least) not one hydrino was detected in any work with hydrogen, not even in all the vastness of outer space?

And you're buying everything this guy is pitching.  You want to believe.. You're passionate.  I'm seeing all the clues of a big bubble waiting to burst.  Best case scenario, this leads to something like the funky heat in those Pons/Fleischman cold fusion experiments, and we get at least one step closer to making sense of them. But it won't be thanks to theories that don't even make sense.  For all they're worth, his gadget's just doing regular chemistry..  So far Mills ranks right with Michael "solid sun" Mozina
« Last Edit: July 31, 2008, 08:23:45 PM by moot »
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Offline Holden McGroin

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Re: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang
« Reply #129 on: August 01, 2008, 01:58:26 AM »
I do not think you need acres of land.  One of my little projects is generating about 3000W@120V in a 10 square foot area.  However, it is a little different than what is commercially available.

I have not taken any time to calculate how much hydrogen could be produced as I think hydrogen powered cars is something not really practical yet.

I could probably push the output to 4500W with little effort, but it served the purpose I needed at the time.

I know that this is a late response, but here goes anyway...

In the USA, in June, west of the Mississippi, you ban expect 8 to 14 KWhr/M2/day of solar insolation on a 2 axis  tracking plate collector.

Call it 10 KWhr/M2/day...

Call the daylight a very conservative 12 hrs, that means yo can get 1 kw/ sq metre, which is about 10 sq ft.

This means you need to attain 300% efficiency in your solar collector.
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Offline Bones

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Re: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang
« Reply #130 on: August 01, 2008, 06:11:38 AM »
You have made assumptions about the configuration that do not apply Holden.  My calculations are based off a smaller working model of the system.  There is no reason to expect a larger model to not meet what is expected.

If I had access to better tools and materials, it could be more efficient, but I will settle for what it will provide.

Offline Holden McGroin

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Re: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang
« Reply #131 on: August 01, 2008, 06:59:59 AM »
You have made assumptions about the configuration that do not apply Holden.

I got my numbers from http://rredc.nrel.gov/solar/old_data/nsrdb/redbook/atlas/

I made my assumptions based on solar insolation in kilowatt-hours per square meter per day.

This is a physical phenomenon based on the sun and the earth.  Configuration of the system is moot.

http://www.solar4power.com/solar-power-insolation-window.html

The chart in the link above shows the insolation for many US cities.

This shows that your goal of 3kw/10 sq ft is much more than the sun sends us.


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Offline CAP1

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Re: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang
« Reply #132 on: August 01, 2008, 07:31:59 AM »
Tesla production model #6 has crashed...

Well that didn't take long..

http://blog.wired.com/cars/2008/07/worlds-first-fo.html

 :cry

i like how they tried to say it went "unnoticed" because it was quiet.

ya can't hear 1/2 the mileaga masters and imports anyway :rofl :rofl
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Offline Holden McGroin

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Re: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang
« Reply #133 on: August 01, 2008, 07:45:55 AM »
Tesla production model #6 has crashed...

Well that didn't take long..

http://blog.wired.com/cars/2008/07/worlds-first-fo.html

 :cry

one of the first documented automobile fatalities was in 1869

Mary Ward of Ireland was run over by a steam car.
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Offline SageFIN

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Re: Forget the 50 mpg carb; this guy has a 80 mpg Mustang
« Reply #134 on: August 01, 2008, 08:02:46 AM »
That Hydrino theory thing has all the looks of a scam, starting from the name of the company. I'd be very surprised if it doesn't die out in due time.