Author Topic: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(  (Read 10072 times)

Offline humble

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Re: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(
« Reply #150 on: December 08, 2008, 09:26:02 AM »
The logic there is false. Sat morning in the LWA we had a great furball going till somebody sank the carrier. Now no one was trying to take the base and we had a reasonably balanced fight with 10-15 players a side. The carrier was far enough away that the puffy ack didnt ruin the fight but close enough to enable quick turn around time. People sink CV's, take down VH's or FH's all the time with no real purpose beyond ruining someone else's fun. As far as I'm concerned the answer is simple. A tactical arena with no formations, no heavies and limited capturability functions and a strategic arena with the AI set so the moment that the radar ring is tripped waves of AI fighters take off and hordes of AI bombers depart from rear bases to carpet bomb the attackers fields.

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Offline CAP1

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Re: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(
« Reply #151 on: December 08, 2008, 09:28:11 AM »
I agree Snap, I can't understand where the fun is in being one of 5 guys jumping all over a single con ! Its very rare you'll see me chasing a single with a bunch of other guys. If you do its because I was on him first and due to my aim being crap it gives half the arena time to hone in on my target  :D

Some people are wayyyyy to much into either getting there names in lights, or up the scoreboards. If they last long enough, they will learn that the point of the game is "the fight". Whether in the air, on the ground, or taking bases, the "fight" is what should be the main idea. If you're trying to "win the war" FIGHT for it ! don't sneak in a NOE here, then jump over there for another and so on. Don't run away because the first wave didn't get it down, regroup and try again, its the fight that is fun. GVs are the same.... how much fun is it to sit at a spawn and pop off spawning GVs? Find a spot to ambush them in route to their target. It makes it more fun for both side as you look to get them before they find you, and they have the chance to defend themselves and break through. Or are the "great" GVers we have not up to fighting their way through?

personally, if i see 2 or more friendlies chasing a con, i ignore it, unless i'm asked for help.

just like everyone else, i do like to see my name in lights once in awhile, but i don't. i tend to fly till i loose too many parts to remain in flight, especially since i've been stayin in the 38. i flew it almost exclusivley last tour, and although i'd have been better off to bring a little wiggly plane to a couple of the fights i was in, so far this tour, i've stayed in it. gonna die my way to good fighting skills.  :D :aok
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Offline beddog

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Re: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(
« Reply #152 on: December 08, 2008, 10:13:15 AM »
Yup... though I'm finding the boards are barely holding my interest now either.

Your not the only one thinking that pal.  The boards are good for 2 minutes tops.......
:disclaimer: 79% of all my posts are Sarcastic.  It's too much work for me to point out which posts are sarcastic and which aren't, so I'm going to use this signature to reduce overhead and sarcastic post identification time consumption or SPITC for short.

Offline CAP1

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Re: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(
« Reply #153 on: December 08, 2008, 10:16:28 AM »
Your not the only one thinking that pal.  The boards are good for 2 minutes tops.......

but yet, here you both are.  :D
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Offline lowZX14

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Re: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(
« Reply #154 on: December 08, 2008, 10:17:36 AM »
Just a thought:

If one's own enjoyment depends heavily on what other player do, one will have a hard time enjoying this game. We all are just game pieces to each other, but much more unpredictable ones than AI. That is what makes it interesting.

If one concentrates on doing what he enjoys despite of what others do, one may have fun.



:aok Couldn't agree more.

Just the other afternoon, I logged and bootleg and I ended up upping from the same base that we saw had some kind of con coming into it and ended up chasing him down and got him (he didn't mind fighting both of us), then while RTB'ing we spotted a CV just off of the base.  Well, I upped some bombers, bootleg a fighter I think, and I got some hits.  I didn't sink it, but then a major fight ensued.  After only having about 2 or 3 of them there, there were somewhere around 10 to include a few LVT's here and there.  After broadcasting for some help, there ended up being 3 or 4 of us with PDMJ on the ground headed to the town.  It was a great fight, I'd up, get shot down, and come back.  This happened multiple times and it was fun.  The only thing that irked me a little was the fact that when it was 3 or 4 or 5 to 1, I kept getting face shots while trying to outmaneuver which I did for a lot longer than expected.  I never once complained about oh, you guys have 4 or 5 to 1 it's not fair.  No, that doesn't matter.  You know going in that you're probably not going to make it, and if those guys want to team up to take the base, give them a fight and if you lose it, oh well, THIS IS A GAME  Now I understand some of the people playing for a while have their points on the skill level going down.  Well, maybe if some of those folks quit complaining about that and like people have said time and time before, took some of these people under their wing even if they don't ask for it, things may be better.  How about offering help instead of waiting for someone to ask you.  I understand that there are trainers who have their thing and that's great, it's a wonderful tool.  But, some of the guys that complain and say that they help people, have probably never offered help, they just sit back and wait for someone to ask them to bloat their ego up just a little more.  There are way too many people wanting their name in lights, I agree with that.  I also agree that "the fight" is more important than anything.  What Whiskey and lazy said are both right, the Knights in MW usually have the numbers in the afternoons and evenings, but one night the other week when I wasn't tired, I got on in the wee hours of the morning to find that the bish did and were doing the same thing the Knights did earlier that day.  There will come a day when the people that are playing now that hang around for 10 years are upset about how the up and coming players play the game as well, it's going to happen.  Nobody will ever agree in this game on what tactics to use, whether landgrabbing, furballing, GV'ing or whatever is better.  Just like Blauk said if you concentrate on what you enjoy doing, forget what the other guys are and have fun.  There's times when I want to do any one of the aforementioned things, and I go do it and have fun.  Can it be frustrating when the eny is through the roof or there's no hangar to leave from?  Yeah, but you know what, I get over it and find a way around it, I either switch sides which hasn't happened much recently, find another plane, or find another base to leave from.  Someone is always going to HO, Pick, Vulch, spawn camp, sink the CV, drop the hangars, gang, horde, and any other unimaginable blasphemy that can be committed in this game.  The only thing you can do is shake your head and go about your business.  As far as the MW squads being large fish in the small pond and not making it in the LW arenas, I have to disagree.  The squad I'm with now does not get on much besides FSO's, so I'm not saying that it can happen.  I do know that a few of us went into LW the other day and didn't do too bad.  Some of those MW squads would probably do halfway decent, but that's the usual mentality you see and it has been brought up plenty here about people coming over to MW to find out that the guys that are there aren't that bad.  What have I seen coming from LW to MW, a lot more people using different tactics some of them I don't agree with, but I get over it but from the time I spent in LW with another squad a while back, those were the tactics you had to use to survive.  If the fields were not meant to be captured, they would all be outlined in little red boxes or there would be no troops.  If the key is to have mainly air combat, which I'm sure that's the majority as it is now anyway, there wouldn't be VH's at every base.  Ok, I'm done ranting for a little while, just had to get all of it that was saved up from the weekend out of my system.
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Offline WWhiskey

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Re: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(
« Reply #155 on: December 08, 2008, 10:20:00 AM »
so it comes down to landgrabbers vs furballers whiskey?

So many arguments come back to this and the part that always gets me is that landgrabbers grief furballers.  Good furball going?  Forget about it, a griefer will be along shortly.  Furballers don't ruin any landgrabbers fun with maybe the exception when landgrabbers are whining that everyone is wasting their time furballing over FT/TT and their precious bases are all being taken back. 

Seems a little lopsided, huh?


granted this is roughly what it comes down to , but the fuballers have an arena of there own, i go there when i want to furball,
 what arena is for the landgrabbers? my guess is the ones where land can be grabed!

 also i love to defend when the numbers are bad for my side! if i have time i  will get some alt and have a field day, if not i am in a gv waiting for  someone  to get to low and to near , or hiding waiting for the goon, the only way my fun gets ruined, is if they are good at what they do, then i end up in the tower alot!

 to have a furball in any arena still is "fun", granted, and very easy to protect, first you kill ords all around then you fly at a distance ( vulching the planes  coming to your furball is very bad form!) and at a reasonable altitude, then you wait for them to come, if you are winning the furball moves toward the enemy base, if not then it goes toward yours, but it will not be sustained in any of the war, arenas, no one will stay there and continue to get there planes shot out of the sky all day long!
then the furball always ends, after that , then what?
« Last Edit: December 08, 2008, 10:22:20 AM by WWhiskey »
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Offline ink

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Re: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(
« Reply #156 on: December 08, 2008, 10:28:24 AM »
The controlling variable is the ability to mount a defense, regardless of the arena. Now in the MWA you commonly see some significant variation in numbers with the least #'d side at a big disadvantage. More often then not the sides are clustered such that you either are flying at a severe disadvantage or with overwhelming odds. I upped last night and switched to the low side and tried to find a decent fight...

Here is the 1st hop...
http://www.az-dsl.com/snaphook/film78.ahf

and the 2nd...
http://www.az-dsl.com/snaphook/film79.ahf

Now by this time there were at least 6-7 cons, I upped an FM-2 and promptly got ganged...so I logged. To me this is the simple equation, if there is one of me and 5-6 of you then you can either give me a reasonable chance for a fun time or not. If you dont then i'll log...but the truth is that for me and a lot of others we're awful close to just leaving. I've quit 4-5 times or more but when I go this time I wont be coming back...

Hey snap, you should not have logged, you should have upped a better plane for mulltipul con fighting and killed them all... at least tried to... I know what you are saying about the ganging, but that is why I take up the Hurri2c get above the hourde and try to kill them all, even then I most often dont but at least I get my kicks in, and sometimes I do come out alive with 5 or more killz,  I fly solo 95% of the time, and I die to the Gang pretty much every time, but now it has become my goal to be able to fight as many as I can at one time and make it so they have to call for HELP :rofl and yes this has happened. recently I was fighting in LW, and I was having a good night,  the NME knew I was around I got ganged by 3 or 4 killed them all, got picked on the last one, but Know what ? It was so worth it, on my return trip to the NME base where they where taking off, I had two cons who where flying together run away because it was me :lol, they acknowledged that they knew it was me and thats why they did not engage. Now how friggin cool is that.

Look I am just saying there are only so many "vets" in game, we have lost enough as it is and cant afford to loose anymore. It's the "vets" that give you the best fights, its the vets that wont jump on a con engaged allready, Its the Vets that give a <S> win or loose, its the Vets that will let a beat up plane RTB after a great fight, I am not saying that newer players wont do these things, but if they do, it was a "VET" that taught them what not to do!

 Dont give in, dont let them defeat you because if you leave AH, thats just what they are doing. I know its only a "game" whatever no big deal... if you are any thing like me, then you most likely love this "game", so ya it is a big deal, dont quit dude, overcome.

Offline WWhiskey

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Re: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(
« Reply #157 on: December 08, 2008, 10:29:49 AM »
Just a thought:

Do people whine about how AI plays in some other type of offline games? Or do they find ways to beat or pass them?

If one's own enjoyment depends heavily on what other player do, one will have a hard time enjoying this game. We all are just game pieces to each other, but much more unpredictable ones than AI. That is what makes it interesting.

If one concentrates on doing what he enjoys despite of what others do, one may have fun.




 not sure i could have put it any better than that!! :salute
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Offline dedalos

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Re: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(
« Reply #158 on: December 08, 2008, 10:32:16 AM »
Snaphook, before you call it a day and leave AH for good (which I hope doesn't happen) - I have to ask one question: do you always fly solo? If so, are your expectations always to find a fair 1v1 in the arenas?

Nop, on Saturday he was with me for a bit.  SBD and a 110.  It was not all bad.  As long as they were coming in waves of 3 and 4 at the time it was fun.  Then every one disappeared so we headed towards A5.  What happened next is what snap is talking about.  No only we met with 7 guys coming in at the same time but the intent was to take us down at all costs, and I don;t mean by fighting.  What could have been a fun fight ended right away since the first guy to get near me decided that he should fly his spit through my 110 while firing.  Both died and I got the nice ram PM from him lol.  Now imaging you up three times in a row and fly for 10 minutes to meet with that.  That was 30 minutes of your life you will never get back lol
Quote from: 2bighorn on December 15, 2010 at 03:46:18 PM
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Offline CAP1

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Re: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(
« Reply #159 on: December 08, 2008, 10:37:00 AM »
Hey snap, you should not have logged, you should have upped a better plane for mulltipul con fighting and killed them all... at least tried to... I know what you are saying about the ganging, but that is why I take up the Hurri2c get above the hourde and try to kill them all, even then I most often dont but at least I get my kicks in, and sometimes I do come out alive with 5 or more killz,  I fly solo 95% of the time, and I die to the Gang pretty much every time, but now it has become my goal to be able to fight as many as I can at one time and make it so they have to call for HELP :rofl and yes this has happened. recently I was fighting in LW, and I was having a good night,  the NME knew I was around I got ganged by 3 or 4 killed them all, got picked on the last one, but Know what ? It was so worth it, on my return trip to the NME base where they where taking off, I had two cons who where flying together run away because it was me :lol, they acknowledged that they knew it was me and thats why they did not engage. Now how friggin cool is that.on your side, definatly cool. on their side, definitly stupid. how do they expect to get better if they don't fight the guy that's better than them?
 that's why i keep fighting guys in my 38 now....and i KNOW they're better than i am, and i KNOW i should use a different tool for the kinds of fights i get in. i want to be better in the 38 though, and the only way is to fight anything in it.....well, that and lots of advice from the SAPP'rs.


Look I am just saying there are only so many "vets" in game, we have lost enough as it is and cant afford to loose anymore. It's the "vets" that give you the best fights, its the vets that wont jump on a con engaged allready, Its the Vets that give a <S> win or loose, its the Vets that will let a beat up plane RTB after a great fight, I am not saying that newer players wont do these things, but if they do, it was a "VET" that taught them what not to do!

 Dont give in, dont let them defeat you because if you leave AH, thats just what they are doing. I know its only a "game" whatever no big deal... if you are any thing like me, then you most likely love this "game", so ya it is a big deal, dont quit dude, overcome.
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Offline Shuffler

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Re: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(
« Reply #160 on: December 08, 2008, 10:38:33 AM »
Fights were a bit thin yesterday for the most part. I found myself bailing to jump to another field with darbar quite often.
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Offline humble

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Re: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(
« Reply #161 on: December 08, 2008, 10:47:38 AM »
The guys in question are outstanding sticks sometimes. It's not difficult for an excellent stick with an initial advantage to force someone entirely to the defensive. Now in a 1 on 1 I could care less what your in or how much alt/e you have. As long as i have 1500 ft I'm good to go...but in a scenario with multiple cons the one good stick can force your hand. Now put that into a situation where U have 2 or 3 excellent sticks and your cannon fodder for the other 3. Can you up a plane from another base sure...can U up a fast ride and maybe sneak off and then reengage...possibly. But what about just flying out and meeting em in sequence? Thats how it used to work. You could fly out and grab to 2-3K before somebody engaged you...if you won you took on the next guy. As a dar bar developed soon you'd have 2 guys then 3 and a little furball ensued. As attackers died the fight moved toward the middle bewtween the bases.

I flew in the AvA for a bit. The fight ended up centered over midway with almost no time for the allies to up. So you have the double superior zekes with alt & E right over the allied field much of the time. Now for an F4F to have a chance vs a zeke it needs a minimum of 3-4k of air to fight in vertical....and even then its over matched. The SBD can match up much better and is actually a pretty good fight vs the early zeke.

The reality is that this has devolved from an Air Combat sim into something less....



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Offline ink

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Re: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(
« Reply #162 on: December 08, 2008, 10:56:09 AM »
quote from Cap

"on your side, definatly cool. on their side, definitly stupid. how do they expect to get better if they don't fight the guy that's better than them?
 that's why i keep fighting guys in my 38 now....and i KNOW they're better than i am, and i KNOW i should use a different tool for the kinds of fights i get in. i want to be better in the 38 though, and the only way is to fight anything in it.....well, that and lots of advice from the SAPP'rs."

yup that is what I always thought "you gotta fight someone better to get better", you got a great attitude, and I look forward to meating you in the air!

BTW using that 38 is cheating :lol its got two engines  :P

Offline Kostic

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Re: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(
« Reply #163 on: December 08, 2008, 11:02:58 AM »
Nop, on Saturday he was with me for a bit.  SBD and a 110.  It was not all bad.  As long as they were coming in waves of 3 and 4 at the time it was fun.  Then every one disappeared so we headed towards A5.  What happened next is what snap is talking about.  No only we met with 7 guys coming in at the same time but the intent was to take us down at all costs, and I don;t mean by fighting.  What could have been a fun fight ended right away since the first guy to get near me decided that he should fly his spit through my 110 while firing.  Both died and I got the nice ram PM from him lol.  Now imaging you up three times in a row and fly for 10 minutes to meet with that.  That was 30 minutes of your life you will never get back lol

I believe I gave you a couple of fair 1v1 fights on Saturday. I thought there were pretty honorable and fun :aok

Kostic

Offline CAP1

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Re: MWA as bad as any other arena now:(
« Reply #164 on: December 08, 2008, 11:26:24 AM »
I believe I gave you a couple of fair 1v1 fights on Saturday. I thought there were pretty honorable and fun :aok

Kostic

aahh...you DO read these.

sorry bout the pick, the one time i did....i couldn't resist. besides.....you had my countryman surrounded.  :D
ingame 1LTCAP
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